Thoughts on Steam Controller for Dota 2

[Munnybear]

I recently just received my Steam Controller and let's just say I am fairly excited. Although I originally bought this in the hope that I can play my FPS games (e.g. CS:Go, L4D2) like I do for Splatoon, the only game (that amounts to any hours) I play nowadays is Dota 2. I've always imagined that Dota could work with a controller just like how I find D3 much more enjoyable on a Playstation 4 (or 3).

After a few hours messing around with the setup and watching quite a few clips on youtube (for both dota 2 or just the steam controller in general) I've come to the conclusion that existing setups don't really work well. There is one video by Woodsie (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvSOKZVB5vo) that stood out above the rest with a more innovative thought of using both pads as mouse however this still doesn't really solve the issue of lack in number of keys and going back and forth between the left pad and analog stick doesn't feel natural.

My understanding of why the steam controller is designed 2 track pads, 1 analog stick, classic 4 button combination and other buttons is mainly allow maximum flexibility. However, good controller experience normally should've involve move all over the controller back and forth (e.g. left pad to analog stick) especially when you may need to press them all at once. In instance when you need to move camera view and cast spell on enemy at once, this is almost impossible (because left thumb needs to be on the analog stick and right thumb will need to hit spell buttons leaving nothing available to move the mouse). Good game play should keep your hand on the controller where your fingers only move when they do not interrupt game play continuity.

With all the above said, here are my thoughts on how dota 2 could be much more fluid but given my limited experience with the controller setup and coding, it would be very much appreciated if the steam community can point out which of the following is doable and how.

1. Setup gyro for camera control. This is one thing that just feel like it should be doable. However, I've tried to set it up under analog camera and d-pad (given that's how the analog stick is setup in some of the current available templates) with no luck. The only thing that I currently have managed to get gyro going in dota 2 seems to be as the mouse (which isn't the worse but I would prefer camera).

2. Setup analog stick as movement. If we can use gyro as camera, then it makes much sense to switch out the analog stick as movement (like when D3 was ported from PC to console). However, since dota 2 is currently fully controlled by mouse click to move, this is fairly unlikely unless we get support from the dota 2 development team.

3. Setup of multiple keys (both combo and sequence) in 1 button. I've seen a template where the analog stick press was setup as ping which consist of alt + left mouse click. However it would also be helpful if i can setup a sequence key for 1 + 1 which is change camera to primary hero as double tap for a track pad (thus freeing single tap for another action or in my preference leave single tap out completely as it could cause a lot of problems).

By now, I've probably lost most if not all of my readers. But for those of you that are still reading (especially the developers) I beg you to jump in and help out or comment on my thoughts above. I am very passionate about the steam controller and would really like to see it work for dota 2. Appreciate those of you who has spent time reading this.

[Vepar]

Well first of all, you won't be playing Dota2 like Diablo 3 on the consoles... Diablo 3 has analog stick movement, and Dota2 simply doesn't have that ability, it's strictly point and click, so you'll be controlling your character with the right trackpad.

It's not bad though, it actually works great, i'm playing Path of Exile and other ARPG's that don't have controller support like this and it works great, it's precise and even better to use because all other buttons and controls are near.

1. You have to set gyro to directional pad or something, then bind arrow keys or whatever controls the camera to it. It won't work as a mouse obviously because mouse in DOTA2 doesn't control the camera all by itself, and Joystick camera is only for Xinput games (it's basically a right analog stick).

2. Now this i can't really answer as i played abount an hour of Dota2 so... Unless they added some keys that control your character, then you can't set the left analog stick as movement... If it's strictly click to move, then you have to use the right track pad for mouse, and triggers or bumpers for mouse inputs. That's the only way, but don't let that discourage you, as i said, it works great. It takes a bit of getting used to, but works. I've gotten so used to it that i can't play any ARPG with a mouse and keyboard anymore. It's just so awkward compared to using the controller... :P

3. You can bind multiple keys to basically anything, when you select a button then on the keyboard part, press Y that will toggle multiple keys mode. Then you can set more of them, but they will act as if you pressed both keys, something like ALT+F4, not like a macro in sequence. I'm not sure if you can program macros on the controller, i don't think you can. As for taps, yes you can set double tap to practically anything, and there's no single tap, you need to click the right pad for that, otherwise any time you put your thumb on the trackpad a command would activate which when controlling a mouse would probably be inconvenient.

