Combat Tips?

[thesecretpenguin]

I'm new to the tales of series, and I'm having some trouble with the combat. Currently, it just feels like me mashing the mouse buttons and doing nothing else. I don't understand how to use attacks that aren't the right and left mouse buttons, but yet they still seem to be getting cast for me. Anyone who could provide some tips for a beginner on how to get more out of combat besides button mashing, that would be great! Thanks.

[Need$leep]

you'll get a few more "skills" for combat in your playthrough. And you get more so called artes with you can mix up for combos and co. just give it some time you will figure it out :)

[wgridenour]

also, check your control type, there is automatic, semi-manual and manual. the first is pretty much the entire battle 4 u,, the 2nd casts the most appopriate arte for the equipped seraph (dont forget you can change serough while in battle) 3rd you must enter all presses to uses any type of arte.

[thesecretpenguin]

Originally posted by wgridenour:

also, check your control type, there is automatic, semi-manual and manual. the first is pretty much the entire battle 4 u,, the 2nd casts the most appopriate arte for the equipped seraph (dont forget you can change serough while in battle) 3rd you must enter all presses to uses any type of arte.

Ok I was wondering about that. Im on semi auto right now, so it casts artes for me? I dont have to do anything?

[RegalStar]

On semi-auto, if your first arte of the combo is a martial/hidden arte (ie. the ones that don't require casting and can't hit stuff from anywhere), and your character is actually out of range to hit the Target with said arte, the game will make your character run up to the target before executing it. On manual it will instead cause your character to swing on the spot, regardless of whether there's actually something (besides some unsuspecting air) for that arte to hit.

[bojangles]

Hey, sorry to bump this, but I had the same problem. It just feels like the game is playing itself if you don't understand the combat. And, imo, this game does a *terrible* job at explaining the basics to new players. And Simple~Moderate difficulty is so easy that mashing buttons is usually enough to beat everything. It's bad design.

So, hopefully this will help you.

Basically, you have a 4 hit combo. Left-click attacks are called Martial Artes. The MA your character uses is determined by two things:

- Holding W, A, S, or D + Left-click (or no key + Left-click)
- The hit # in your combo (Hit 1, Hit 2, Hit 3, and Hit 4)

For example, Sorey has an MA called "Freezing Strike." It can only be used when you're on Hit #2 of your combo, and by pressing A + Left-click. As you level up, you unlock more MA's. Side-stepping (tapping a directional key) counts as part of your combo. So, if you were to dodge to the left, your next attack would count as Hit #2. Guarding resets your combo.

Right-click attacks are called Hidden Artes and Seraphic Artes, depending on the character. You can use HA and SA at any time in a combo. SA's have reduced casting time the farther you are into a combo. So um, a common strategy is to back-step 2~3 times, then use a SA. Controls depend on how you set them in the Artes menu. On default, right-click will select a random one.

"Armatization" uses a 3 hit combo system. Same rules apply. However, left-click attacks count as Hidden Artes, but they follow the hit system.

The Artes menu will tell you info about your attacks. Like, elemental property, which type of monster (Fiend, Flying, etc) it's strong against, side-effects, and SC cost. Obviously you wanna use Water attacks on things weak to Water, Fiend attacks on Fiend monsters, etc. Oh, and there's a way to see the Hit # of each attack, but I forget exactly how to see it... You click something that says like "^Martial Artes" in the Artes menu.

And um, there's more to it, but you'll learn it as you go. Most important things to understand are the combo and hit # thingy, and hitting a monster's weakness.

[Simon]

Tales game isn't suitable for playing by mouse, you should play using the keyboard. Or a controller. On Semi-auto, pressing "attack" will make it run up to the targeted enemy and attack. On manual, you have to run up to the enemy yourself and attack. If not, then you are just attacking at where you are standing.

[Stabbey]

It took me until like level 40 to get a hang for the mouse + keyboard combat. Of course, part of that was me being an idiot and not properly reading the Seraphic Art upgrade Battle Action (I thought you had to tap RIGHT-click to upgrade to a higher level art instead of LEFT-click. Needless to say learning that made using Seraphic Arts much easier.


