Tips for Two-Handed Builds

[HoroSaga]

I just can't get the hang of using units with two-handed weapons, at least not on the front lines. I use polearms all the time, but they have the safety of a shieldwall in front of them. When I try to move a merc wielding a two-hander onto the front lines, they ineviteably get torn to pieces without the defensive benefit of a shield.

I almost never get the chance to use area attacks, because I almost always end up having friendlies in the way, and if I have to move the two-hander merc beforehand, they don't have enough action points to attack afterwards. And then, on the off chance that I do manage to get off an area attack, the surviving enemies just gang up and tear the poor sod to pieces anyway.

But despite that, I hear people talking about how great their mercs with greatswords, greataxes, or greathammers are. What kind of perks and strategies are required to actually get some use out of these guys?

[Bad Juju]

I havent tried it yet but perhaps XOX where X is spearwall and O is twohander could work well. Spearwalls bunches enemies away from your lines 2 hander steps forward and whacks them...

I have seen recently a party that looked to be all 2 handers is heavy armor. My experience is that without shields on the frontlines 2 handers get taken apart.

[WastedTrojan]

There are a lot of different ways to make them, its all up to preference. In any case you will need the highest melee defense and attack as possible. The most important perks for an Aoe attacker to work are underdog and reach advantage.

Generally just put them in your best armor and helmets and stack melee attack and melee defense. 2 handers can move 1 space and attack in almost any terrain or any terrain if you take pathfinder. Don't put your 2 hander into contact with somebody if he can't attack that same turn.

2 handed axes are more difficult to use than the others because round swing requires him to be alone. They are still good if you just overhead swing because it hits both head and armor. All other 2 handed weapons have AoE attacks that make it easy to only hit enemies. For example on 2 handed swords you can either cleave 3 spaces or you can hit 2 tiles in front of you.

If the enemy is just going to rush you, put your 2 hander up in the front line so when they rush in on turn 1 you can just move up one space and kill it. Otherwise it can better to put 2 handers in the backline to avoid being an arrow sponge.

Before the beta reset, when my old company took on the orc sea of tents I start 2 handed hammers on both flanks, and 2 more off center. 2 Greatswords up front as well. With underdog and reach advantage, berserk and kill frenzy both hammers on the flanks killed like 6-8 orcs each.

[Sendos]

For perks on 2-hand mercs, I recommend starting off with colossus for the very reason you mentioned, because there is quite a lot of trial and error in creating a good character. Gifted helps, then brawny, mastery (sword, axe or hammer depending on what you want), reach, beserker, killing frenzy, battle forged. Other skills to consider are adrenaline, pathfinder, recover and, at least for greataxes, lone wolf.

Look for mercs with stars in melee defence and melee skill. The melee defence is crucial to help scale with reach.

In early game, it is quite difficult to have a 2-hand in frontline, barring polearms. I recommend putting them on the flanks and only engaging against single targets. If there are enemy ranged units, put them behind your frontline shields. This is because their AoE is not as reliable yet, their fatigue may be too low and their melee defence is too low to consider charging in and holding the line. If using greataxe, use it to smash shields. If using warbrand or greatsword, flanking is great because you can go around and use split to clear out a wing without risking your merc too much. When attacking, only attack if you have 6AP to spare when you enter the tile, otherwise just position them 1 tile away from the enemy you wish to attack, assuming they're engaged in combat and can't move without getting hit by ZoC.

By mid game you should have more armor. Keep him on the flanks still unless you're certain that he can take some damage. Watch out for crossbows, hammer users and knife users.


The type of 2-hand weapon is also important. Generally I prefer greatsword, followed closely by hammer, then axe a somewhat distant third place.

The greatsword is great against low-medium armored targets but also decent against high-armored targets. The split skill is particularly useful against striking enemy polearms through enemy shieldwall.

