Space Marines? Really?

[Habloc]

Ok so just to get it out of the way im not talking about balance. I dont mean to say any faction is op or ♥♥♥♥♥ i just want to discuss lore and the roles they fill. If i get something wrong please feel to correct me :)

Now here is my issue, how do you differentiate the playstyles and still make it feel accurate to the lore? I would be fine if Orks had heavily armed and armored prows and were supposed to come head on in a ram and board, whereas the Imps would want to pull up parallel and unleash a macro cannon broadside. However, of the two "races" coming in the dlc one of them is confirmed to be space marines. First of all, Wtf??? Why? Theyre already in the game as a favour for the Imps. Sure there are going to be two new factions but i mean come on, Tyranids, Necrons, Tau, Dark eldar, there are so many cool and diverse races and you pick the guys imperial ships are loaded with in the first place. Thats not even the bad part, maybe Ill be shocked by your creativity and genius but i seriously doubt the space marines wont feel way too samey compared to the orks and imperials. The space marines really have to be the best at boarding. I mean lets be honest they are some of the most badass, terrifying, skilled warriors in the galaxy. But then what do the Orks do. Do they take the brawler role instead of the Imps? that might work strictly for gameplay but i utterly reject the idea an ork ship wins a broadside trade with an imperial macro battery. Balance debates aside, the eldar do not play like any other race. The chaos dont play like any other race. Give us something like the tyranids and tau. Maybe the tau become the jack of all trades (reflecting their emphasis on unifying different races and cultures) and the imperials start seeing more of a brawler role while at the same time being succeptible to ork rams and boarding. Imagine how cool seing these giant living tyranid host ships lumbering through space could be. What if they had some weird cool strike craft in the form of a swarm of bugs but lacked cannons and firepower in general. Maybe im completely wrong but id love to here your thoughts on the matter. Im interested to see what the community thinks of the space marines being their own fleet.

[Big Boom Boom]

Do you play table top game?

The Space Marine can't be the best boarding faction, lore wise. They are at best 1000 strong (some chapters are exception) and those ships are crewed by 8000-10000+ crews. Not to mention Chaos lore wise ships are full of Daemons.

[Wintermute]

Originally posted by Big Boom Boom:

Do you play table top game?

The Space Marine can't be the best boarding faction, lore wise. They are at best 1000 strong (some chapters are exception) and those ships are crewed by 8000-10000+ crews. Not to mention Chaos lore wise ships are full of Daemons.

Yet marines are extremely tactical (well, supposed to be). When those guys go after generator - it most likely will go down. Not like they need to kill every living thing aboard. Unless they are Blood angels, of course

[Warlord]

I'd rather see them before dark space elves, tau, or necrons.

Space Marines are the most iconic thing in Warhammer 40k. Having a 40k game without them is heresy.

[Kadaeux]

Originally posted by Big Boom Boom:

Do you play table top game?

The Space Marine can't be the best boarding faction, lore wise. They are at best 1000 strong (some chapters are exception) and those ships are crewed by 8000-10000+ crews. Not to mention Chaos lore wise ships are full of Daemons.

Lorewise the Adeptus Astartes are the best boarders period. Boarding Parties are not "kill the crew, capture the ship" they're "Board, blow these critical systems, bug out."

[Habloc]

Originally posted by Warlord:

I'd rather see them before dark space elves, tau, or necrons.

Space Marines are the most iconic thing in Warhammer 40k. Having a 40k game without them is heresy.

I agree, so did the devs thats why the imperial navy is the main faction. Theyre space marines not the space army. all these ships are loaded with space marines, thats why you can even choose a specialization for them in the form of the adeptus astardes favour. I also think having the tau be the jack of all trades would let the imperials really showcase their broadsides and raw firepower

[ColdWonder]

But then what do the Orks do. Do they take the brawler role instead of the Imps? that might work strictly for gameplay but i utterly reject the idea an ork ship wins a broadside trade with an imperial macro battery

Your not gunna like this but err I suggest we broadside battle :D

[Harukage]

Because this is not Wh40k game, it is Battelfleet Gothic game. If you do not feel the differense - do not even try to respond. Imperial Navy ARE the main faction of Battlefleet Gothic game, as well as the main spacefaring faction of the imperium.
Space marines have fleets, yes, but they are tiny, lack a lot of heavy ships, and not realy outfited with many powerfull guns. Their real pros are good boarding capability, boarding torps, and Thunderhawks that are a hybrids of bomber/assault boats in gameplay terms. So their only real tactic is to bumrush, bomb and board the ♥♥♥♥ out of enemy.