And just play with the settings, see what works best. After all, that's part of the fun with the steam controller. :)

Good luck!

[Munnybear]

Thanks for the comments @Vepar ! Now that I've had a whole day to play around with the controller, this is actually harder than I thought it would be... but I also have more to share.

1. I've tried using the directional pad setting, but they really don't function well. Their movement is very linear (better for only horizontal or only vertical movements) and just doesn't feel as smooth as using the left analog stick (please tell me I am wrong and share me a setting to look at). So my only real option for now is to keep the analog stick for camera.

2. I completely understand your point why the analog movement will not be on the table. I've had a rather difficult time with the track pad setup so that it will feel natural whilst maintaining accuracy (especially for quick combo on the battle field). Took a long time to get used to the mouse clicking with triggers. So far I've tried two things, a) use gyro as the mouse, right track pad set on touch to use buttons for item abilities and keep my left thumb on analog stick on all times. The movement with gyro is more accurate than I imagined, but not fast enough (yet) for PVP situations. b) I then moved back to a double mouse on both track pad with one of their sensitivity higher than the other, however this limits the number of buttons that I have left for spell and items so I have to use mode shifting on the ABXY.

3. Limitation with the number of buttons I can use is really catching up to me (like my days back in WOW). I find the multiple keys are most convenient for situations like pinging, I ping a lot in Dota, both ! and X! I feel the controller’s weakest aspect is communication with your team mates because drawing and pinging on mini map is much more difficult. This is something that is very important in a PVP game.

I am hoping to put out at least two sets of Key configurations soon after I’ve had the chance to clean it up (my keys setup on the keyboard is very different to the default ones). Currently trying to fine tune the gyro/track pad sensitivity. I am quite glad you’ve told me that after you’ve spent enough time with the controller that it has become natural, as I find it to be very tiring compared to M+KB which is almost just part of me.

[madjr]

how is going guys so far, any updates?

have you tried with the new action sets or other recently added stuff?

Also I wonder if "mouse region" (specially for joystick movement) works on dota 2 as it does for torchlight 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Thg_iWTfMAc&ab_channel=SteamworksDevelopment

[BrotherO4]

...sigh, if you guys have given up i create a config for you if you like. as a designer im pretty good at making sure of creating smooth config with ease of use.

tips, use the stick for camura movement and make sure its overlap mode so you can move both in the Y and X at the same time.

also remember touch menu will solve your issues here.

[Munnybear]

Originally posted by madjr:

how is going guys so far, any updates?

have you tried with the new action sets or other recently added stuff?

Also I wonder if "mouse region" (specially for joystick movement) works on dota 2 as it does for torchlight 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Thg_iWTfMAc&ab_channel=SteamworksDevelopment

Have you had a try at my SC setup (munny's dota 2 setup v2)?

I understand where you are coming from for the mouse region, but unfortunately as dota 2 does not support controller play, this means you can't use the joystick as action movement input. Without the joystick this makes the directional input using the trackpad almost meaningless. There is a function named "mouse region" in the configuration, but it's not what was shown in your video nor do I find it more useful than the regular mouse input in dota 2.

The joystick movement input was 1 of the things I said I would like in an earlier part of this discussion. However, I now see this as something that is less useful in dota 2 compared to games like tourch light and D3 (on console). This is mainly because dota 2 is a PVP game rather than an exploration game, which means you should be constantly moving your camera to understand what is going on in your game and the joystick is the most effective at doing this.

Have a go at my configuration, it is the best I've had after trying everything else out there in the community. Of course, this is also personal preference and your experience will probably be different and I would love to hear some feedbacks.

[madjr]

cool.

Thanks guys I'll be sure to check those settings out, once I get another SC (mine unfortunately was recently stolen ).

[Munnybear]

Originally posted by madjr:

cool.

Thanks guys I'll be sure to check those settings out, once I get another SC (mine unfortunately was recently stolen ).

lol... what? as in someone broke in to your house and stole a steam controller? must be some sort of gamer thief....

[madjr]

Originally posted by Munnybear:

Originally posted by madjr:

cool.

Thanks guys I'll be sure to check those settings out, once I get another SC (mine unfortunately was recently stolen ).

lol... what? as in someone broke in to your house and stole a steam controller? must be some sort of gamer thief....

Probably someone that knows me... I will need to get a safe or install cameras.

out of all things only my SC been missing (that I know of) ... lol