Battlefleet Gothic: Armada

Battlefleet Gothic: Armada

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Tram 4 ABR 2016 a las 1:02 a. m.
Necron playstyle discussion
This is for you people that actually knows about their lore and maybe played the TT and since the devs confirmed the space marines to be available sometime after release and an unannounced race (which would be logical to be the old man telling the kids to get off his lawn while wielding gauss flayers) how would the Necron playstyle be? I would think that their ♥♥♥♥ would just be straight up better, firepower, speed, tech (lolz) but their ♥♥♥♥ would be more expensive? and what 4 favours do you think they would have, I would think it would be 4 different dynasties/overlords if it would be the Newcrons like Trazyn the infinite, ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥/Imotekh, The Silent King and a last one

And yes the necrons are my favorite race in the 40K verse (But I still miss my Oldcrons :steamsad: )
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Mostrando 121-135 de 150 comentarios
Daliena 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:07 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Jasan Quinn:
Publicado originalmente por AngryCats:
I really hope the FTL is still cannon, I mean GW screwed up everything else with crons, but they have mess up the fleet too? Gahh! I hope they didn't O_o
It's not canon. The "Space Egyptian" Codex explicitly states their ships have no FTL capability, hence why they use Dolmen Gates to move troops around, or failing that just launch tombships full of Necrons out into the stars. Since they're functionally immortal, having to wait three hundred years to get wherever they were aimed isn't an issue for them.

So what about the World Engine? Gonna tell me that thing fit into a 'Dolmen Gate'? Or that it took hundreds of years for the Imperium to muster the forces they sent to stop it and meanwhile they just watched it burn world after world to ash over centuries?

Except I'm pretty sure it didn't. It appeared in 926 M41 and the last planet it destroyed, Safehold, was scoured of life in.. 926 M41. And a map of it's known route shows it crossing several subsectors' worth of space in that time.
AngryCats 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:08 a. m. 
Sounds like GW needs to spend more effort keeping their Necron lore consistant
Tram 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:11 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Jasan Quinn:
Publicado originalmente por TarmSpräckarn:
please give me links to these facts of the C'tan being dead even though they are all shards except for the void dragon, same for their fleet and the FTL part please I'd really like to know because from what I've seen its the bloody opposite and all that is still canon.
Read the Codex? This stuff was established back in 5th.

Since that's the Codex I have access to, I'll even give you page numbers. You can probably find a copy to check yourself if you need to.

Page 7 - Silent King's Betrayal: confirms C'tan are destroyed and trapped in shards. ALL C'tan. Completely contradicts previously established lore of their being four intact C'tan running around, replacing it with the shard lore (some of which believe they are whole and/or in control of the Necrons, but the lore is clear; none are whole, all are enslaved).

Page 8 - Dolmen Gates: confirms Necrons now have no FTL capability and need "stasis ships" to travel between worlds, "effectively dooming them to isolation". In other words, it's impossible for them to reach another star system in a single lifetime.

This was all established in 2011.
Well if thats the case then please contact the wikia about that since it actually talks about their fleet and the inertialess drive as if they still have it and have no problem going around, considering it probably uses more than just the 5th codex.
Daliena 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:13 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por TarmSpräckarn:
Publicado originalmente por Jasan Quinn:
Read the Codex? This stuff was established back in 5th.

Since that's the Codex I have access to, I'll even give you page numbers. You can probably find a copy to check yourself if you need to.

Page 7 - Silent King's Betrayal: confirms C'tan are destroyed and trapped in shards. ALL C'tan. Completely contradicts previously established lore of their being four intact C'tan running around, replacing it with the shard lore (some of which believe they are whole and/or in control of the Necrons, but the lore is clear; none are whole, all are enslaved).

Page 8 - Dolmen Gates: confirms Necrons now have no FTL capability and need "stasis ships" to travel between worlds, "effectively dooming them to isolation". In other words, it's impossible for them to reach another star system in a single lifetime.

This was all established in 2011.
Well if thats the case then please contact the wikia about that since it actually talks about their fleet and the inertialess drive as if they still have it and have no problem going around, considering it probably uses more than just the 5th codex.

Fun fact: Sources on the World Engine page include: Codex: Necrons (5th Edition), pg. 26

Anyone got this tome of eldritch lore and can tell us what it says there?
AngryCats 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:15 a. m. 
I need to read the 7th ed book, see what fluff it has. Maybe that might shed some light on whether the crons got a fast fleet again or not
Última edición por AngryCats; 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:15 a. m.
Jasan Quinn 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:16 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Daliena:
So what about the World Engine? Gonna tell me that thing fit into a 'Dolmen Gate'? Or that it took hundreds of years for the Imperium to muster the forces they sent to stop it and meanwhile they just watched it burn world after world to ash over centuries?

