Ending interpretation?

[Baby]

I would like to talk with people who ended game already. (It was amazing, btw!)
Did Fran really kill her parents? If she did, she was mentally unstable, I guess? Was she living in asylum before? (I'm talking about the part with small Fran) Is kitty dead (body in coffin)? :( Why he couldn't talk anymore? Did she die in the ending? Are aunt Grace and dr Oswald dead?
And please, don't say things like "you will have to answer it yourself", my curiosity is hungry for answers :(

[DeadDancers]

Actual ending seemed... unexpected. Abrupt. Too-happy, the prince of darkness just gave up? Fran went back to the world that told her flat out she brought them danger by being there?

I think none of it was real. I don't think she killed her parents, simply because a little 9-11 year old wouldn't have the upper body strength to make such clean and total cuts (and the newspaper specified that there was no struggle or mess) but that it's possible her aunt did. This would be reflected in the twin sisters who killed each other/hated each other. It would also explain why the aunt asked the Doc to bring Fran home (uneasy at the possible witness being alive?) as opposed to the end-game scene where it seems she's in on it with the old guy and actually wants Fran to be where she is. (Assuming of course that what Fran saw was truth instead of desire).

After she fell from the bridge and became a tree - this seemed to strongly suggest to me that she lost the ability to move in real life and her brain interpreted that as her becoming a tree. (As a result of the fall - we also know the security guard was following her outside so probably found her). I think I remember the Doctor/nurse talking about her, as if she was unconcious and needed tending.

The tree's throne room reminded me of the inside of a skull but that might be coincidence. The inability to move followed by wooden movement might be a result of anesthesia. Her descent into the 5th realm might be because she was taken into surgery, the happy ending a result of her lobotomisation.

All speculation.

I still felt the ending was abrupt and peculiar... and I don't understand why the cat stopped talking. (Unless that was a reflection of Fran's doubt as to his reality, since she 'saw' his corpse in the coffin.)

[zaxxdragon]

I absolutely love all the theories on here and reading them but I would like to add a few points as food for thought.
1. A lobotomy doesn't get rid of a psychosis issue. It only takes away the ability to feel fear. They would use this long ago as a technique to deal with chronic recurring night terrors. Following a lobotomy the patients reported to still have dreams consisting of the same events, but without the fear. It rids the brain of the ability to feel actual fear, leaning towards the sudden and abrupt end of her being just happy. Also, this technique was used to subdue violent mental patients, which could lead to The idea that Fran was hallucinating in the end, attacked aunt grace, then had been subdued and lobotomized, which also explains its abrupt end.

2. I think, although I love all this theorizing, we should step away from it and try to see what the developers were trying to say. I think it's obvious this was more than just a game. I think the theories leaning towards some "real" and some "hallucinated" in game events tells it best rather than one full way or the other. With all this, what are the developers trying to say, is it an artful representation of child (or any age for that matter) mental illness, or is there a message were missing here that may be the fill in for the holes in all of our theories.

All in all I love this game. It's perfect, horridly perfect. It's a game that should be more popular. I love a game that can pick my brain so hard that it drives me mad for leaving an open, interpreted ending that's not quite fair. I would love to see a psychologist of some sort play through this and tell us we're all wrong XD. Well back to theorizing.

[SilasMortimer]

Lobotomy does a lot more than simply stunt fear. It stunts nearly all cognitive function to some degree. This includes every emotion, not just fear.

I have to say, as well, that I agree with DeadDancers that the ending felt very abrupt.

[Stigma]

Personally I feel the ending is exacty what it needs to be; ambigous. I hate it when everything has to be spoonfed to us.

[Dallas]

I agree with not giving up the ending right away... But making you think about for more than a week... I will just forget about this game and move on

[SilasMortimer]

I like that it's ambiguous, absolutely. But the abruptness... I don't want to ignore it. If that abruptness was intentional, and I think it was, that fact in itself might be a clue.

[Stigma]

silasmortimer a écrit :

I like that it's ambiguous, absolutely. But the abruptness... I don't want to ignore it. If that abruptness was intentional, and I think it was, that fact in itself might be a clue.

