Builds for no DLC?

[Hemkinator]

I don't own any of the DLCs. Since every up-to-date build guide I can find takes into account all DLCs, a lot of the builds are impossible for me to utilize, or counter enemies that don't exist in the base game.

I had assumed that it would be better for me to look up older guides from when the game was originally released. However, it looks like balance patches affect certain gameplay aspects (like perks and weapon stats) independent of DLC ownership. Would older builds still be the most efficient, or should I try to adapt new builds to use old gear?

[Heron]

Some of the very popular old builds do no longer work, like adrenaline-indomitable cycling. Significant changes were made to a lot of perks. Balance has shifted quite a bit.

Your best bet is to look up new guides. Everything about perks will apply to your game but you will be lacking certain weapons. Most notably the very popular 2h maces, whips and handgonnes.

Feel free to ask here if you wonder how to get something to work with just the base game content.

[Santo]

Yeah, generally speaking, builds themselves are pretty much the same regardless of the DLC you have -- they don't add new perks, so you might miss some weapon synergies (Cleaver mastery for whip debuffers or Fearsome for handgonners, for instance), but other than that you should be fine.

Another point you should be aware of is that without Blazing Deserts you can't increase your Resolve in the Arena, so you'll need to put some extra RES into your bros. Maybe other players here can help with a list of "tips that don't apply if you don't have the DLC" :P

[The Duck Knight]

You could just try to adapt your own style instead of following guides.
Your best weapon is your own wits, you know?

[turtle225]

Without the dlc, you have less enemies to try to counter for.

One notable thing being that without Barbs and some of the nastier Beasts (not sure if you have Lindwurm or not), the need for high HP Forge is not as prominent. So you can probably get away with lower HP Forge a lot easier than you can with the dlcs.

Things like CS, Executioner, and Fearsome are a smidge worse since you have less enemy factions, meaning that Undead/Ancient Dead constitute a larger% of the total enemy populace than with the dlcs. That being said, Undead/Ancient Dead are still weak factions, so you may want to use these perks anyway to help against Orcs for example.

Without having Barbarian Throwing weapons, Throwing builds are going to be a lot worse. Still useable but a lot worse. Pure Warbow archers were meta back in the day. Xbows will do better against Goblins.

You won't have Whips, so any guides or builds you see referencing this you will have to adapt to not having it. You also won't have Smoke Bombs. Things like Rotation/Footwork will be more enticing for you as you have less control options than with the dlc to save endangered bros. You can't cheese Warlords with Whips, so having Indom tanks to hold them is a good idea.

[suejak]

OMG a whipless world Could be we get a $5 Remove Whip DLC?

[Santo]

You can get my whip from my cold dead hands! Which, if there happens to be a necromancer around, could get quite literal.

[Hemkinator]

Yeah the lack of whip/smoke bomb crowd control and the lack of throwing weapons were two of my main sticking points. Sounds like the main adaptations I'd need to handle those are to use rotation/footwork on everybody like back in the day, and to turn throwing builds into archers.

I'll have to experiment with indom since it's definitely needed but nerfed. Probably will have to use dedicated ubertank bros instead of using it on every heavy front line bro.

Edit: I also noticed some builds nowadays prioritize fatigue less than previously because of all the crowd control. Are those still viable for me or should I stick with high fatigue builds?

(Also it definitely sounds like I should get the whips and throwing weapons WotN dlc next time I get the chance lol)

[Cat®]

You get one handed hammers, you get two handed axes and swords, and then you get the nets; and then you; in the words of the late great Rick May; beat the crap out of every single one of them.

"Them" in this case being undead and orcs. However, broadly speaking you can just wipe DLC-items off your strategy builds and then they serve equally well. Overwhelm is still good on archers, and not so good on crossbows; handgonnes don't exist. All your bois are carrying dogs because there are no trophies.

Quite frankly I envy you a little, when every battle was 12 dogs and raw DPS racing it was quite zen.

[Estieukua]

IDK, I think throwing duelists were always potentially rather strong. There's not a massive difference between barb and regular javelins: 50 max damage (70 from 2 tiles) vs 45 max damage (63 from 2 tiles), and both at 70% ignore (49 vs 44). Sure, the barb ones are impactful on the first hit against a small extra tier of well-armoured enemies, but most enemies you're throwing at have already been hit by something and are more easy to hurt.

I suppose the barb throwing axes are surprisingly a lot more effective against ancient dead than the regular ones, but they get an extra +10 base raw damage, whereas the barb javelins only have +5 to their base raw damage. Brigands, mercenaries and noble house footmen/billmen can all be wrecked by regular javelins, however, and accurate short-range throwing goes as well with Overwhelm (or better) than archery. Plus you always have the option to throw with a shield in the off-hand, if focusing primarily on enemy debuffs.

As for perks, I'm assuming that all perks as they currently are (with all DLCs) will be the same with just the base game (and not the same as they were before any of the DLCs were released). There's a new perk (Relentless) that makes high-initiative builds stronger, and I assume that it'll now be present in the base game. The current Resilient perk used to be called Hold Out and had different effects, and I assume that it'll be present in its current form in the base game.

Legendary locations are likely to be tougher in the base game, because you can't get everyone high on loads of cheap drugs before the fights.

[Anarchist Wolf]

Hope you get to explore and enjoy alot the base game, maybe affter a few hundreds houres consider buying the dlcs , wont regret it

[turtle225]

Originally posted by Hemkinator:

Edit: I also noticed some builds nowadays prioritize fatigue less than previously because of all the crowd control. Are those still viable for me or should I stick with high fatigue builds?

Low Fatigue builds are still very strong without the dlc's and it doesn't really have to do at all with crowd control or not.

A 2-tile reach weapon combined with a good single target 2Hander and Quickhands gives you a lot of damage and versatility for basically no Fatigue demand.

If you want to use extra abilities like Adrenaline, Rotation, Berserk, etc. then you will want a working Fatigue pool, but otherwise you can have almost nothing and still have a decent damage dealer.

These types of builds tend to have more stats in HP and more perks for defense, so they are usually decently bulky.

[Nerdgasm]

Follow your heart. Swing weapons and hit things.