Siege Ranked MMR

[BuddhaDog]

Just wanted to write some sh!t down in frustration. Ubisoft just posted a guide to the MMR system they use, it doesn't answer a lot of the questions I would have but I don't really care because it's the worst ranking system I have ever come across in a competitive game.

My suggested changes:

1) Remove MMR reset
I dread coming into a new season, whether it's fresh smurf accounts, cheaters or the five stack of diamonds that just blew you and your silver 4 stack away.
Pros- More time for people to settle into their actual skill level.
Cons- No opportunity to reset if friends are outside MMR cap

2)Obviously, get rid of the 'uncertainty' calculation
If you don't know what that is, you can read the blog post, but basically the more you play the less mmr you lose/gain.
Pros- Not getting perpetually stuck in a rank you don't deserve to be in. Unfortunately, there is no universally fair way to judge players skill. I personally have no problem with it being by wins only, however, this does lead to people losing when they are better players than most others in that game. So the idea of a certainty, or uncertainty in rank is preposterous imo, especially as oppressive as it is in R6.
Cons- I don't see any

3)Phone link to accounts
It's not something I would prefer to do, but it must be done.
Pros- Limit cheaters and smurfers ability to create or buy large numbers of accounts. It would add additional cost that would hopefully deter some, especially smurfs.
Cons- Privacy, Do you guys not have phones?

4)Remove Champion Rank
Pros- Less motivation to cheat and smurf
Cons- Less motivation to grind, but all I hear is how much the top players hate ranked anyway (and why shouldn't they?).

5)Solo Q playlist
Just please.

We can also get our precious charms at the end of each season (providing we played 10 or maybe more matches), we just don't have to reset. Yay!

[UbiShoreman]

Originally posted by Da Bouncer:

Just wanted to write some sh!t down in frustration. Ubisoft just posted a guide to the MMR system they use, it doesn't answer a lot of the questions I would have but I don't really care because it's the worst ranking system I have ever come across in a competitive game.

My suggested changes:

1) Remove MMR reset
I dread coming into a new season, whether it's fresh smurf accounts, cheaters or the five stack of diamonds that just blew you and your silver 4 stack away.
Pros- More time for people to settle into their actual skill level.
Cons- No opportunity to reset if friends are outside MMR cap

2)Obviously, get rid of the 'uncertainty' calculation
If you don't know what that is, you can read the blog post, but basically the more you play the less mmr you lose/gain.
Pros- Not getting perpetually stuck in a rank you don't deserve to be in. Unfortunately, there is no universally fair way to judge players skill. I personally have no problem with it being by wins only, however, this does lead to people losing when they are better players than most others in that game. So the idea of a certainty, or uncertainty in rank is preposterous imo, especially as oppressive as it is in R6.
Cons- I don't see any

3)Phone link to accounts
It's not something I would prefer to do, but it must be done.
Pros- Limit cheaters and smurfers ability to create or buy large numbers of accounts. It would add additional cost that would hopefully deter some, especially smurfs.
Cons- Privacy, Do you guys not have phones?

4)Remove Champion Rank
Pros- Less motivation to cheat and smurf
Cons- Less motivation to grind, but all I hear is how much the top players hate ranked anyway (and why shouldn't they?).

5)Solo Q playlist
Just please.

We can also get our precious charms at the end of each season (providing we played 10 or maybe more matches), we just don't have to reset. Yay!

Hey Bouncer! There are some good thoughts going on here!

1) How do you think this would have an effect on players that maybe left the game for a bit and came back at different skill levels? Do you think they would naturally get snapped into their proper rank, or get accused of throwing or boosting?

2)So, I think a con to removing the uncertainty rating would in particular have an effect on players that haven't played as much. The goal of "uncertainty" is really to asses whether a player is new and naturally good, or whether another player is just having a bad game.

To quote the article for an example.
". Hibana faces Pulse (a Copper ranked player, but he has a lot of heart), and loses. Due to the low uncertainty value, it is likely that Hibana just had a bad game, so her skill level would decrease, resulting in μ ≈ 28. This is due to the system taking into account the rank of the enemy you have lost to. If Hibana lost to someone that was Gold, the adjustment would be closer to μ ≈ 28.5. Losing to a Diamond would have resulted in a change to μ ≈ 28.9."

