Up-to-date build recommendations and other questions

[Hejtan]

So, a lot of the information on the internet isn't up to date. For example, many melee builds depend on Duelist, despite it apperantly working only with single weapon and other hand free. Or, how you can't stack all the buffs the way it used to be possible. I'm sure there is more that I don't know about as well.

As such, I thought I would ask you for a more... updated recommendations. You don't have to answer every single question I have, so don't stop yourself from answering only few of them if you don't know the answers for the rest. Now, in no particular order:

1. How would you make a ranged dps Fatebinder that uses magic only for stuff like buffs, not for Fireballs and Rime Spikes? And would it stand any chance when compared to pure mage dps?

2. How would you build Sirin, Kill-in-Shadows, Verse? Also, is there a problem with making other characters into tanks with Kill-in-Shadows in team (such as AI always targetting her, or something)?

3. For weapon using and unarmed Fatebinder, are the Imbue talents from Mage tree worth investing into, or are the more martial talents better?

4. Should every Fatebinder train Lore on every level, or is it sometimes better to train something else?

5. Should I train Lore for Verse, Barik, Kill-in-Shadows, Sirin?

6. How much Lore, Subfertuge and Athletics do you want at start on Fatebinder to have him/her capable of making every single check in the game?

7. Are shields good, or useless?

8. What are the best ways to make Fatebinder a great tank, both on lower and higher difficulties?

9. Are Artefacts useful, or do normal items overshadow them? Which ones are worth particular attention?

10. What are the best Sigils for dps mages? Fire, frost, force, maybe atrophy? Distant Impact, Channeled Force, Chaotic Descent?

[LHGreen]

Ugh, that's a lot. Well, okay, here we go.

1. You generally wouldn't. You're gonna want magic to be involved in pretty much everything you do, because magic is king in this game. But if you wanted to do a low/no magic build for your character/party, I dunno, I haven't wanted to do that.

2. Sirin is exactly what she seems, a bard/mage character, and you should probably build her as such. The other two are very interesting, though. See, Verse is actually the best tank in the game, up to and including the Fatebinder. She simply doesn't get hit, and can usually withstand the one or two hits she does take, not to mention that all the light armor you'll be equipping her with is supposedly bait to the AI. If there's someone you don't want the AI targeting, deck them out in heavy armor, as that's apparently a deterrent, although I think they do still prioritize spellcasters (and rightly so). Verse's only flaw as a tank is that she doesn't have an AoE taunt talent, only a single-target taunt, so you'll have to supplement it with the Taunting Jest spell, which requires the sigil of emotion, and you can't get that until the beginning of act 2 at the very earliest, depending on conquest decisions. But other than that, she's stunningly effective.

You'd think she'd be the rogue character, but no. That's actually Kills. Kills is also a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ cannon, your most damaging, heavy-hitting character by far, and I suspect is the main reason why enemies in PotD are so damn OP. But she's also your stealth specialist (as in, she's the only party member other than the Fatebinder who has talents in her talent trees that specifically deal with stealth, something which is conspicuously absent in Verse's trees), and when you need one of your characters to sneak into a group of unsuspecting enemies to take out the one you think will cause you the most trouble in a single mighty blow, then hold the rest of them off until everyone else can get there and back her up, Kills is your Beastman. Given that, her inability to wear any armor perhaps makes a little more sense, mechanics-wise.

3. No. Not in my opinion, anyway. Unless you're playing on PotD, or willing to spend a LOT of time, energy, and rings to game the system, you're not gonna get above level 20-something, because of a soft (but still possible-to-circumvent) level-cap, so you need to consider your tech tree carefully. You should only focus on two or MAYBE three talent trees, although Leadership is always a good decision. Good thing you can totally respec your character at will as early as the very opening map of act 2.

4. I don't know about putting points into Lore on every single level-up, but you should definitely prioritize Lore over everything else, even if you're not using magic.

5. Yes. Sirin is a given, but the other three will benefit from being able to buff themselves without needing your other casters to do it for them (which actually helps the whole party) and maybe having an attack spell in their back pocket. Verse, in particular, needs illusion magic (which is fortunately a very easy sigil to find) to reach her full potential as a tank, and is consequently also good with lightning magic, since they both scale off the same stat.

6. Um, I'm not sure there is a way to build the Fatebinder so that you can make every single check from the get-go. But with athletics, if there's a check you need to make that uses it, there will frequently be a check that you can make using subterfuge, as well, which will often lead to more or less the same effect. And sometimes Lore can substitute for subterfuge in much the same way. You shouldn't think of any of them as a replacement for another of them, but it usually works out. So far, I find it works best for me if I concentrate on Lore primarily, and one of the other two secondarily, while every once in a while making sure the third is at a bare minimum of some kind. And the athletic checks are usually pretty low and forgiving, more so than the other two.

7. Everything's good. Some things are better than others, but it mostly depends on how you use it and what you use it for. Even on PotD, this rule applies, although on that difficulty level, it's very apparent that there's a few right ways and a lot of wrong ways to do things, and you will be severely punished for mistakes.

8. Evasive, and Arrow Shield. Two very important talents. Choose one or the other, obviously, not both. Go for whichever tree has other talents that suit your current style best, until you get those specific talents. Also, as I mentioned before, light armor is generally understood to draw agro, so as counter-intuitive as it may be, you should consider favoring it over heavy armor on your Fatebinder.