I also didn't really understand that the top row of Martial Arts was for commands with no direction input. I thought it might be for pressing BOTH W and S at the same time.

To be honest, I still might not understand the top row of Martial Arts. When you perform an art it shows up at the top of the screen, but even trying, not touching the arrow keys and left-clicking, I can't get the names of those top-row Martial Arts to show up. Are they hidden, or am I doing something wrong (like should I not be moving the mouse at all?)

[bojangles]

Originally posted by Stabbey:

It took me until like level 40 to get a hang for the mouse + keyboard combat. Of course, part of that was me being an idiot and not properly reading the Seraphic Art upgrade Battle Action (I thought you had to tap RIGHT-click to upgrade to a higher level art instead of LEFT-click. Needless to say learning that made using Seraphic Arts much easier.


I also didn't really understand that the top row of Martial Arts was for commands with no direction input. I thought it might be for pressing BOTH W and S at the same time.

To be honest, I still might not understand the top row of Martial Arts. When you perform an art it shows up at the top of the screen, but even trying, not touching the arrow keys and left-clicking, I can't get the names of those top-row Martial Arts to show up. Are they hidden, or am I doing something wrong (like should I not be moving the mouse at all?)

I'm not sure why but the names of some MA's don't appear at the top of the screen. Your character is definitely still doing them though.

[Kamikaze Ice]

I was confused with this battle system when I first played Graces. I was trying to play it like the other Tales games.

Once I realized what was going on, it made perfect sense to me. What made everything "click" for me was talking to a friend about the Gothic games, which has a similar (read: akward) battle system involving movement buttons and an attack button.

I think the system is pretty straight forward at the beginning of the game, since you have limited options to play with. But playing on anything lower than Hard is, in my opinion, just a disservice to the player as you will steamroll everything without thinking about what you're doing.

I think until one becomes more familiar with the battle system, they should think more about how they want to move while attacking.
Want to move slightly left or right? Press the stick that way and attack.
Want to just attack what is infront of you and not to the sides? Move the stick up or down and attack.
Need to hit all of them around you? Stand still and attack.

I do think the Martial Artes tree could have made alot more sense to new players with a different interface design. It's basically a 4 question multiple choice quiz.
Attack 1 = Column 1, and you have 4 (3 if seraph) options. Pick one, and move on to the next question (attack 2 = column 2), etc., etc.
You must answer all questions in order. You can dodge the questions you don't want to answer (dodge questions aka attacks 1-3, and just do answer/attack/cast 4)

I find putting the combo timeframe in the options to LONG works better for me, since I don't like spamming my attacks and would rather play reactively (i.e. I like to confirm my next attack right as my current one ends).
Then again, I play with a controller. IMO, this game is suited for it and it feels wrong if I play it any other way (like racing games without a wheel, fighters without a stick, or FPS without KB+M)

[Kamikaze Ice]

Originally posted by Bojangles:

I'm not sure why but the names of some MA's don't appear at the top of the screen. Your character is definitely still doing them though.

With all of the martial arts (i.e. basic attacks) going on by everyone on the screen, there is not enough room to show them all up there when they're used. I wouldn't be suprised if they only showed up for X number of uses (like every 3-5) or had some priority/queue system going on (martial arts<hidden artes<seraphic<mystic, offense<supportive<healing, player<enemy<boss)
or it could be a first come first serve basis for the first one to get triggered after the "current" one dissapears.

You won't notice it when your playing the harder difficulty levels, because you'll be to busy to care :P

[thesecretpenguin]

Thanks for all the help everyone! I think it makes a little more sense now, I figure I'll get better as I play more!

[Baalk]

Originally posted by thesecretpenguin:

Thanks for all the help everyone! I think it makes a little more sense now, I figure I'll get better as I play more!

