Black Mesa

Black Mesa

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My opinion on Black Mesa after finishing original HL1
https://steamcommunity.com/id/Troleika/recommended/362890/
"A slight dissapointment

That's how I would call Black Mesa after playing the original half-life. While Black Mesa is a reimagining of Half-Life and not a direct remake, I still think it lacks some very important aspects which made hl1 and even hl2 so interesting and unique. It's the lack of breakable objects and hidden equipment.
In Half-Life almost every box had equipment in it, either in form of ammo, energy or even a grenade. Also most of the things you see on the ground, even corpses can be broken appart. In Black Mesa, none of this exists, only very specific boxes (and only these boxes!) can be broken and even these don't hold anything useful in them. Most of the props are interactable, but that's about it, they don't break and don't have any interesting properties, they just exist to fill up the scene.
While this whole thing might sound funny, but it's actually what made hl1/hl2 so good and unique, exploration of the levels often gave you rewards along with the ability to dynamically change the level, even if it was very slight.
Either way, it's a great game, I had a lot of fun playing it. The workshop has some replayability in it too, so don't worry after you finish the game. I'm looking forward into the additions of xen, I hope they worth all this wait and hype."

With this being said, I want to add up that Black Mesa is a great looking game, even if it's missing few levels, it's still very good. It might have other certain problems that make the game less enjoyable, like let's say the decrease of ammo pool with Magnum, but these problems are quite nothing compared to things I mentioned in my review.
Ostatnio edytowany przez: Andbrew; 2 lipca 2018 o 4:42
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Sovereign 2 lipca 2018 o 4:26 
Acutally a lot of crates in the orginal didn't have anything in them, it was random. Crates work the exact same way in BM, some have stuff, some don't, pretty much all are breakable. Bodies and also be gibbed just like the orignal, it's actually easier to gib enemies in BM I believe, even the shotgun can blow them apart.
Andbrew 2 lipca 2018 o 4:44 
I am 100% certain crates in HL1 weren't random, but either way, most of them had something usable in them, unlike in Black Mesa where 1 out of 10 crates has ammo / power / health.
As for gore, I got in mind corpses, you can't gib them with anything else, but shotgun secondary or an explosive. Also the gibs don't leave blood below them which is kinda weird.
Sovereign 2 lipca 2018 o 5:23 
Początkowo opublikowane przez A. Max.:
I am 100% certain crates in HL1 weren't random, but either way, most of them had something usable in them, unlike in Black Mesa where 1 out of 10 crates has ammo / power / health.
As for gore, I got in mind corpses, you can't gib them with anything else, but shotgun secondary or an explosive. Also the gibs don't leave blood below them which is kinda weird.
I didn't mean random as in "randomized", I meant that there isn't really any consistency when it comes to which crates have stuff and which don't. You can have two crates of the same "type", one might have an ammo pickup while the other doesn't.

No, most crates didn't have anything in them, lot's did, but most didn't. This was one of the ways HL2 improved the design, in HL2 only dedicated supply crates had stuff in them, while all regular crates didn't, this avoided the problem from HL1 where you had to go around breaking every crate in a room just on the off-chance that one or two of them might have some ammo in them, a rather tedious task. As for BM, most of the crates that have stuff in them have been taken straight from the original, if a particular crate in a particular room had something in it in HL1, then the same crate in the same room in BM will have the same thing in it in almost every instance. Now of course there are generally more crates in BM then in HL1, this is to make rooms feel more full and detailed when many rooms in HL1 where empty and barren. Basically BM has around the same amount of "full" crates as HL1, it just also has a lot more "filler" crates.

You can gib enemies with lot's of things: shotgun, tau cannon, gluon gun and any kind of explosive weapon, just like HL1. Gibbing with any other weapon wouldn't really make sense. I think most gibs not leaving behind blood decals on the floor is due to technical limitations, there are only so many decals you can have active at once before you start taxing the engine, the Source engine is very old after all.
Ostatnio edytowany przez: Sovereign; 2 lipca 2018 o 5:44
Andbrew 2 lipca 2018 o 5:48 
Początkowo opublikowane przez Sovereign:
Początkowo opublikowane przez A. Max.:
I am 100% certain crates in HL1 weren't random, but either way, most of them had something usable in them, unlike in Black Mesa where 1 out of 10 crates has ammo / power / health.
As for gore, I got in mind corpses, you can't gib them with anything else, but shotgun secondary or an explosive. Also the gibs don't leave blood below them which is kinda weird.
I didn't mean random as in "randomized", I meant that there isn't really any consistency when it comes to which crates have stuff and which don't. You can have two crates of the same "type", one might have an ammo pickup while the other doesn't.

