Can't Get Into the Combat

[neon.wir]

Played through this a couple of times in the past around the time the Xen chapters were finally released. Last night decided to start it up again. I really just can't get into the combat in this game, and it seems like it's the one thing holding it back for me. Enemies just go from 0 to 100 in an instant. Either dashing around and changing directions like inertia is a suggestion, or just instantly shooting you (without even having to fully face you). The accuracy on most of your guns is poor yet you can get picked off pretty effortlessly by the AI with firearms at a distance. And when you do hit them, they barely react if at all, so it never seems like actually shooting them offers any advantage. I've just never been able get over this and I've really tried. I've switched between more aggressive and defensive approaches, different weapons, setting traps, taking pot shots, or simple absorbing damage as I fire relentlessly just to kill them before they kill me. It always, ALWAYS feels bad.

I absolutely love learning the nuances to combat mechanics in action games and understanding the rhythm to enemy encounters. I don't know what I'm missing that other people seem to see when it comes the gunplay in this though. It always seems like the game is at its best when you're doing anything BUT shooting. And when I'm not doing that, I'm actually enjoying the game.

So I'll just ask: How do you make the most of the combat in this game? What advice do you have to offer to make these encounters more bearable or, day I say, actually fun? Especially against the marines, who are just frustration encapsulated.

[1mbalanced]

Are you familar with FPS genre? I currently going through Black Mesa and have no problem with enemies at all, exept controllers maybe. Early enemies such are Headcrabs, Vortigaunt, Hounds are squishy and easy to deal with. Although military forces is kinda annoying by they pattern of fighting, they still can be sniped with revolver or crossbow, or even teared in pieces by point blank double barrel. Maybe you should try the game on easy difficulty?

[Jernas]

Yeah, that's how the original Half Life has always been. I could never stand the original game, even back in the day, precisely due to the things you describe. I'm playing through Black Mesa right now, and even though I will probably make it through the game, the combat is just as bad as I remember it from the past.

[Swanky]

The only thing I really dislike is the kickback of the MP5. Spread would be fine, the kickback is what kills this weapon for me. Most other things I can work around; patterns of the Marines can be finicky especially in the later chapters but that's about it.
Half-Life / Black Mesa is a peculiar type of combat that requires a bit of getting into as it's not exactly the exact 90's shooter but that's what I like about it. Can't blame you if you have a bit of trouble winding your head around it.

[neon.wir]

Originally posted by 1mbalanced:

Are you familar with FPS genre? I currently going through Black Mesa and have no problem with enemies at all, exept controllers maybe. Early enemies such are Headcrabs, Vortigaunt, Hounds are squishy and easy to deal with. Although military forces is kinda annoying by they pattern of fighting, they still can be sniped with revolver or crossbow, or even teared in pieces by point blank double barrel. Maybe you should try the game on easy difficulty?

Yes I am familiar with the FPS genre going back to Doom 2 as my first one when I was just a kid. I'm no stranger to many the different styles of shooting games. The difficulty isn't the problem (though I think every HL game has rather poor balancing on anything outside of the medium difficulty mode). It's the way all of the elements act independently and just don't feel like they come together to create a very satisfying experience.

What's this "pattern of fighting" the military opponents possesses? I've personally never noticed much of a pattern, so this could be very helpful to understand.

Originally posted by Jernas:

Yeah, that's how the original Half Life has always been. I could never stand the original game, even back in the day, precisely due to the things you describe. I'm playing through Black Mesa right now, and even though I will probably make it through the game, the combat is just as bad as I remember it from the past.

Yes, unfortunately I feel the same way. I played the original Half-Life back in the day and just couldn't find it very fun. The shooting sections always felt like they were just a chore to get through. And then the Xen levels... man, thinking back it's a bit amazing I had the patience to put up with those even when I was a teenager. Funny that HL2 ended up being one of my favorites. Thankfully Black Mesa has streamlined and improved some of the more confusing or tedious parts, like when you're on the rail cart and the aforementioned Xen levels.

Originally posted by Swanky:

The only thing I really dislike is the kickback of the MP5. Spread would be fine, the kickback is what kills this weapon for me. Most other things I can work around; patterns of the Marines can be finicky especially in the later chapters but that's about it.
Half-Life / Black Mesa is a peculiar type of combat that requires a bit of getting into as it's not exactly the exact 90's shooter but that's what I like about it. Can't blame you if you have a bit of trouble winding your head around it.

Yeah, I keep seeing people say things like "It takes getting used to" but I've tried numerous times and I just don't understand what it is I'm supposed to "get used to." That's why I finally decided to ask outright what can I do to make this a more enjoyable experience. Sometimes enjoying a game is finding the right mindset for it or understanding something that you may not see is there. People obviously see something in the combat to this game that I don't.