Except I'm pretty sure it didn't. It appeared in 926 M41 and the last planet it destroyed, Safehold, was scoured of life in.. 926 M41. And a map of it's known route shows it crossing several subsectors' worth of space in that time.
You've heard of Comorragh, right? That's in the Webway. It's the biggest fleet yard the Eldar ever built, and that was before it became the "homeworld" of the Dark Eldar.

Pretty sure at least one Craftworld is either in the Webway or has passed through it.

So yes, it is POSSIBLE the Dolmen Gates could house a worldship. Or it could just be a mistake on the writer's part, like how that one moronic author thought Spess Mehrens use multilasers in Terminator squads, or how one Codex claimed the Damocles Crusade was called off due to Hive Fleet KRAKEN, rather than Behemoth.

In any case, it's not just one line that supports the "no FTL" theory. Again, 5th Edition Codex, page 17 - Stasis Docks of Seidon. A major Necron port that launches stasis ships. Even with the Tau, whose FTL is/was pathetic compared to the other races, FTL jumps would take a few years at most - hardly worth putting people into cryosleep over. But again, the stasis theme.

The World Engine is the inconsistency here, not the lack of FTL.
Daliena 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:18 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Jasan Quinn:
Publicado originalmente por Daliena:
So what about the World Engine? Gonna tell me that thing fit into a 'Dolmen Gate'? Or that it took hundreds of years for the Imperium to muster the forces they sent to stop it and meanwhile they just watched it burn world after world to ash over centuries?

Except I'm pretty sure it didn't. It appeared in 926 M41 and the last planet it destroyed, Safehold, was scoured of life in.. 926 M41. And a map of it's known route shows it crossing several subsectors' worth of space in that time.
You've heard of Comorragh, right? That's in the Webway. It's the biggest fleet yard the Eldar ever built, and that was before it became the "homeworld" of the Dark Eldar.

Pretty sure at least one Craftworld is either in the Webway or has passed through it.

So yes, it is POSSIBLE the Dolmen Gates could house a worldship. Or it could just be a mistake on the writer's part, like how that one moronic author thought Spess Mehrens use multilasers in Terminator squads, or how one Codex claimed the Damocles Crusade was called off due to Hive Fleet KRAKEN, rather than Behemoth.

In any case, it's not just one line that supports the "no FTL" theory. Again, 5th Edition Codex, page 17 - Stasis Docks of Seidon. A major Necron port that launches stasis ships. Even with the Tau, whose FTL is/was pathetic compared to the other races, FTL jumps would take a few years at most - hardly worth putting people into cryosleep over. But again, the stasis theme.

The World Engine is the inconsistency here, not the lack of FTL.

Codex: Blood Angels (5th Edition), pg. 16
Codex: Grey Knights (5th Edition), pg. 38
Codex: Necrons (5th Edition), pg. 26
Codex: Space Marines (5th Edition), pp. 44-45, 49, 74
The World Engine (Novel) by Ben Counter
Crossed Swords (Novella) by Ben Counter

So.. ALL of these are wrong? Four codices and one novel writer.
Jasan Quinn 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:35 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Daliena:
Codex: Blood Angels (5th Edition), pg. 16
Codex: Grey Knights (5th Edition), pg. 38
Codex: Necrons (5th Edition), pg. 26
Codex: Space Marines (5th Edition), pp. 44-45, 49, 74
The World Engine (Novel) by Ben Counter
Crossed Swords (Novella) by Ben Counter

So.. ALL of these are wrong? Four codices and one novel writer.



Blood Angels mentions the World Engine without giving any indication of whether it has FTL or not.

Codex: Necrons - This could be interpreted that the WORLD ENGINE is FTL capable. That is not proof that the Necron fleet is. To provide a similar argument; the Activated Blackstone Fortresses appear FTL capable. Does that mean all of them are, even the deactivated ones? Does it mean all space stations are? Or does it just mean that the Activated Fortresses are?

Codex: Space Marines "World Engine": Does not actually specify the ship was FTL capable. It wipes out two worlds that, by their names, are almost certainly in the same star system. Does not contradict my point. It's entirely possible the World Engine was adrift in the void for a hundred thousand years, or however long it was since the Necrons went to sleep.

Page 49 seems to disagree on which system the World Engine engagement took place on.

I don't see anything about Necrons on page 74.

Not got the GK Codex to hand. Can I just assume it's the World Engine again?


