Coop save... please!

[krackle]

Buddy and I snagged this game two days ago, literally never hearing of this game before... random ad on facebook... we started playing tonight and absolutely love it!!! The only problem, after 3+ hours of playing, we have nothing to show for our work... we didn't beat the first mission.. came close a couple times. The game ends up being 1 person camping in a corner while the other tries to solo. Not very fun in that respect. I want to run around killing with him and not taking turns doing it alone.

PLEASE allow saving in coop, even if it's manual and nothe auto. You are punishing anyone who is new or just wants to have fun without fearing a total reset.

Thank you!

[USHiRi-CARROTTRiBE]

Originally posted by Mac:

Originally posted by BurgerDaddy:

So just play it anyway. It's just a video game, what's the worst that could happen?

Because my time to play this specific type of game with my friend is extremely limited, and it would be quite pointless to put an hour into something that will not save our progress even with limited time available.

There are enough other games that can keep my friend and myself occupied in the meanwhile, but I am disheartened that the devs have not given any official word about this issue, no firm committment that they will uphold their promise, and have released a product which was not advertised properly to warn the player-base.

I was sold a drop-in drop-out experience which entails certain elements of flexibility and has specific pre-set standards. They should've either explicitly said that it would be on the hardcore mode only, or they shouldn't have promoted their product as such.

All in all, I just hope they eventually patch this in, as many others seem to do, but going forward I will not be supporting this company with a release date retail price purchase, and will most likely wait till their games are bundled or dead cheap before I indulge (if I decide to).

Now I understand why other players on this very same forum have opted to go down the illegal route of acquisition and have been brazen enough to make these claims in public too.

Scummy dev practices lead to shady player practices.

They will patch it in.. the mentioned it in the update thread in the forum :D

[Mac]

Originally posted by Ushiri Arrowhell Froglover:

For sure, at some point. It'd have made it a far better investment to buy it on sale when they decide to actually release that patch though, thus making day 1 purchases to support devs even more moot in this day and age.

[Mac]

Originally posted by BurgerDaddy:

I think you're just taking video games too seriously. Relax, have fun, try some different tactics, and maybe you'll succeed.

Personally all these complaints I see about the game being too hard have me pretty hype to try it after I beat the first one.

Yeah, I have no doubt playing through the same map endlessly on co-op, eventually you will learn to clear it on hard-mode.

My point was though that with limited time available, and no save checkpoints, even if you do play with your friend, you have to play from the beginning, over and over again unless you actually clear a map. So it isn't exactly drop-in drop-out as advertised.

Have you seriously played a drop-in drop-out game with such amazing features that make you uninstall and refund post-haste? I don't think that's the kind of experience that is typically offered in other such games.

[USHiRi-CARROTTRiBE]

The only other campaign coop game I played in a a big open world (level) is Saints row..so this is extremly original... and the only one for stealth.

[✪Ren]

Originally posted by Mac:

Originally posted by BurgerDaddy:

I think you're just taking video games too seriously. Relax, have fun, try some different tactics, and maybe you'll succeed.

Personally all these complaints I see about the game being too hard have me pretty hype to try it after I beat the first one.

Yeah, I have no doubt playing through the same map endlessly on co-op, eventually you will learn to clear it on hard-mode.

My point was though that with limited time available, and no save checkpoints, even if you do play with your friend, you have to play from the beginning, over and over again unless you actually clear a map. So it isn't exactly drop-in drop-out as advertised.

Have you seriously played a drop-in drop-out game with such amazing features that make you uninstall and refund post-haste? I don't think that's the kind of experience that is typically offered in other such games.

Dude I already have been offensive, but after cleaning easily without any retry mission 3 (and before all others ofc) with a friend I still can't get how can this be a problem that you describe, and all these people who cries about the same.
Thought it would be just "press X to win" experience? You really want that? Go play coop then on some kind of a typical console game lol and you will get it.

You have voice chat, you don't have to be risky at the same time so both will die at the crucial point, you have OP stealth, you probably should have stealth cloak (if you played the game or your friend solo first) and special blade for fast silent kills.
And YES, there are checkpoints - every mission is split to 2-3 locations, so if you die you shouldn't have to repeat all the mission, but the location.
Isn't that still enough?
It's a stupid ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ AI after all - and you have brain (do you?) to analyze and act, use your inventory and etc.
It's the point of the game and it's something that brings fun for people like me who play it and like stealth. If I could save...omg then I guess I wouldn't even play it coz it gonna be just faceroll rush with no point in trying to be stealthy and carefull.

To end 1 mission takes from us about 1 hour. You just said you don't have enough time - so do you have 1 hour then lol?
If you are so bad you can skip doing side missions and just moving towards main one so it will take even less time and will be even easier.

How can this be a problem come on?!