[Engamer01]

If you have played modern shooters, it can be tough to go back to something "retro". Even though Black Mesa made some quality-of-life improvements in terms of giving Half-Life 1 a face-lift, it unfortunately had to keep the controls and weapon systems mostly unchanged outside a few things.

Could a bigger variety of weapons or changing out some of the unpopular weapons for other more popular ones might help here? Maybe. But I also think nerfing the HL1 weapons from their HL1 incarnations did nothing but make the combat unnecessarily more difficult to go with the AI changes for the HL1 enemies to make to run more like the HL2 enemies.

You know how to make the Combine look stupid in combat in Half-Life 2? You can do the same to the HECU in Black Mesa. So if you put in a lot of time in HL2, Black Mesa won't feel quite as new.

[Dr.Mario'sTeabaggin Squirrel Rx]

I have the same issue with the game. there is no real strategy for killing enemies other than bum-rushing them and tanking their bullets to kill them as soon as possible because the enemies will continue to hit u repeatedly instantaneously whenever they see u. the game also likes to surprise you with multiple enemies at once and then ur stuck fumbling which weapons to use to kill them.

[Sammadily]

Originally posted by neon.wir:

Originally posted by 1mbalanced:

Are you familar with FPS genre? I currently going through Black Mesa and have no problem with enemies at all, exept controllers maybe. Early enemies such are Headcrabs, Vortigaunt, Hounds are squishy and easy to deal with. Although military forces is kinda annoying by they pattern of fighting, they still can be sniped with revolver or crossbow, or even teared in pieces by point blank double barrel. Maybe you should try the game on easy difficulty?

Yes I am familiar with the FPS genre going back to Doom 2 as my first one when I was just a kid. I'm no stranger to many the different styles of shooting games. The difficulty isn't the problem (though I think every HL game has rather poor balancing on anything outside of the medium difficulty mode). It's the way all of the elements act independently and just don't feel like they come together to create a very satisfying experience.

What's this "pattern of fighting" the military opponents possesses? I've personally never noticed much of a pattern, so this could be very helpful to understand.

Originally posted by Jernas:

Yeah, that's how the original Half Life has always been. I could never stand the original game, even back in the day, precisely due to the things you describe. I'm playing through Black Mesa right now, and even though I will probably make it through the game, the combat is just as bad as I remember it from the past.

Yes, unfortunately I feel the same way. I played the original Half-Life back in the day and just couldn't find it very fun. The shooting sections always felt like they were just a chore to get through. And then the Xen levels... man, thinking back it's a bit amazing I had the patience to put up with those even when I was a teenager. Funny that HL2 ended up being one of my favorites. Thankfully Black Mesa has streamlined and improved some of the more confusing or tedious parts, like when you're on the rail cart and the aforementioned Xen levels.

Originally posted by Swanky:

The only thing I really dislike is the kickback of the MP5. Spread would be fine, the kickback is what kills this weapon for me. Most other things I can work around; patterns of the Marines can be finicky especially in the later chapters but that's about it.
Half-Life / Black Mesa is a peculiar type of combat that requires a bit of getting into as it's not exactly the exact 90's shooter but that's what I like about it. Can't blame you if you have a bit of trouble winding your head around it.

Yeah, I keep seeing people say things like "It takes getting used to" but I've tried numerous times and I just don't understand what it is I'm supposed to "get used to." That's why I finally decided to ask outright what can I do to make this a more enjoyable experience. Sometimes enjoying a game is finding the right mindset for it or understanding something that you may not see is there. People obviously see something in the combat to this game that I don't.

Heres a guide to learn how to fight the hecu well. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=700851705 I played all the HL games except for HLA. and fighting the hecu isn't to difficult but is definetly challenging alot more then the combine. a issue i find with the hecu guide is that. Close range combat against them is also good. If you have a accurate trigger finger you can use the shotgun and mp5 to get some headshots and take them out.

[Define Brackish Water]

Originally posted by XOFHunter-Eight:

Heres a guide to learn how to fight the hecu well. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=700851705 I played all the HL games except for HLA. and fighting the hecu isn't to difficult but is definetly challenging alot more then the combine.

I thought you were being rude but after reading that guide I have completely changed my mind. The strategies in that guide match the strategies I came up with as I played through the game on hard. Attempting to fight the HECU in any way other than those mentioned in that guide is just plain wrong. Even CQC with the shotgun can be suicidal due to their speed and rapid fire... Miss the first shot and if you don't break line of sight then every one of their shots will hit. Can only do that so many times in a firefight.

Black Mesa's HECU are basically walking/running turrets. They get more accurate as you get closer and once alerted will always know where you are. Plan for that and you'll find success.