I think she died and crossed over

[Elytra]

I agree with the the fine gent above, Plus because the ending kinda dident wrap up everything, i think a sequel could be made, exploring more of this.
Also, i REFUSE to think that Fran is dead. She is now my all time favorate charecter/person/humanoid i have seen in my entire lifetime.

[☆]

dodogfordervelse a écrit :

Nitpick: Psychosis is not a permanent condition. Depression is not a symptom of schizophrenia..

Hm I said Schizos can develop depression and it's very common to happen.

I will read everything else tomorrow and keep debating with everyone. <3

[Avian Overlord]

I don't see any reason why Fran can't be schizophrenic and also be having genuine supernatural experiences. She does explictly halluncinate in chapter 3, with the visions of corpses and of her evil self, which other people in Ithersa can't see.

[Secret Min]

I still feel there are a lot of elements in the story that are still too vague. Such as the relationship or agreement Grace, Remor and Oswald had with each other. Along with the nature of Duotine and the Ultra Reality. It seemed Fran actually had the power to travel between different/infinite realities with the help of Duotine. Which gives sense to how she was able to escape from the Asylum, meet her other self and become such a good problem solver. Leon's notes seem to give a bit of backup to all this as it seemed he was a predecessor to all of this before the Twins and Fran.

Another big question is what exactly are Itward and Mr. Midnight. Itward was an entity that seemed to hint at it predating the Twins. Remor seemed to hint at Mr. Midnight being more than just a cat though it should be taken lightly due to Remor's manipulations. The only reason I mention Mr. Midnight was to imply if it really was Fran's cat all along since in Chapter 5 Grace drops a black cat into the abyss. Which actually sounded like a real cat which drove Fran over the edge.

[Toadstool]

off all the things happening right now, i just have on simple question:
did she die?
i hope she didnt die, i dont want her to die, pls tell me she didnt die :(

[SilasMortimer]

Toadstool a écrit :

off all the things happening right now, i just have on simple question:
did she die?
i hope she didnt die, i dont want her to die, pls tell me she didnt die :(

At this point, that is kind of up in the air. So, the way I see it is that you can interpret how you want. (I had the same reaction to the film "Pan's Labyrinth", so I chose the ending interpretation I preferred for a while.)

[Mr_Gorbins]

Toadstool a écrit :

off all the things happening right now, i just have on simple question:
did she die?
i hope she didnt die, i dont want her to die, pls tell me she didnt die :(

Well, the game pretty much answered your question: you are not dead till you have love inside you))).

By the way, why haven't anybody mentioned that the actual story take place in 1944 (look closer through asylum) ? I smell Nazi...

[xDreamlessNightx]

It may be the case that her parents had abandoned her to the asylum, as shown when talking to little Fran through the dimmension. Furthermore, Fran is obviously older than 10 if she really was strangling her Aunt. No 11 year old would have that body strength. She could be thinking that she is 10 going onto 11 since that could be when her parents died, but may be much much older.

Remember, that the cross through dimensions to see herself as a child was focusing soley on changing the time on the cookoo clock in her room when chained to the bed. So it's hard to believe that the other dimmension was parallel (a paralell dimmension). When the other Fran said that she didn't have a kitten called Mr Midnight, that is because she hadn't recieved it for her birthday yet, perhaps?

Anyways, this may have fuelled her hatred for her parents which she acted out by murdering them. There was the writing on the walls in the Oswald Asylum claiming that 'Daddy wasn't there, Mummy did not care' in the upstairs hallway. This could also be the reason why she created Itward in her head, who was seen to be with her in the past, reading bed time stories. This may be a very unlikely ending since her murdering her parents and the writings on the wall may have just been another illusion from Remor. However, I like to think that the tradegy was caused by her loneliness at being betrayed. That could also be why the cat was continously called a traiter.

I would also like to see if anyone could give an analytical reason as to why the cat could no longer talk by the end. Was he indeed a traiter? Had Fran come to terms with the fact that Mr Midnight was dead and that this was just a stray cat?

I NEED ANSWERS!