The hammer is great against shields and strong armor, but also good against high init enemies. Hammers inflict a stagger debuff which halves initiative for 2 turns. It does not deal as much HP damage as the greatsword or greataxe.

The greataxe is very tricky to manage. It is basically an all-out, lone wolf, beserker strat weapon. You can't really keep them in the frontline if you want to use their AoE attack because it strikes all 6 tiles around them, so the strat is basically run in alone, lure multiple enemies away from their frontline and hopefully butcher them with your greataxeman. Single high ground tiles usually encourage this play a bit more, but it can be easily countered by maces, hammers, knives, polearms and ranged weapons. Besides that, if you keep them in frontline, then it's just smash shields and skulls. Their unique ability is that they can deal damage to both head and body, so very efficient in destroying armor. If you use an orc beserker greataxe and grab axe mastery, you can deal up to about 62 shield damage, but you'll tire quicker, so recover skill helps.

[Twogun]

what about orc weapons? i had a wildman wield a man splitter in one party-he was absolutely awesome. i never let him operate alone-always had a shield brother next to him.

had similar success witha beserker chain-but not as awesome.

[espritcrafter]

All of my battle brothers (except archers) have the rotation perk. With this, I can walk a soldier in front of him, then rotate them out to get him one space closer. I tend to put them on each side of my line, on the 2nd row. This gives them protection from enemy archers since they are behind shielded soldieres.

I move my line forward within a space of the enemy, then I rotate my two handers forward on each end of my battle line. The edge of the battle lines is where I get most of my AOE swings and overhead strikes in.

When engaging on the edges, I also have one battle brother flanking along his exposed side, just in case the enemy manages to somehow surround him with more than 3 units or he needs to get rotated out. You also need the perk that gives you +4 AP when you kill something. This will allow you to attack up to two times per turn. I usually do an overhead strike to kill an archer behind the enemy and then follow with a swing to hit 3 surrounding enemies.

You two hander candidate needs to have high fatigue, high melee attack, and high melee defense. I like to give all of my fighters the rotate perk, which allows me to position my two hander in the optimal spot or withdraw him if things get too hairy. Biggest weakness is being exposed to enemy archers, so keep him on the second line until you make contact with the enemy line. A few crossbow bolts can quickly debilitate and knock him out of the battle.

I'm running with 5 two handers right now. I usually use 3 per battle, or even five if against ancient undead. Each my two handers have a base of 39-46 melee defense. With colossus they have around 75-90 health. Some of them have the reach advantage perk. They are like powerful battle tanks, and just like battle tanks IRL, they needs proper infantry support or they get wiped out.

They require battle brothers with very high stat points to survive in combat, and thus usually come later in the game. Before even attempting two handers, your first goal should be to get your entire company decently levelled up and make sure to give everyone the rotate perk. Once you start noticing a battle brother with 30+ base melee defense that's able to wear heavy armor and still have 75+ fatigue, then you have your first candidate.

[Sathra]

Pretty much, though I also usually have them carry a 1-hand version of whatever they mastered and a kite shield. Its hefty on the stamina cost, but the flexibility is good. Its actually how I level them.
A good 2-hander is very fun to use. Greatsword + partially surrounded by wolfriders = :D

[Not a Bard]

I'm impressed at the variety of builds. Nice strategies, everyone.

Personally, all my (frontoline) two handers have quick hands. I start with a shield and some one-handed wep, then switch when optimal to attack. Keep the equipment to allow 50-60 stamina and they rarely run out. As switching in a two-handed from a one-hand-and-shield is free with the perk, I can keep their defence up until they're ready to be badasses.

I run a full 6 man kite-shield frontline, two with two-handers at center, two focused on defence next and two split defence/one-hand offence at the sides. So far, the game isn't always a cake walk, but I only lose men to random crazy crits.

My current build has a guy with a greatsword and guy with an orc greataxe, and they tend to dominate the kills.

[daniel.123]

Late game conpany is 4 two handers for damage and three shieldbros to act as line pinners for the rest of the company.