No, most crates didn't have anything in them, lot's did, but most didn't. This was one of the ways HL2 improeved the design, in HL2 only dedicated supply crates had stuff in them, while all regular crates didn't, this avoided the problem from HL1 where you had to go around breaking every crate in a room just on the off-chance that one or two of them might have some ammo in them, a rather tedious task. As for BM, most of the crates that have stuff in them have been taken straight from the original, if a particular crate in a particular room had something in it in HL1, then the same crate in the same room in BM will have the same thing in it in almost every instance. Now of course there are generally more crates in BM then in HL1, this is to make rooms feel more full and detailed when many rooms in HL1 where empty and barren. Basically BM has around the same amount of "full" crates as HL1, it just also has a lot more "filler" crates.

You can gib enemies with lot's of things: shotgun, tau cannon, gluon gun and any kind of explosive weapon, just like HL1, gibbing with any other weapon wouldn't really make sense. I think most gibs not leaving behind blood decals on the floor is due to technical limitations, there are only so many decals you can have active at once before you start taxing the engine, the Source engine is very old after all.
The problem with Black Mesa is that it's really hard to tell what's just cosmetic and what's actually usuable, just like the crates. In HL1 everything was clearly visible if it's a part of the map or an interactable object. In black mesa, most of the explosive stuff doesnt stand out as much, same with buttons, destructable crates and etc.
DOI did well with leaving decals under gibs, it even had blood trails. And it's on Source. Also I don't really understand how shooting / hitting an arm for a minute doesn't tear it off or even gib the corpse, in HL1 it did. Either way, it's not exacly very important.

In general Black Mesa brings a lot of new problems, which HL1 didn't even had.
Sovereign 2 lipca 2018 o 6:10 
Początkowo opublikowane przez A. Max.:
Początkowo opublikowane przez Sovereign:
I didn't mean random as in "randomized", I meant that there isn't really any consistency when it comes to which crates have stuff and which don't. You can have two crates of the same "type", one might have an ammo pickup while the other doesn't.

No, most crates didn't have anything in them, lot's did, but most didn't. This was one of the ways HL2 improeved the design, in HL2 only dedicated supply crates had stuff in them, while all regular crates didn't, this avoided the problem from HL1 where you had to go around breaking every crate in a room just on the off-chance that one or two of them might have some ammo in them, a rather tedious task. As for BM, most of the crates that have stuff in them have been taken straight from the original, if a particular crate in a particular room had something in it in HL1, then the same crate in the same room in BM will have the same thing in it in almost every instance. Now of course there are generally more crates in BM then in HL1, this is to make rooms feel more full and detailed when many rooms in HL1 where empty and barren. Basically BM has around the same amount of "full" crates as HL1, it just also has a lot more "filler" crates.

You can gib enemies with lot's of things: shotgun, tau cannon, gluon gun and any kind of explosive weapon, just like HL1, gibbing with any other weapon wouldn't really make sense. I think most gibs not leaving behind blood decals on the floor is due to technical limitations, there are only so many decals you can have active at once before you start taxing the engine, the Source engine is very old after all.
The problem with Black Mesa is that it's really hard to tell what's just cosmetic and what's actually usuable, just like the crates. In HL1 everything was clearly visible if it's a part of the map or an interactable object. In black mesa, most of the explosive stuff doesnt stand out as much, same with buttons, destructable crates and etc.
DOI did well with leaving decals under gibs, it even had blood trails. And it's on Source. Also I don't really understand how shooting / hitting an arm for a minute doesn't tear it off or even gib the corpse, in HL1 it did. Either way, it's not exacly very important.

