Opponent strength appraise

[Zagryzaec]

How do I tell how strong my opponent is?

I know that theoretically I can get some info from what do they wear, but enemies even in same equipm Mt seems to vastly differ instrengh.

Completely random outcome of attacks doesn't help either.

Is some faction stronger than the other? I've been running from the auxiliaries like a little ♥♥♥♥♥ preferring to fighting orcs after they massacred my first army, but after have to fight some of them I see they aren't stronger than orcs?

How do I even measure my opponent outside of armor? How do I know how likely they are to hit at least theoretically?

Why I can't press right button and see their basic stats? Why there is no danger level or do I miss it?

[Zagryzaec]

I've played rougelike so long that I kinda unlearned to save scam at all. Also it's defeat the purpose of iron man.

I just wish there were more ways to play consciously, because when I see a guy in real life I kinda can get the idea of how strong he is. At least approximately.

I guess I need to create the thread of stupid questions instead of doing them here.

Or I need to go wiki instead.

[Zed]

There is a reason you can see armor and hp bar of enemies but not concrete numbers (it shows "Unharmed" or similar titles instead). Same with "Few", "Some" for enemy count.

[Zagryzaec]

Well the problem mostly is not with determining how good their equipment ism I can see it with my eyes.

The problem is to determine how strong the opponent outside of armor is.

This is a joined problem with rng.

For example if my characters misses 30 hits vs single opponent that mowing them down I have no idea wether he is just lucky or wether he is strong.

Same with damage. Auxiliaries seems to have just a basic knives, but after they one turn decapitated my entire four level squad I considered them strongest opponents in the game, even though people here says they are one of the weakest.

If the game was revolving around armor it would be great but it revolves around hit miss.

[Jean-Maurice Nya]

You can easily check your hit chances with any of your bro to determine how dodgy a lad is, but ability to dodge isn't a metric to see how strong a character is. Now you can easily understand that bringing him down first isn't the wisest choice considering the morale mechanic. As for a character that handle a two handed weapon, you can clearly state that his hits will be tougher than the one with a one handed weapon, even with double grip.
Auxiliaries have crappy weapons, but even crappy weapons do damages to a weak party. That's why positioning is crucial in all encounters. The more your bros are surrounded, the better the chances they'll get hit. It works the same way for you, and that's how you can defeat very dodgy foes more easily.
Pretty much everything can be deducted from the perk tree and merchants: you can know what perks do and you can know what damages can weapons do. You can also guess foes' stats from the log, your hit chances in a 1vs1 situation... The only issue is one's ability to decipher what he reads and understand the implications of what's written. This takes time and experience.

[Zagryzaec]

Well yes theoretically.

I think I also can get a lot from wiki but afraid I also spoil myself on some I do I don't want to know.

Knowing what MY perks do doesn't tell me wether my opponents have those perks. Like what if one of the enemies has maiming perk and other fast adaptation.

I don't even know wether my opponents even HAVE perks like me.

It honestly wouldn't hurt to have this info in game. At least after they use this perk.

[Jean-Maurice Nya]

Last time I've played enemies' perk were written below them when you hover the mouse on them.
Some are hidden but quite intuitive like for frienzed wolves, orc berzeker, sergeant... Fighting all enemies will allow you to deduct their perks.
I doubt it changed as I didn't see any patch, but someone might have a better insight on it.

[Zagryzaec]

Publicado originalmente por Jean-Maurice Nya:

Last time I've played enemies' perk were written below them when you hover the mouse on them.
Some are hidden but quite intuitive like for frienzed wolves, orc berzeker, sergeant... Fighting all enemies will allow you to deduct their perks.
I doubt it changed as I didn't see any patch, but someone might have a better insight on it.

It's mostly just double grip or such.

[Jean-Maurice Nya]

Dodge, nine lives, backstabber... to name those I remember.
There would be no point in term of challenge if everything is displayed. Part of the deal is to guess and learn. Like for roguelikes. In most roguelikes there's even less intel than in this game.

[A5G_Reaper]

Some of the elites got either enemy-only perks (barbarian gangbang rotation, battle flow, devastating strikes) or plain get hidden damage boost (berserkers and warlords). But for most of them their perks overlap with yours, albeit sometimes in ridiculous amount. Some are obvious, some aren't, but evaluating their threat level isn't that difficult regardless - you can get some feel just by fighting them a few times.

[Zagryzaec]

If we talk about rouglikes like slay the spire they usually give great amount of info and the run rarely last longer than an hour.

You also don't randomly lose resourses that you were cultivating for two days.

Iean the game is what it is and I don't demand changes, I just objectively critique it's questionable elements.

Maybe after playing more and reading wiki I will decide that I was wrong and that was a good decision from devs. But I kinda doubtful about it.

[Zagryzaec]

Publicado originalmente por A5G_Reaper:

Some of the elites got either enemy-only perks (barbarian gangbang rotation, battle flow, devastating strikes) or plain get hidden damage boost (berserkers and warlords). But for most of them their perks overlap with yours, albeit sometimes in ridiculous amount. Some are obvious, some aren't, but evaluating their threat level isn't that difficult regardless - you can get some feel just by fighting them a few times.

The problem is - once I have half my company killed by one orc I'm not fighting him again.

[Jean-Maurice Nya]

Yeah, that's why there's a save and reload option that suits well beginners.
Losing is part of the fun, and learning experience. If you don't trust you memory, a pen and a paper are your best friends, like during early ages of gaming.

Slay the spire would be more a roguelite than a roguelike but there's no point entering the semantic of the genre. I advise a games like Tales of Maj'Eyal, Binding of Isaac, FTL, ADOM or Tangledeep for more classical roguelikes.

[Zagryzaec]

Binding of Isaac is already finished, at least the content that existed when i was playing it. FTL also is actively in the play. Finished it a few times. Not with additional content though.

Tales of majeal adom and tangledeep is something I will look into.

[Santo]

Publicado originalmente por Zagryzaec:

I guess I need to create the thread of stupid questions instead of doing them here.

For what is worth, the game is so deep, and some mechanics are so obscure, that no question is stupid. It's also easier to address a list of specific problems.

Mind you, if you haven't seen it, JCSato's guide is fantastic to improve in the game without any hand-holding: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2549815780

[Jean-Maurice Nya]

Of the 5 mentioned, I dearly recommend Tales of Maj'Eyal, very high replayability and a nice variety of challenges through the campaign.

Also, Santo is right, I'm not able to read all mechanics myself. I know enough to play enjoyable Veteran/Veteran Ironman runs. So, struggling at first is expected for any normal brain. See the fighting field as a board wargame, you'll quickly learn how to check the impact of positioning on your odds to win or lose. Then, you'll need to learn the hard way or save and reload the first time you fight schrats, unholds, hexen, alps, lindwurms, noble armies, mercenary bands... There's plenty to frustrate you, saving and reloading is a good way to preserve your nerves as there's no harm for the run if you lose.