Billhook teamed with a greatsword wielder is a very effective combo

[Not a Bard]

Originally posted by daniel.123:

...
Billhook teamed with a greatsword wielder is a very effective combo

Why are billhooks so popular? I still prefer long axes. They have more damage (maybe less to armor) and they can wreck shields when needed.

[calmnesss13]

Everyone writing a lot of words about 2 handers. I'll be short. To be effective two hander must:
- have high melee attack (around 90)
- be packed in heavy armor (240+ at least, the more the better)
- have at least 25-30 defence
- have following skills: underdog, brawny, weapon spec of use(you run out of stamina quick without it), reach advantage, berserk, killing frenzy, battle forged. For late game recover is quite desirable, but not must

[daniel.123]

Originally posted by Dead Squirrel:

Originally posted by daniel.123:

...
Billhook teamed with a greatsword wielder is a very effective combo

Why are billhooks so popular? I still prefer long axes. They have more damage (maybe less to armor) and they can wreck shields when needed.

The Armour Damage is higher on them. So they act as the softener for the great swrod to cut through the target, particularly if that target is an Orc.

Also Hook can sometimes be useful for draggin opponest into Swing or Split range. Line those pins up and cut them down :)

Longaxe is a great shield buster though

[Bantak Kor]

So far the best 2hander round I've had was in the swamps, there are usually little patches of ground within the swamps and my Axe-guy stood on one of these while everything around him was swamp. Just kept him spinning while everyone else pretty much stood back and enjoyed the show. Anyway usually the spin is rather a reliability than a treat since I can barely use it without hitting my own men. ;)

[mrbunnyban]

Originally posted by Dead Squirrel:

I'm impressed at the variety of builds. Nice strategies, everyone.

Personally, all my (frontoline) two handers have quick hands. I start with a shield and some one-handed wep, then switch when optimal to attack. Keep the equipment to allow 50-60 stamina and they rarely run out. As switching in a two-handed from a one-hand-and-shield is free with the perk, I can keep their defence up until they're ready to be badasses.

I run a full 6 man kite-shield frontline, two with two-handers at center, two focused on defence next and two split defence/one-hand offence at the sides. So far, the game isn't always a cake walk, but I only lose men to random crazy crits.

My current build has a guy with a greatsword and guy with an orc greataxe, and they tend to dominate the kills.

I use quickhands to start with a kite shield as well. The real beauty of quickhands is that the turn after he first pulls out his 2-hander he can quickhand a heater shield to help protect himself again haha. So my 2-handers carry 2 shields.

[HoroSaga]

A lot of very nice tips, folks. Thanks. Some of it probably gets a bit fancier or riskier than I'd like (especially since my usual go-to tactic is the boring but safe "spear wall with crossbows/polearms behind it"), but I definitely like the idea of using quickhands to hot-swap from a shield-loadout to a two-hander once you've maneuvered into position.

I already have quickhands as a mandatory perk on pretty much everyone in my battle line. At the moment I have all my front-liners equipped with shields and either spears or handaxes for spearwalling and shield-bashing respectively, with daggers as their backup for when I want to swarm a target with armor I'd like to steal. Adding a two-handed weapon to the mix is simple enough.

If you're wielding a one-handed weapon and a shield, and you quickhand to a two-handed weapon, does it automatically unequip the shield without costing any extra Action Points?

[whiskeye]

Two handed builds are for high level brothers only, best bet is having heavy armor perks and heaviest armor possible. You also need a lot of stamina for those builds, 100 being the minimum and 120-140 is recommended. Those builds are late-game when you have access to hedge knights or wildmen backgrounds. If you have ~600 armor with perk to damage reduction you can shrug off ranged attacks. My main line consists of two greatswords in centre, sided by orc great axes built in stamina and flanked by great hammers. They chew with ease through late game parties of 20-30 enemies.