9. Nothing overshadows Artifacts. Get them. All of them. Or as many as you possibly can. They fill up that weird and seemingly-pointless "power meter" that you get when act 2 starts, too.

10. Never really paid much attention to that, but fire has always seemed to be the best for sheer dps, due to the powerful attacks and frequent ability to cause continual damage via burning. And using whatever sigil that makes fire go boom on the enemies is a safe bet. You can modify spells once creating them, though, so it's hard to say because there's a lot of variability and potential for making spells stronger.

[Hejtan]

Originally posted by LHGreen:

Ugh, that's a lot. Well, okay, here we go.

1. You generally wouldn't. You're gonna want magic to be involved in pretty much everything you do, because magic is king in this game. But if you wanted to do a low/no magic build for your character/party, I dunno, I haven't wanted to do that.

2. Sirin is exactly what she seems, a bard/mage character, and you should probably build her as such. The other two are very interesting, though. See, Verse is actually the best tank in the game, up to and including the Fatebinder. She simply doesn't get hit, and can usually withstand the one or two hits she does take, not to mention that all the light armor you'll be equipping her with is supposedly bait to the AI. If there's someone you don't want the AI targeting, deck them out in heavy armor, as that's apparently a deterrent, although I think they do still prioritize spellcasters (and rightly so). Verse's only flaw as a tank is that she doesn't have an AoE taunt talent, only a single-target taunt, so you'll have to supplement it with the Taunting Jest spell, which requires the sigil of emotion, and you can't get that until the beginning of act 2 at the very earliest, depending on conquest decisions. But other than that, she's stunningly effective.

You'd think she'd be the rogue character, but no. That's actually Kills. Kills is also a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ cannon, your most damaging, heavy-hitting character by far, and I suspect is the main reason why enemies in PotD are so damn OP. But she's also your stealth specialist (as in, she's the only party member other than the Fatebinder who has talents in her talent trees that specifically deal with stealth, something which is conspicuously absent in Verse's trees), and when you need one of your characters to sneak into a group of unsuspecting enemies to take out the one you think will cause you the most trouble in a single mighty blow, then hold the rest of them off until everyone else can get there and back her up, Kills is your Beastman. Given that, her inability to wear any armor perhaps makes a little more sense, mechanics-wise.

3. No. Not in my opinion, anyway. Unless you're playing on PotD, or willing to spend a LOT of time, energy, and rings to game the system, you're not gonna get above level 20-something, because of a soft (but still possible-to-circumvent) level-cap, so you need to consider your tech tree carefully. You should only focus on two or MAYBE three talent trees, although Leadership is always a good decision. Good thing you can totally respec your character at will as early as the very opening map of act 2.

4. I don't know about putting points into Lore on every single level-up, but you should definitely prioritize Lore over everything else, even if you're not using magic.

5. Yes. Sirin is a given, but the other three will benefit from being able to buff themselves without needing your other casters to do it for them (which actually helps the whole party) and maybe having an attack spell in their back pocket. Verse, in particular, needs illusion magic (which is fortunately a very easy sigil to find) to reach her full potential as a tank, and is consequently also good with lightning magic, since they both scale off the same stat.

6. Um, I'm not sure there is a way to build the Fatebinder so that you can make every single check from the get-go. But with athletics, if there's a check you need to make that uses it, there will frequently be a check that you can make using subterfuge, as well, which will often lead to more or less the same effect. And sometimes Lore can substitute for subterfuge in much the same way. You shouldn't think of any of them as a replacement for another of them, but it usually works out. So far, I find it works best for me if I concentrate on Lore primarily, and one of the other two secondarily, while every once in a while making sure the third is at a bare minimum of some kind. And the athletic checks are usually pretty low and forgiving, more so than the other two.

7. Everything's good. Some things are better than others, but it mostly depends on how you use it and what you use it for. Even on PotD, this rule applies, although on that difficulty level, it's very apparent that there's a few right ways and a lot of wrong ways to do things, and you will be severely punished for mistakes.

8. Evasive, and Arrow Shield. Two very important talents. Choose one or the other, obviously, not both. Go for whichever tree has other talents that suit your current style best, until you get those specific talents. Also, as I mentioned before, light armor is generally understood to draw agro, so as counter-intuitive as it may be, you should consider favoring it over heavy armor on your Fatebinder.

9. Nothing overshadows Artifacts. Get them. All of them. Or as many as you possibly can. They fill up that weird and seemingly-pointless "power meter" that you get when act 2 starts, too.

10. Never really paid much attention to that, but fire has always seemed to be the best for sheer dps, due to the powerful attacks and frequent ability to cause continual damage via burning. And using whatever sigil that makes fire go boom on the enemies is a safe bet. You can modify spells once creating them, though, so it's hard to say because there's a lot of variability and potential for making spells stronger.

That's a very detailed answer, answering every single question at more than satisfactionary level, and I thank you for that!

[LHGreen]

Yw, but I left a few semi-unanswered, even if I did respond to them. Plus, you don't yet know how right I was about any of them.

[suejak]

Last I played, Sirin was the best tank in the game

[LHGreen]

Originally posted by suejak:

Last I played, Sirin was the best tank in the game

Have you played on PotD? But I dunno, maybe that's true. My info might be outdated. How does the build for turning Sirin into a tank work?