Yup the first hours are always like that. you don't know wtf are you doing. + Read all the monoliths they provide good tips for combats and stuffs

[Faint]

If you stick all the seraphs on 75% for the healing you can give yourself a lot more leeway in battle. If you not experienced you could do what I did and use the special moves a lot more often until you get used to it. Hack and slash doesn't work but mashing the special moves does in the beginning, even on chaos. The only time you'll really need to worry about defense is on optional bosses if you dedicate your seraphs to stay focused on health

[Kamikaze Ice]

Here's the tactics I finally settled on using. Very rarely does the AI just completely go stupid, but when it does not even the right-stick battle commands will help (whatever keyboard setting makes your controlled character in combat yell out defend, focus, charge, or fall back).
I still can't get the 150 hit combo, simply because the AI randomly gets indigestion and stops to run to the other side of the battle field, take a fart, and zig-zag sidestep electric hokey-pokey slide their way back towards the forever alone enemy (this was when I was farming chests, and everyone set to melee my target@all-out close combat and never mind HP and don't use blasts). Other than those moments, which I swear are out of my control (including using titles to influence AI) it has worked very well.

I will list my settings in columns (Action || Tactics || Atk. Rate || Def./Healing || Blast)
All Humans: Interfere with Enemy Artes, Aim for weakness, Balanced, Watch Health, For Defense
All Seraphs: Split up and Attack, Engage at Range, Balanced, Watch Health , Do Not Use
*note: I turn off 6 seraphic artes (3 each on two seraphs--they're melee range skills, leaving them with only one trio/chain they can cast at range), and one particular martial arte on a particular human member to stop them from waisting time by running away from combat just to use it in the far corner where it's useless*

This lets your human AI to start power combos for everyone as they can hit all weaknesses, and with no real ranged attacks (seraphic artes) they will always be in melee range if they have >75% health.
The Seraphs will heal others depending on what you set them to. I found Watch Health (heal if <75%) to be the most overall effective setting. They will toss their "quick" heals out if over 50%, use their "slow" heal if <50% or have a status effect they can cure, and when in danger the human AI partner, if avalible, will armatize if he/she is not in the middle of a combo.
And the humans will armatize when they get low, and may stay armatized for a while or not depending on your title settings, enemies and other party member status. They will spam their spells otherwise.

You can also time your swap out of a seraph mid battle so they avoid attacks (like from a boss), or you are fighting alot of caster/game enemies so everyone tries to interupt them.
*note: this is SUPER handy with how stupid the AI is*

Special note: Titles effect AI tendancy behavior (favoring martial artes vs hidden/seraphic artes)
I think each character gets 6 titles, 3 to start with and 3 from story/sidequests.
The same AI behavior for each title is in the same slot for every character.
The slots are as they are listed in-game (top to bottom).
Title 1 = Martial artes tendancy
Title 2 = ???
Title 3 = Offensive hidden/seraphic artes tendancy
Title 4 = Tank Tendancy (has a most likely to be targeted bonus, which I find useless with the games terrible enemy AI)
Title 5 = Defensive hidden/seraphic artes tendancy
Title 6 = ???
I have no clue how slot 2/6 titles effect AI tendancies. The others behave as expected from title descriptions and effects.
Example with Mikleo @ start of the game. Title 1 = Staff Wielder, 2 = Water Master and 3 = Water Caster

I switch titles around to fit the situation, but typically have seraphs with slot 5 and humans with slot 3.
Also, you can change titles in combat.

A very OP/cheap tactic is to use slot 1 titles to get that increased chance the first hit will stun the target, and then change to slot 3 titles for the increased damage to stunned enemies and unleash everyones mystic artes. This will obliterate nearly everything in seconds If you have alot of Rangus skills (+20% damage to stunned targets) on your gear.
This sounds like a typical VeghEsther tactic (see: His/her posts for many RPG games@Gamefaqs, and the joke-but-still-true wiki page at http://namcotales.wikia.com/wiki/VeghEsther )

[Random Noises]

Originally posted by Kamikaze Ice:

I think the system is pretty straight forward at the beginning of the game, since you have limited options to play with. But playing on anything lower than Hard is, in my opinion, just a disservice to the player as you will steamroll everything without thinking about what you're doing.

That's hardly fair considering how diffiuclt it is to prevent the AI from getting killied during most boss fights.

I played on moderate and I had to take most of the game's mechanics into consideration to get through. Maybe I'm just terrible at the game. -_-

That said, I'd actually recommend moderate to the OP if they want to put some effort into the game, but still get through it without tearing their hair out. Normal will give a more relaxed experience.