Unpopular opinion: MP5 should lose ACOG, P90 should keep it

[StickNardoragon]

MP5 works too well for an SMG with the ACOG, I feel like the P90 should get to keep it and the MP5 should lose it, forcing Rook & Doc players to choose either accurate with low range sights, or inaccurate with long range sights. There's currently no reason to use the P90 at all.

[Uncle Sam]

引用自 ExuberantRaptor：

引用自 Mr.Foster(Wolf)：

Well the only nerf they received was the MP5 dmg nerf, they weren't nerfed as much like Blackbeard, Ela, Lion did tbh.
At least as far I remember that's the case.

Rook was nerfed super hard, resets/revives only give 20 health instead of 50.

Rook armor still guarantee a down as long it isn't a headshot, a capitao arrow or a frag grenade to the face.

[Uncle Sam]

引用自 ExuberantRaptor：

引用自 ๖Revanaska：

They nerfed the damage slightly (I believe) due to spawnpeeking, but the damage means nothing when headshots are instant kills in this game. Headshots aren't hard, especially not with an ACOG... And if you miss, it's too easy to get another shot in due to the low recoil. It's not the same case with the P90.

They should get rid of acog for most attackers since their guns have almost no recoil and high damage.

Well that straw man wasn't necessary. I still think the MP5 should conserve the Acog, but add horizontal recoil to it, so there will be a choice between the pea shotted 90 & the MP5.
Instead of just insta pick the MP5 most of the time.

[Uncle Sam]

引用自 ExuberantRaptor：

引用自 Mr.Foster(Wolf)：

Rook armor still guarantee a down as long it isn't a headshot, a capitao arrow or a frag grenade to the face.

It's still a huge nerf. It's 60% less health then before. His win and pick rate went down a lot after the nerf.

Well rook was a no brainer pick, due the guarantee down & 50 plus his MP5.
His gadget didn't got directly nerfed, but rather the "reset strat" was nerfed.
Something similar happened to ash post Acog removal, she lost pick rate, but gained more positive win delta. Basically the disposable all aim, no brain Ash players moved to other operators.

Improving ash win ratio.

It could happen the same to rook & doc if certain adjustments are made to the MP5.

[Tokao]

the way i see it is that your main argument is spawn peeking. spawn peeking itself is risky and if there is a drone or info on the spawn peek you can either avoid it or pre-fire it. its mainly a problem in cas and low elo ranked due to a lack of comms

[Uncle Sam]

引用自 ExuberantRaptor：

引用自 Mr.Foster(Wolf)：

Well that straw man wasn't necessary. I still think the MP5 should conserve the Acog, but add horizontal recoil to it, so there will be a choice between the pea shotted 90 & the MP5.
Instead of just insta pick the MP5 most of the time.

That's not a straw man.

It's it you're saying we should remove attackers Acog, due the low recoil they have in your opinion. Just because @OP suggested to remove the MP5 Acog.

It's a straw man.

[Uncle Sam]

引用自 ExuberantRaptor：

引用自 Mr.Foster(Wolf)：

Well rook was a no brainer pick, due the guarantee down & 50 plus his MP5.
His gadget didn't got directly nerfed, but rather the "reset strat" was nerfed.
Something similar happened to ash post Acog removal, she lost pick rate, but gained more positive win delta. Basically the disposable all aim, no brain Ash players moved to other operators.

Improving ash win ratio.

It could happen the same to rook & doc if certain adjustments are made to the MP5.

Bad comparison. Rooks nerf would be the equivalent of making all explosions have a smaller radius making Ash's and Zofia's abilities less efficient.

He didn't got hit hard by the Nerf hammer, like Blackbeard, Ela & Lion did.
His gadget it's the same as always, the dbno mechanics got nerfed. May I ask you, in your opinion did Caveira got buffed due the DBNO hp changes?

[Uncle Sam]

引用自 ExuberantRaptor：

引用自 Mr.Foster(Wolf)：

It's it you're saying we should remove attackers Acog, due the low recoil they have in your opinion. Just because @OP suggested to remove the MP5 Acog.

It's a straw man.

No, OP said that because MP5 has low recoil it should have acog removed. Here is definition of straw man "an intentionally misrepresented proposition that is set up because it is easier to defeat than an opponent's real argument.", I didn't do that.

So then why you suggested in the 1st place to remove attackers Acog due their low recoil? Why you're defensive about the MP5 Acog? May I ask you were a Jäger / Bandit "main" when they got Acog or something?
I'm against @OP suggestions of Acog removal, I rather a recoil Nerf, so it forces people to move into other operators, or learn the new recoil pattern.

Some people got used to old release day Buck C8 recoil, why can't the MP5 be the same case? They removed Ash Acog due the R4-C being far superior than the G36C and picked almost always.

[Uncle Sam]

引用自 ExuberantRaptor：

引用自 Mr.Foster(Wolf)：

He didn't got hit hard by the Nerf hammer, like Blackbeard, Ela & Lion did.
His gadget it's the same as always, the dbno mechanics got nerfed. May I ask you, in your opinion did Caveira got buffed due the DBNO hp changes?

I will quote you since it is the perfect reply, "Well that straw man wasn't necessary."

I still don't understand why you say rook got nerfed hard due the DBNO changes, when his gadget wasn't touched since the release of the game.

[Uncle Sam]

引用自 ExuberantRaptor：

引用自 Mr.Foster(Wolf)：

So then why you suggested in the 1st place to remove attackers Acog due their low recoil? Why you're defensive about the MP5 Acog? May I ask you were a Jäger / Bandit "main" when they got Acog or something?
I'm against @OP suggestions of Acog removal, I rather a recoil Nerf, so it forces people to move into other operators, or learn the new recoil pattern.

Some people got used to old release day Buck C8 recoil, why can't the MP5 be the same case? They removed Ash Acog due the R4-C being far superior than the G36C and picked almost always.

Because removing the acog from MP5 because it has low recoil it stupid when there are plenty of guns on attacking side that has low recoil but an acog. Nope, I never was a Jager or Bandit main. I am a Doc and Rook main and have been since I first got the game.

Well then we agree that the removal of the MP5 Acog is stupid, but you don't agree with me that the MP5 could use some horizontal recoil as nerf, maybe because you're a Doc/Rook main and you might be a bit biased.

[Uncle Sam]

引用自 ExuberantRaptor：

引用自 Mr.Foster(Wolf)：

I still don't understand why you say rook got nerfed hard due the DBNO changes, when his gadget wasn't touched since the release of the game.

His gadget is literally based on DBNO. Nerfing DBNO is a direct nerf to him.

His gadget is based on dmg reduction & explosive dmg reduction, the DBNO guarantee it's just the cherry in the top. Because if your opponents do headshot your team often, rook gadget is kinda redundant.
But is good against people who don't headshot often, or people who potato their aim / shots from time to time.

[Uncle Sam]

So can we agree to disagree @exuberant raptor?

[StickNardoragon]

Honestly, the suggestion to add far more recoil the the MP5 is also a likely candidate. Either the ACOG goes, or a lot of recoil should be added on

[kaoz]

引用自 King Ozzy：

I think i'm cool because I mock someone to boost my ego

[Yaki]

Please increase recoil, problem solved.

[Gaming Gamer]

Both weapon is fine where it is, P90 is slightly worse but it doesn't need a buff.

Dev if you're listening, do not touch doc or rook please. they are the most balanced operator in the game.