Removing the uncertainty rating would result in flat rate for players that are just "having a bad game" against a lower level player, or players that actually have lower skill getting oddly harsh punishments against players of similar skill.
Obviously the more you play, the more "settled in" your rank will be and the uncertainty value will be less of a factor but for starting out, I think removing it could be pretty rough.

3) We do already require 2FA on PC, are you talking about needing a separate phone number for every individualized account before getting into ranked?

4)Definitely a concept I hadn't heard before, and a very interesting one! That would add quite a few folks to the high Diamond ranking. Do you not feel that there's a skill cutoff big enough to be defined as it's own tier between Diamond and Champion?

5) I've seen several posts asking for this! Doesn't seem like a bad idea, and appreciate the feedback there!

[-|Nur|-]

How is uncertainty "preposterous"? A rank reset combined with a high initial uncertainty value means that players can quickly make their way back to their proper ranks with any deviations from their proper ranks being short-term (assuming they keep playing). As the number of matches piles up, the system has less of a reason to change the player's skill rating as a result of a single game.

[BuddhaDog]

Originally posted by UbiShoreman:

Originally posted by Da Bouncer:

Just wanted to write some sh!t down in frustration. Ubisoft just posted a guide to the MMR system they use, it doesn't answer a lot of the questions I would have but I don't really care because it's the worst ranking system I have ever come across in a competitive game.

My suggested changes:

1) Remove MMR reset
I dread coming into a new season, whether it's fresh smurf accounts, cheaters or the five stack of diamonds that just blew you and your silver 4 stack away.
Pros- More time for people to settle into their actual skill level.
Cons- No opportunity to reset if friends are outside MMR cap

2)Obviously, get rid of the 'uncertainty' calculation
If you don't know what that is, you can read the blog post, but basically the more you play the less mmr you lose/gain.
Pros- Not getting perpetually stuck in a rank you don't deserve to be in. Unfortunately, there is no universally fair way to judge players skill. I personally have no problem with it being by wins only, however, this does lead to people losing when they are better players than most others in that game. So the idea of a certainty, or uncertainty in rank is preposterous imo, especially as oppressive as it is in R6.
Cons- I don't see any

3)Phone link to accounts
It's not something I would prefer to do, but it must be done.
Pros- Limit cheaters and smurfers ability to create or buy large numbers of accounts. It would add additional cost that would hopefully deter some, especially smurfs.
Cons- Privacy, Do you guys not have phones?

4)Remove Champion Rank
Pros- Less motivation to cheat and smurf
Cons- Less motivation to grind, but all I hear is how much the top players hate ranked anyway (and why shouldn't they?).

5)Solo Q playlist
Just please.

We can also get our precious charms at the end of each season (providing we played 10 or maybe more matches), we just don't have to reset. Yay!

Hey Bouncer! There are some good thoughts going on here!

1) How do you think this would have an effect on players that maybe left the game for a bit and came back at different skill levels? Do you think they would naturally get snapped into their proper rank, or get accused of throwing or boosting?

2)So, I think a con to removing the uncertainty rating would in particular have an effect on players that haven't played as much. The goal of "uncertainty" is really to asses whether a player is new and naturally good, or whether another player is just having a bad game.

To quote the article for an example.
". Hibana faces Pulse (a Copper ranked player, but he has a lot of heart), and loses. Due to the low uncertainty value, it is likely that Hibana just had a bad game, so her skill level would decrease, resulting in μ ≈ 28. This is due to the system taking into account the rank of the enemy you have lost to. If Hibana lost to someone that was Gold, the adjustment would be closer to μ ≈ 28.5. Losing to a Diamond would have resulted in a change to μ ≈ 28.9."

Removing the uncertainty rating would result in flat rate for players that are just "having a bad game" against a lower level player, or players that actually have lower skill getting oddly harsh punishments against players of similar skill.
Obviously the more you play, the more "settled in" your rank will be and the uncertainty value will be less of a factor but for starting out, I think removing it could be pretty rough.

3) We do already require 2FA on PC, are you talking about needing a separate phone number for every individualized account before getting into ranked?