I can't speak for the novels because I've not read them. But do they specify ALL Necron ships have FTL capability, or just the World Engine?


Do you understand the issue yet? The Codex makes it EXPLICIT that the Necron Fleet is NOT FTL capable. You are bringing up one (destroyed) super-weapon tthat MIGHT have been FTL capable and using it as an argument in support of the rest of the fleet being FTL capable.
Daliena 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:40 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Jasan Quinn:
Publicado originalmente por Daliena:
Codex: Blood Angels (5th Edition), pg. 16
Codex: Grey Knights (5th Edition), pg. 38
Codex: Necrons (5th Edition), pg. 26
Codex: Space Marines (5th Edition), pp. 44-45, 49, 74
The World Engine (Novel) by Ben Counter
Crossed Swords (Novella) by Ben Counter

So.. ALL of these are wrong? Four codices and one novel writer.

Codex: Necrons - This could be interpreted that the WORLD ENGINE is FTL capable. That is not proof that the Necron fleet is. To provide a similar argument; the Activated Blackstone Fortresses appear FTL capable. Does that mean all of them are, even the deactivated ones? Does it mean all space stations are? Or does it just mean that the Activated Fortresses are?

Codex: Space Marines "World Engine": Does not actually specify the ship was FTL capable. It wipes out two worlds that, by their names, are almost certainly in the same star system. Does not contradict my point. It's entirely possible the World Engine was adrift in the void for a hundred thousand years, or however long it was since the Necrons went to sleep.

http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/a/a6/Vidar_Sector_Necron_World_Engine.png/revision/latest?cb=20150101031510

Now do I need to get into how pathetic it is to try and use "Oh, is a deactivated space station FTL-capable?" as an argument? By definition, being INACTIVE, it would not be capable of such.

The World Engine also wiped out at the very least three worlds. Gaios Prime and Gaios Tertio, which we can assume were indeed in the same system, and also Safehold.. Which judging by that map I'm going to go ahead and say was not.
Jasan Quinn 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:41 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por AngryCats:
I need to read the 7th ed book, see what fluff it has. Maybe that might shed some light on whether the crons got a fast fleet again or not
That'd be great. Just please, as I've pointed out above, try to make a note of what is being referred to. Is it speaking in general terms, or about specific things? If in doubt, fair use allows you to quote small sections of the background.
Paladin 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:42 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por TarmSpräckarn:
This is for you people that actually knows about their lore and maybe played the TT and since the devs confirmed the space marines to be available sometime after release and an unannounced race (which would be logical to be the old man telling the kids to get off his lawn while wielding gauss flayers) how would the Necron playstyle be? I would think that their ♥♥♥♥ would just be straight up better, firepower, speed, tech (lolz) but their ♥♥♥♥ would be more expensive? and what 4 favours do you think they would have, I would think it would be 4 different dynasties/overlords if it would be the Newcrons like Trazyn the infinite, ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥tep/Imotekh, The Silent King and a last one

And yes the necrons are my favorite race in the 40K verse (But I still miss my Oldcrons :steamsad: )

In the CTT, Necron were so rdiculously OP that the they literally killed the game. All semblance of competition ended, and they literally became the "I win button".

Necron were supposed to be the most powerful race in the game. They're most resiliant, and exceedingly powerful. Their tomb ship is extremely tough, and very powerful. Likewise, their escorts are very fast and powerful. It's a horrifyingly effective combination of ships.

On the defense, their standard armor wasn't much better than imperial guard, enjoying a 4+ armor save. However, when they went into a "brace for impact" state, they would go into reduce into a 2+ armor save... but cut their firepower in half.

On the offense, they used lightning web arrays that would split their firepower across all three arcs in front of them. These had bonuses to hit, and did some hefty damage if the necron really wanted. However, if the necron overloaded too much energy into one side of the ship in a turn, it could not do so again the next.

How to fight them:
Defeating necron was a mind game. Sheer numbers just didn't cut it. I've competitively launched dozens of bombers firing hundreds of bombs at a tomb ship, and watched it emerge unscathed. It could literally take a shot from Abadon's "Planet Killer" and laugh it off. If they go into "Brace for Impact", they're practically invulnerable.

What works? Destroying them slowly. Using smaller escort wings and waves, put in your damage where you can and until you force your opponent to either lose a ship, or choose to go brace and lose half his firepower. Once he braces, you just move onto the next ship and ignore it until the brace effect goes away. Try to get him to brace every ship, and you have a CHANCE to survive to the next round.