The fundamental problem is that the Black Mesa HECU function like the combine AI in Half-Life 2. That AI was designed for the larger spaces and wasn't adapted appropriately for this game's level design. They were also tweaked to be able to shoot while moving, so the soldiers can generally shoot at you whenever they see you and can constantly run back and forth.

Ways to make it better:
• Don't play on Hard when fighting soldiers.
  
• Use auto-aim when fighting soldiers.
  
• Cheese the soldier's pray-and-spray aim by barely peeking your head out above cover when at a far distance. With a small enough target and a far enough distance this can be overpowered.
  
• Don't use the pistol against the soldiers. The DPS is too low compared to the SMG and the pistol isn't accurate enough.

[neon.wir]

Originally posted by XOFHunter-Eight:

Heres a guide to learn how to fight the hecu well. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=700851705 I played all the HL games except for HLA. and fighting the hecu isn't to difficult but is definetly challenging alot more then the combine. a issue i find with the hecu guide is that. Close range combat against them is also good. If you have a accurate trigger finger you can use the shotgun and mp5 to get some headshots and take them out.

Thank you for the guide. The information it provides is helpful enough, but it really just tells you to stay far away and snipe them. Which I pretty much already did any time I could. It does work, though it's only applicable a portion of the time you spend fighting the HECU. A lot of the encounters, especially early on, are in tight corridors rather than open areas you can get a lot of distance with a clear sight to them. As the above poster mentioned, the AI is much more suited to more open spaces, which Half-Life and by extension Black Mesa unfortunately just doesn't provide enough of.

It does mention utilizing the tau cannon more, which I admit is a weapon I mostly forget about and thus rarely use. Perhaps I'll go through again and be more mindful of using that when it's available. As well as be a bit less conservative with the magnum.

It really seems like a lot of issues could be rectified by making the enemies react more appropriately to taking damage. Such as Interrupting/staggering them or lowering their accuracy for a brief period. Or even just other adjustments to their behavior in general, like not running and shooting at the same time, larger gaps between firing intervals, slower or less erratic movements, leading their shots so you can dash one way and then another so they miss you. But I guess those ideas are just destined to remain what-ifs.

It is a good guide though. Thank you.

Originally posted by Define Brackish Water:

Ways to make it better:
• Don't play on Hard when fighting soldiers.
  
• Use auto-aim when fighting soldiers.
  
• Cheese the soldier's pray-and-spray aim by barely peeking your head out above cover when at a far distance. With a small enough target and a far enough distance this can be overpowered.
  
• Don't use the pistol against the soldiers. The DPS is too low compared to the SMG and the pistol isn't accurate enough.

I already play HL games on the normal difficulty settings most of the time because, as I said before, I find the series to be poorly balanced on any other setting. And auto-aim, eh, I just prefer not to. And yeah, I never use the pistol on them. It's a pretty worthless weapon against most enemies.

Thanks for everyone that replied. I guess the main issue is that at medium-to-close range you're just at a great disadvantage. And unfortunately that's where you're stuck fighting them a lot. I appreciate everyone responding to the thread. I was really hoping to hope to find some detail or something that I missed to see why so many seem to think the combat is good in this game. I guess this one just isn't going to click with me. Oh well, it's still a really good game in most other ways and is still alright to run through once in a while... a long while.

[epoo1]

I find this game quite easy. And this is not really because I am skilled, because I am not.
Really, you need to adapt to each enemy you face. Crowbar for zombies. Crowbar/pistol for headcrabs. Shotgun for houndeyes. Double shot for bullsquid, or Magnum for far away bullsquid. Same rules for vortiguants. Pistol for barnacles. SMG for marines. Double shot shotgun or gluon gun for alien grunts. Explosives when you can. I can go on and on, and some people probably disagree with me, so find what works for you.

[Mazey]

Magnum headshot or crossbow anywhere. Soldiers are dead. Done and dusted.

The aliens are all so predicable that you can take them all out with the pistol and a bit of cover.

[neon.wir]

To the two posters above

Originally posted by neon.wir:

The difficulty isn't the problem (though I think every HL game has rather poor balancing on anything outside of the medium difficulty mode). It's the way all of the elements act independently and just don't feel like they come together to create a very satisfying experience.

But I think I'm basically done with this topic. I don't think the combat in Black Mesa is good and it probably won't click with me like it does with others.

[IlGhostlI]

There is a command called npc_marine_speed which is set at 1.25, put it to 1.00.

The marines were annoying the hell out of me how unrealisticly fast they move. You need to activate the developers console in the settings.

Edit: To permanently change it there is a file called skill that has the npc_marine_speed and a bunch of other settings such as hp etc that you can adjust, but changing it in there should permanently slow them down a bit.

C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Black Mesa\bms\cfg