In general Black Mesa brings a lot of new problems, which HL1 didn't even had.
I'll admit BM does make the crate scavenger hunt a bit worse but it's a problem HL1 already had. Explosive probs are clearly labled in the same manner as HL1, all regular crates are breakable and I have never had any problem finding buttons.

No, hitting a human arm with a crowbar for a minute will not cause it to come of, nor would shooting it with a small caliber firearm, and why are you attacking already dead corpses anyway?

Overall mate if you don't really like BM then that's fine, but these "problems", even if they were true, are incredibly minor, petty nitpicks that don't really matter at all. Maybe you should focus more on actually important stuff, like stroytelling, level design, technical design, pacing and whether or not the combat and puzzles are actually fun, rather then whether or not you can gib corpses or how many random crates might have ammo in them. Just a friendly suggestion, I'm not trying to be aggressive or anything.
Ostatnio edytowany przez: Sovereign; 2 lipca 2018 o 6:17
Andbrew 2 lipca 2018 o 6:31 
Początkowo opublikowane przez Sovereign:
Początkowo opublikowane przez A. Max.:
The problem with Black Mesa is that it's really hard to tell what's just cosmetic and what's actually usuable, just like the crates. In HL1 everything was clearly visible if it's a part of the map or an interactable object. In black mesa, most of the explosive stuff doesnt stand out as much, same with buttons, destructable crates and etc.
DOI did well with leaving decals under gibs, it even had blood trails. And it's on Source. Also I don't really understand how shooting / hitting an arm for a minute doesn't tear it off or even gib the corpse, in HL1 it did. Either way, it's not exacly very important.

In general Black Mesa brings a lot of new problems, which HL1 didn't even had.
I'll admit BM does make the crate scavenger hunt a bit worse but it's a problem HL1 already had. Explosive probs are clearly labled in the same manner as HL1, all regular crates are breakable and I have never had any problem finding buttons.

No, hitting a human arm with a crowbar for a minute will not cause it to come of, nor would shooting it with a small caliber firearm, and why are you attacking already dead corpses anyway?

Overall mate if you don't really like BM then that's fine, but these "problems", even if they were true, are incredibly minor, petty nitpicks that don't really matter at all. Maybe you should focus more on actually important stuff, like stroytelling, level design, technical design, pacing and whether or not the combat and puzzles are actually fun, rather then whether or not you can gib corpses or how many random crates might have ammo in them. Just a friendly suggestion, I'm not trying to be aggressive or anything.
I mean, the problem is that BM has a ton of these "minor" problems, but when you pick them all up, you really start to see how they make the game worse:
1. For example balance between MP5 and G17 has been completely shagged, in HL1 G17 was accurate, but had low rate of fire, while MP5 was inaccurate, but had 50 rounds in the mag and good ROF. In Black Mesa, the pistol is just overall worse, it has poor accuracy and is generally replaced by MP5 in the first 30 minutes of the game.
2. The levels looks often overcrowded with all kinds of stuff and often I'm just lost. It's even hard to spot things like explosive barrels around enemies due to all of the clutter.
3. .357 Magnum barely has any ammo with the 6+12 pool. I would rather have it be less accurate but have more ammo just like in the original game than have this HL2 magnum mimic. Low ammo pool combined with poorer scaveging ends up in the weapon not being that fun to use.

I love BM as far as it goes, but it has some problems and it's still in EA, so I try to give constructive critism and hope that these problems will be ironed out.
Andbrew 2 lipca 2018 o 6:42 
4. Often when you enter a new level, the lightning completely changes.
5. The loading times are very long.
6. "Sniper" has the same problem as Magnum, it's worse in all aspects. In HF1 it was at least somewhat balanced with long ass reload and delays between shots.
7. Musci most of the time blasts the game out of nowhere, giving this really weird vibe.

And so on. This game has a ton of problems and as I said before, they might be minor, but they make up a huge wall, which make my experience way worse.
Ostatnio edytowany przez: Andbrew; 2 lipca 2018 o 6:44
Sovereign 2 lipca 2018 o 6:54 
Początkowo opublikowane przez A. Max.:
Początkowo opublikowane przez Sovereign:
I'll admit BM does make the crate scavenger hunt a bit worse but it's a problem HL1 already had. Explosive probs are clearly labled in the same manner as HL1, all regular crates are breakable and I have never had any problem finding buttons.