[Anguloke]

Yeah bad choice as initial new fleet IMO. Given the similarities to Imperial Navy. Would have been better to go with Tau, Tyranid, or Necron.

[Panfilo]

My concern is they will utterly out class Orks in every way.

-Good armor all around makes them more resistant to bombers.

-Versatile strike craft

-Strong short range weapons

-Good morale, troop ratings

[Wintermute]

Originally posted by jerjare:

My concern is they will utterly out class Orks in every way.

-Good armor all around makes them more resistant to bombers.

-Versatile strike craft

-Strong short range weapons

-Good morale, troop ratings

Let's hope devs will at least attempt to balance it not based on lore

[Harukage]

SM ships are also very expensive where ork ships are rather cheap. As well as lack long range solutions. That is your balance.

[Wintermute]

Originally posted by Harukage:

Because this is not Wh40k game, it is Battelfleet Gothic game. If you do not feel the differense - do not even try to respond. Imperial Navy ARE the main faction of Battlefleet Gothic game, as well as the main spacefaring faction of the imperium.
Space marines have fleets, yes, but they are tiny, lack a lot of heavy ships, and not realy outfited with many powerfull guns. Their real pros are good boarding capability, boarding torps, and Thunderhawks that are a hybrids of bomber/assault boats in gameplay terms. So their only real tactic is to bumrush, bomb and board the ♥♥♥♥ out of enemy.

Yea, sorry to break it on you, but this is Wh40k game. And SM chapters vary a lot from one another, to the point when Space Wolfs are still formed as legion. Some SM chapters are completely fleet-based. Hell, there are Black Templars in their never-ending crusade against everything that moves. Do you think they don't have a proper fleet? Lol.

[Habloc]

Originally posted by Harukage:

Because this is not Wh40k game, it is Battelfleet Gothic game. If you do not feel the differense - do not even try to respond. Imperial Navy ARE the main faction of Battlefleet Gothic game, as well as the main spacefaring faction of the imperium.
Space marines have fleets, yes, but they are tiny, lack a lot of heavy ships, and not realy outfited with many powerfull guns. Their real pros are good boarding capability, boarding torps, and Thunderhawks that are a hybrids of bomber/assault boats in gameplay terms. So their only real tactic is to bumrush, bomb and board the ♥♥♥♥ out of enemy.

Who is that directed at? I assume at me because you didnt quote anyone. What exactly is your point? No ones saying the space marines dont have ships, I and people like Anguloke who agree with me were simply saying its kind of underwhelming to differntiate between space marines operating their own ships and space marines operating as the fighting force on imperial navy ships and attempt to make two different factions. they most likely would render orks boarding ability useless (as adeptus astardes favour is already the counter to boarding) or they would feel like a smaller imperial navy.

[Maye]

Originally posted by jerjare:

My concern is they will utterly out class Orks in every way.

-Good armor all around makes them more resistant to bombers.

-Versatile strike craft

-Strong short range weapons

-Good morale, troop ratings

And if you look at the rule book, the space marines ships cost way more than orks junk ships. This diference will be really important, and since the meta ig just ignore armor, being well armored for a high cost is not really a good point.

[Habloc]

Originally posted by Wintermute:

Originally posted by jerjare:

My concern is they will utterly out class Orks in every way.

-Good armor all around makes them more resistant to bombers.

-Versatile strike craft

-Strong short range weapons

-Good morale, troop ratings

Let's hope devs will at least attempt to balance it not based on lore

I agree but it breaks immersion for me to see something go against the lore too sharply