So please, devs... if you actually plan on putting Necron in... NERF THEM.
Última edición por Paladin; 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:43 a. m.
Jasan Quinn 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:44 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Daliena:
The World Engine also wiped out at the very least three worlds. Gaios Prime and Gaios Tertio, which we can assume were indeed in the same system, and also Safehold.. Which judging by that map I'm going to go ahead and say was not.
Congratulations. You've proven the WORLD ENGINE is FTL capable. You've not proven the FLEET is FTL capable, and the references to stasis ships, etc. makes it pretty damn clear the Necrons don't have FTL.

You cannot extrapolate the capabilities of the entire race's technology from a single, now lost superweapon. Unique stuff in 40K tends to have abilities above and beyond the norm.

So, given that you've got one specific Death Star that can move between systems, and the rest of the lore is talking about generic ships that can't, I'm still on the side that they don't have FTL.
Daliena 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:44 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Paladin:
Publicado originalmente por TarmSpräckarn:
This is for you people that actually knows about their lore and maybe played the TT and since the devs confirmed the space marines to be available sometime after release and an unannounced race (which would be logical to be the old man telling the kids to get off his lawn while wielding gauss flayers) how would the Necron playstyle be? I would think that their ♥♥♥♥ would just be straight up better, firepower, speed, tech (lolz) but their ♥♥♥♥ would be more expensive? and what 4 favours do you think they would have, I would think it would be 4 different dynasties/overlords if it would be the Newcrons like Trazyn the infinite, ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥tep/Imotekh, The Silent King and a last one

And yes the necrons are my favorite race in the 40K verse (But I still miss my Oldcrons :steamsad: )

In the CTT, Necron were so rdiculously OP that the they literally killed the game. All semblance of competition ended, and they literally became the "I win button".

Necron were supposed to be the most powerful race in the game. They're most resiliant, and exceedingly powerful. Their tomb ship is extremely tough, and very powerful. Likewise, their escorts are very fast and powerful. It's a horrifyingly effective combination of ships.

On the defense, their standard armor wasn't much better than imperial guard, enjoying a 4+ armor save. However, when they went into a "brace for impact" state, they would go into reduce into a 2+ armor save... but cut their firepower in half.

On the offense, they used lightning web arrays that would split their firepower across all three arcs in front of them. These had bonuses to hit, and did some hefty damage if the necron really wanted. However, if the necron overloaded too much energy into one side of the ship in a turn, it could not do so again the next.

How to fight them:
Defeating necron was a mind game. Sheer numbers just didn't cut it. I've competitively launched dozens of bombers firing hundreds of bombs at a tomb ship, and watched it emerge unscathed. It could literally take a shot from Abadon's "Planet Killer" and laugh it off. If they go into "Brace for Impact", they're practically invulnerable.

What works? Destroying them slowly. Using smaller escort wings and waves, put in your damage where you can and until you force your opponent to either lose a ship, or choose to go brace and lose half his firepower. Once he braces, you just move onto the next ship and ignore it until the brace effect goes away. Try to get him to brace every ship, and you have a CHANCE to survive to the next round.

So please, devs... if you actually plan on putting Necron in... NERF THEM.

This right here. Gigantic point costs, weaker ships in the name of balance or preferably some combination thereof so that their ships are still stronger than the other factions', but cost more and aren't completely overpowered.
Tram 10 ABR 2016 a las 7:53 a. m. 
Well if they dont have their Inertialess drives any longer then how come this happend http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Zarathusa hit Ctrl F and just search on the Inertialess drive and there it says "inertialess drives of the necron's Tomb Ships easily outrunning the shockwave" this is with the Dynasties that came with the 5th codex so I guess their Tomb ships dont have that huh?
Paladin 10 ABR 2016 a las 8:05 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por TarmSpräckarn:
Well if they dont have their Inertialess drives any longer then how come this happend http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Zarathusa hit Ctrl F and just search on the Inertialess drive and there it says "inertialess drives of the necron's Tomb Ships easily outrunning the shockwave" this is with the Dynasties that came with the 5th codex so I guess their Tomb ships dont have that huh?

"INERTIALESS DRIVE

Necron drives are capable of interstellar travel without the need to enter the Warp. The drive is fired whenever All Ahead Full orders are issued; instead of obeying the normal rules for this order the ship gains D6 x 10cm additional movement and can make it travels."

So if they wanted, they could lug their armored arses across the tabletop, and turn exceedingly quickly with the luck if the dice. With max rolls, the necrons could force themselves to be faster than eldar, cover the entire battlefield in just two turns. Made for the fastest cruiser clashes ever...
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Publicado el: 4 ABR 2016 a las 1:02 a. m.
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