[Mac]

So you're saying I should skip content and limit my experience just because you want to fanboi handhold and walk into the sunset with the devs, who are lazy and didn't code the game properly to begin with, and offer multiple difficulty settings from release date?

Just because you enjoy the game in hardmode, or just because I can speed clear it in 1hour finding the most efficient route or whatnot, doesn't necessarily make it fun for all players to play it at that pace.

People on this thread have bought this game to play with their kids, and wives, and friends of lower skill level. Why should they advertise for a game to be drop-in drop-out if they cannot deliver the experience of what drop-in drop-out really means? It doesn't mean play at hardmode difficulty ONLY, that's for sure... I'll explicate, just in case, to let you know that it directly implies that the exact same experience of singleplayer can at any moment with great ease be enjoyed by a random other friend joining your game and allowing you to seamlessly continue enjoying the exact same experience.

When you're done enjoying the sunset, please inform me how exactly this game fulfills the requirements and promises set by the devs pre-release.

Just because you're a purist and enjoy the game how you like it, doesn't mean the devs can alienate a portion of the community just because they sold something that was advertised differently, and now went into their mancaves all hush hush. The people on this thread, and many others who are silently watching, wouldn't really care if the devs had mentioned how it would play out in co-op, since a large portion wouldn't have bought it to begin with.

But it seems somehow that yourself and two other fanbois are quick to defend the devs for no apparent reason in a thread that has nothing to do with you to begin with, rather than going about doing your thing and enjoying your game, since it was made perfectly for you - in your eyes alone.

If you don't already get why this thread exists and people are asking for co-op saves and difficulty options, I don't think you'll get it later on either. On the plus side, you seem to be enjoying the game to the fullest, so that's something, I guess.

[PJ]

Originally posted by Mac:

I'll explicate, just in case, to let you know that it directly implies that the exact same experience of singleplayer can at any moment with great ease be enjoyed by a random other friend joining your game and allowing you to seamlessly continue enjoying the exact same experience.

That's not true. All that drop-in-drop-out means is that they can join and leave without you having to restart the level. There's nothing about drop-in-drop-out that says the experience must remain exactly the same. In fact, increased difficulty when multiple people are involved is actually a fairly standard practice in video games, since mutliple players makes things easier.

[Mac]

Originally posted by BurgerDaddy:

Originally posted by Mac:

I'll explicate, just in case, to let you know that it directly implies that the exact same experience of singleplayer can at any moment with great ease be enjoyed by a random other friend joining your game and allowing you to seamlessly continue enjoying the exact same experience.

That's not true. All that drop-in-drop-out means is that they can join and leave without you having to restart the level. There's nothing about drop-in-drop-out that says the experience must remain exactly the same. In fact, increased difficulty when multiple people are involved is actually a fairly standard practice in video games, since mutliple players makes things easier.

Increases in HP, or mob count, or damage output are all fine, as they scale the difficulty experience accordingly, as in other games.

A complete change from being able to play it on easymode in Splay and being forced into hardmode in Mplay, is not a drop-in drop-out experience.

Seamless drop-in drop-out also implies that there is little if not no difference noticeable between Splay and Mplay, in the experience the game affords the player and in the easy transition between Splay and Mplay without too many cumbersome configurations or netcode hiccups.

So you're saying that as long as you don't restart the level, the requirements for drop-in drop-out are met. So am I able to start a game on Easymode and let my friend join in, and have the exact same experience in both Splay and Mplay?

Having the game scale to alter the difficulty, in a variety of ways, is OK. They could've scaled the difficulty in this game by making it more punishing with faster detection rates, more guards, less HP for styx, etc. Limiting the game to solely hardmode is not a way to scale difficulty, as per the drop-in drop-out requirements, as it doesn't offer the same experience as in Splay (even if it was scaled).

If the devs had simply stated that the gaming experience in co-op would be SOLELY limited to Hardmode, just like how all other games out there explicitly state that co-op would be limited to Horde mode, or Side missions only, or vs AI only, etc... then it would've been fine, as many of us co-op players would've skipped this title.

But seamless drop-in drop-out co-op sets a different set of standards and expectations. Just because the game experience has been great for you, doesn't mean that it's good, or even acceptable, for everyone.

I'm not asking for the game to be dumbed down, or nerfed, or even claiming that it's too hard for me. I am simply asking for the game to come with the co-op features that I was sold on with. There's absolutely no reason not to have all difficulties as well as save checkpoints in co-op mode, regardless of how easy or not it is.

If you simply want the elite status of being the best of the best in completing this game in hardmode, then the devs can easily add an achievement just for that, so you can proudly display in your profile.

But for the rest of us, how about they deliver what they sold us on, and allow us to play this game with friends and family, of varying skill level, for fun. Again, i'm not asking for it to be nerfed or dumbed down, just to be given the same difficulties and save options as I would in Splay. There's really no reason not to.