4)Definitely a concept I hadn't heard before, and a very interesting one! That would add quite a few folks to the high Diamond ranking. Do you not feel that there's a skill cutoff big enough to be defined as it's own tier between Diamond and Champion?

5) I've seen several posts asking for this! Doesn't seem like a bad idea, and appreciate the feedback there!

It's not perfect, but I think the affect on players would be positive for more people than the current system, it would potentially make it tougher for returning players but the high plat/diamond player coming back into ranked mid season is probably going to have a negative effect on every person in their game, until they are closer to where they should be. The diamond player who goes straight back into diamond might struggle a bit and go down a few ranks but not ruin the experience for everyone.

It would probably take a while for the ranks to settle down, but I feel like that happens every season anyway. My main concern would be that new players or new accounts would negatively affect the experience more than they already do, but again it does happen already and that is why I'm keen to reduce the viability of smurfing. I would do this by making a 2 factor authentication linked to a phone number, rather than just an email. People will set up an email in 2 minutes but getting hold of another phone number would be harder, I think.

I should have said, rather than removing the champion rank, removing the numbered ranks. Alternatively, more restrictions on the requirements to be ranked champion. Number of days since last played perhaps, so cheaters can't get to champion and stop playing but still be no.1.

Thanks for the reply. I love the game, just want to enjoy it more!

[Thesaintdog]

indeed
your a genius


no this aint a joke

[UbiShoreman]

Originally posted by Da Bouncer:

Originally posted by UbiShoreman:

Hey Bouncer! There are some good thoughts going on here!

1) How do you think this would have an effect on players that maybe left the game for a bit and came back at different skill levels? Do you think they would naturally get snapped into their proper rank, or get accused of throwing or boosting?

2)So, I think a con to removing the uncertainty rating would in particular have an effect on players that haven't played as much. The goal of "uncertainty" is really to asses whether a player is new and naturally good, or whether another player is just having a bad game.

To quote the article for an example.
". Hibana faces Pulse (a Copper ranked player, but he has a lot of heart), and loses. Due to the low uncertainty value, it is likely that Hibana just had a bad game, so her skill level would decrease, resulting in μ ≈ 28. This is due to the system taking into account the rank of the enemy you have lost to. If Hibana lost to someone that was Gold, the adjustment would be closer to μ ≈ 28.5. Losing to a Diamond would have resulted in a change to μ ≈ 28.9."

Removing the uncertainty rating would result in flat rate for players that are just "having a bad game" against a lower level player, or players that actually have lower skill getting oddly harsh punishments against players of similar skill.
Obviously the more you play, the more "settled in" your rank will be and the uncertainty value will be less of a factor but for starting out, I think removing it could be pretty rough.

3) We do already require 2FA on PC, are you talking about needing a separate phone number for every individualized account before getting into ranked?

4)Definitely a concept I hadn't heard before, and a very interesting one! That would add quite a few folks to the high Diamond ranking. Do you not feel that there's a skill cutoff big enough to be defined as it's own tier between Diamond and Champion?

5) I've seen several posts asking for this! Doesn't seem like a bad idea, and appreciate the feedback there!

It's not perfect, but I think the affect on players would be positive for more people than the current system, it would potentially make it tougher for returning players but the high plat/diamond player coming back into ranked mid season is probably going to have a negative effect on every person in their game, until they are closer to where they should be. The diamond player who goes straight back into diamond might struggle a bit and go down a few ranks but not ruin the experience for everyone.

It would probably take a while for the ranks to settle down, but I feel like that happens every season anyway. My main concern would be that new players or new accounts would negatively affect the experience more than they already do, but again it does happen already and that is why I'm keen to reduce the viability of smurfing. I would do this by making a 2 factor authentication linked to a phone number, rather than just an email. People will set up an email in 2 minutes but getting hold of another phone number would be harder, I think.

I should have said, rather than removing the champion rank, removing the numbered ranks. Alternatively, more restrictions on the requirements to be ranked champion. Number of days since last played perhaps, so cheaters can't get to champion and stop playing but still be no.1.

Thanks for the reply. I love the game, just want to enjoy it more!

And of course no system is perfect, but community insight is always really fantastic! Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts and laying them out so clearly.