No, hitting a human arm with a crowbar for a minute will not cause it to come of, nor would shooting it with a small caliber firearm, and why are you attacking already dead corpses anyway?

Overall mate if you don't really like BM then that's fine, but these "problems", even if they were true, are incredibly minor, petty nitpicks that don't really matter at all. Maybe you should focus more on actually important stuff, like stroytelling, level design, technical design, pacing and whether or not the combat and puzzles are actually fun, rather then whether or not you can gib corpses or how many random crates might have ammo in them. Just a friendly suggestion, I'm not trying to be aggressive or anything.
I mean, the problem is that BM has a ton of these "minor" problems, but when you pick them all up, you really start to see how they make the game worse:
1. For example balance between MP5 and G17 has been completely shagged, in HL1 G17 was accurate, but had low rate of fire, while MP5 was inaccurate, but had 50 rounds in the mag and good ROF. In Black Mesa, the pistol is just overall worse, it has poor accuracy and is generally replaced by MP5 in the first 30 minutes of the game.
2. The levels looks often overcrowded with all kinds of stuff and often I'm just lost. It's even hard to spot things like explosive barrels around enemies due to all of the clutter.
3. .357 Magnum barely has any ammo with the 6+12 pool. I would rather have it be less accurate but have more ammo just like in the original game than have this HL2 magnum mimic. Low ammo pool combined with poorer scaveging ends up in the weapon not being that fun to use.

I love BM as far as it goes, but it has some problems and it's still in EA, so I try to give constructive critism and hope that these problems will be ironed out.
1. You may be on to something there, personally I never really noticed as I use both it pretty much the same manner as I did in HL1. Also how did you get the SMG within the first 30 minutes? You don't get it until a ways through chapter 5 which takes me at least a couple of hours to reach, usually more. XD

2. That sounds like a problem with your sense of direction then a fault with the game. This isn't the 90s anymore, you can't get away barren grey corridors with nothing in them. That "clutter" is just level detail, just like every other modern game that's set in a realistic(ish) enviroment. You just need to pay more attention to your surroundings, most people don't have this problem.

3. This is just better balancing, the magnum is a very powerful weapon and you could carry way too much ammo for it (42 rounds, what the hell were they smoking?). This way you actually have to conserve and be tactical like in HL2, even then it's still HL, there's ammo everywhere. Making the weapon less accurate would be a far worse change then then just having less ammo, accuracy and stopping power are the magnums whole thing.

Yeah your right, this is probably the best time to give constructive criticism while it's still in EA, but only if they are actual problems.
Ostatnio edytowany przez: Sovereign; 2 lipca 2018 o 7:22
DIGITAL SPORTS  [producent] 2 lipca 2018 o 7:41 
I mean, everyone is entitled to their own opinions and priorities, but I really fail to see how "crates having a bit less stuff in the original and functioning slightly differently" warrants a negative review of that game which brands it as having "no soul". It seems incredibly minor to me (and not entirely accurate, our crates are functionally near identical to HL1, and any barrenness comes from having to stick within a strict entity limit).

All the opinions you just listed above, aside from your original post and actual review make for a much more cogent argument on that front, even if I (naturally) disagree with most of them. For example:

1) I would say the BMS balance is better. Our Glock is pretty much on par with HL1's, but our MP5 is much better. Which I think is a good thing, because HL1's was kind of awful. I don't see why you need both weapons to be viable later on in the game, at any rate.

2) Our detailing is incredibly minimalistic and understated relative to most modern games. There's a reason almost all modern shooters use objective markers and waypoints and such. This is a hard issue to avoid if you want to have a detailed and alive world. I would argue that we handle this pretty well.

3) I find this to be an improvement, personally.

4) There is nothing we can do about this. This is stock Source engine jank.

5) Ditto.

6) I'm pretty sure our Crossbow is better than HL1's? The projectile is definitely faster and does more damage.

7) Fair one and a matter of taste I guess? I liked the way BMS brought the soundtrack to the front, personally.