Two players do make the game easier, but the same can be said about any other co-op game out there. It's the essence of playing a co-op game. If you want the hardest challenge a game can offer, you play it solo, but when you start adding more players, inadvertently, it just becomes easier just like it is intended.

So why not offer the same opportunity to enjoy this game, truly in co-op mode as intended, in a seamless drop-in drop-out experience? There's really no reason not to. Especially since that is what the devs advertised to begin with.

[PJ]

Originally posted by Mac:

A complete change from being able to play it on easymode in Splay and being forced into hardmode in Mplay, is not a drop-in drop-out experience.

Yes it is, so long as the other player is able to join and leave without you having to restart the level. That's all that a drop-in-drop-out experience implies. If the devs are going to add the features you requested, great - but that doesn't change the definition of drop-in-drop-out, and it certainly doesn't make what you're asking for a "fix", since there wasn't anything broken to be fixed.

[Mac]

Originally posted by BurgerDaddy:

Originally posted by Mac:

A complete change from being able to play it on easymode in Splay and being forced into hardmode in Mplay, is not a drop-in drop-out experience.

Yes it is, so long as the other player is able to join and leave without you having to restart the level. That's all that a drop-in-drop-out experience implies. If the devs are going to add the features you requested, great - but that doesn't change the definition of drop-in-drop-out, and it certainly doesn't make what you're asking for a "fix", since there wasn't anything broken to be fixed.

Ok, so I will start a game on Easymode in Splay, and I am waiting for you to join my game so you can prove your point to me.

Till you can, yes, it needs "fixing".

[PJ]

Originally posted by Mac:

Ok, so I will start a game on Easymode in Splay, and I am waiting for you to join my game so you can prove your point to me.

Till you can, yes, it needs "fixing".

I don't need to prove my point, you've already acknowledged that people can join and leave your game at will. You on the other hand haven't demonstrated that difficulty level not changing is a required part of drop-in-drop-out multiplayer - all you've shown is that you would prefer it to be that way, but that doesn't make it a requirement of the feature. Keep in mind that there are instances of drop-in-drop-out multiplayer where the difficulty does change and nobody complains about it nor implies that it is broken, so you have that working against you.

So until you can prove your claim, no, it does not need fixing. They may however decide to alter the feature.

[USHiRi-CARROTTRiBE]

I´m with mac...he speaks for all of us who doesnt agree that the game deliver very good co-op experience aas it is now.

[Firestorm]

Let me try to put this into a different aspect.

This game is a product, that you pay for. As such, some expectations must be met. These expectations are built up from:
1. Product advertisements.
2. General expectations against the product kind (game).

Before someone starts to argue with the 2nd point, let me state that meeting general expectations are required, because otherwise the product might fail on some pretty important implicitly thought stuff. E.g. a painter software can be advertised as the most rapid and beautiful one, but you will rightfully rage at the developers, if you can't save and load what you created (or you can, but only once every 3 hours).
However, it's ok to fail at general expectations if it's explicitly advertised.

When the product is a game of this kind, a general expectation is not to have to play over and over the same long (>1h) map because you make a mistake at a hard part at the end. A general expectation for one of the loudly advertised main game modes (co-op) not to be hardcore only. These behaviors are absolutely not general nowadays, so they should be stated explicitly, or correctly implemented. Yes, these can be treated as general expectations as we talk about a game that has the main purpose to be entertaining in 2017. The rightful expectations of the p(l)ayerbase are therefore failed in these cases.

Of course, not everybody miss these functions in co-op, but the ones who do, are demanding a fix rightfully. The product is flawed.

BTW, as someone above already posted, some kind of co-op save system is already under implementation, so let's hope it brings salvation to us! I want to love (and buy) Styx, and this is the only obstacle.

[✪Ren]

Ended 4 mission, where you shouldnt be even spotted once, not just being alerted and dead. Completed again in ~1 hour with all side-mission with no retries. Interesting, motivating for stealth even more, and still as possible as previous missions.
It's becoming MORE interesting while increasing the complexity.

At least I will complete this coop anyways before they will fix anything relating to checkpoints for you crybabies.

PS. In this game you cut throats, break necks, and listen much of swearing. Someone mentioned that he bought this game FOR FAMILY, to play with CHILDREN and WIVES.
Just lol. WTF are you thinking about? Children? - Of course not, doesnt matter the difficulty.
Wives? You know there are much more interesting games that you can play with your wife if you know what I mean lol

What is the "drop-in-drop-out" topic can't get at all. You bought this game to play coop with...randoms? Really? Most of you just said that bought it to play with relatives.
Damn, I should have left this trash topic long before, so stay well rakashes

[Firestorm]

Ok, it's my bad. Please learn from my mistake: DO NOT FEED THE TROLL!