I don't know, a lot of these seem like personal preference to me. Which is fine, as liking a game or not largely comes down to personal preference. But I don't think those are necessarily failures that warrant branding our game as having "no soul". I feel like our game has tonnes of soul and love poured into it.
Andbrew 2 lipca 2018 o 9:47 
Początkowo opublikowane przez BMS DIGITAL SPORTS:
~snip~
I believe I edited the review and this post after I realised that I was way too harsh on the game, I even made it positive. The game is very good, it's just for me it's a slight dissapointment, just like the first sentece says.
As for the rest of the points, the music is good, it's just way too loud on default and it starts playing at quite the weird times. Like, I kill that giant fire firing thing and suddenly loud and intence combat music starts playing. What the hell?

Mocing on, Glock 17 is out matched by MP5 in Black Mesa, whiel in HL1 both are as usefull due to G17 accuracy andf MP5 inaccuracy. Some could argue that it's an improvement, since you get a literally better weapon than the first one, but in my eyes it's inbalanced due to the fact that you don't need to use that weapon ever again, since another one you got is literally better in all ways.

Now about Magnum and the crossbow. I mean, from balance standpoint it makes sence to have those two have very little ammo, but I believe that giving them more ammo in total would add more gameplay options in the sence that you could stick to that weapon for way longer just like in HL1. In Black Mesa with both of these weapons I often use them for a bit and then wander a long time without using them due to the lack of ammo (I just went through the chapter with crossbow in it and I swear the god, I haven't seen a single box of Magnum ammo).

Either way, I understand that Black Mesa is taking the much more realistic route with level design, guns and etc., while HL1 was more game-like with everything. It was simpler, but that ofc doesn't make Black Mase worse.
I hope this gives my point of view about this game in a better way. I also found it weird that you answered to the unedited version of my review and post, not to the final one.
Ostatnio edytowany przez: Andbrew; 2 lipca 2018 o 9:48
Andbrew 2 lipca 2018 o 9:59 
There's also this one thing that bothered me, which is the lack of radio filter on HECU lines, but this is 100% prefrence.
Początkowo opublikowane przez A. Max.:
There's also this one thing that bothered me, which is the lack of radio filter on HECU lines, but this is 100% prefrence.
The 2012 mod version had this for the HECU, was changed to its current form because it was deemed "cheesy" by many.
DIGITAL SPORTS  [producent] 2 lipca 2018 o 16:30 
Początkowo opublikowane przez Nonimportantuser:
The 2012 mod version had this for the HECU, was changed to its current form because it was deemed "cheesy" by many.

That wasn't quite the reason.

When we decided we wanted to revoice the Marines for the retail release (I pushed quite hard for this), we wanted to move away from the cheesy, corny 80s villain delivery of the mod and head more in the direction of realism. We actually wanted to humanise the HECU a bit, to make the conflict a bit more interesting and grey.

Once we'd recorded Michael Tsarouhas's parts, we found the delivery to be excellent and well grounded. Applying a radio filter to it seemed counter to our goals of keeping things more realistic - given that almost all the Marines have uncovered faces.

We figured the optimum way to do things would be to have the gasmask Marines talk with the filter, and the other Marines talk normally. However that didn't work out so great, as it required us to either create a voice filter via code specifically for the gasmask Marines (which none of our programmers really wanted to tackle given we had so many other code priorities), or to duplicate the ENTIRE voice library with a voice filter (an approach where we felt the ends didn't justify the means - too much filesize bloat). We may still wind up doing this some day, but who knows.

So, here we are! We didn't think the radio filter was cheesy so much as were just trying to overall make the retail marines more realistic.
At least that was the reason i heard.
X-542 2 lipca 2018 o 23:17 
Początkowo opublikowane przez A. Max.:
With this being said, I want to add up that Black Mesa is a great looking game, even if it's missing few levels, it's still very good. It might have other certain problems that make the game less enjoyable, like let's say the decrease of ammo pool with Magnum, but these problems are quite nothing compared to things I mentioned in my review.

What problems? In your review you complain about that boxes don't have items in them which is something so minor it barely warrants mentioning.
Ostatnio edytowany przez: X-542; 2 lipca 2018 o 23:18
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