Let's talk, Beds

[Enuin Rose]

So let's talk beds shall we.

What do beds do, they provide you with an respawn point.
They let you travel between bases (you do drop your inv, so it's like respawning)
And everyone seems to blunder right into said bases and smash them to bits.
Why? Well, to be jerks flat out, and there's no real reson for that.
Easily solved to.

So, some of you might say, I'm being "salty" as that's what being upset, or annoyed at something these days is called, apparently.

But hear me out here.

Currently beds have like 1000hp*, it takes someone less than 4 minutes (probably even less) to break it with an tool.
*the first one you can make, that's not a sleeping bag.

You log out for, I dunno, 6 hours at least like an reasonable human to sleep. And let's not forget work etc.
So the chances are pretty good, someone breaks through your walls (they have hours) and break your bed.
(raid your base etc, but that's ok, it's part of the game)

What's the advantage to breaking a bed? Well it prevents the person from respawning at that location. Forever. untill they build a new bed.
Which if you're raiding a base, might be smart.
Except, they'll respawn in their underwear. With nothing but their fists.
(But hey, that can be dangerous I hear you say, and that is true)
But y'know, most people are "unconsious" already. (this means they're either literally unconscious ingame, or not logged in)
And thusly, no threath.

So y'know, mostly, it's just an Jerkish thing to do.

And I propose an idea/solution to make it a bit of an less jerkish thing to everyone.

Beds become indestructible except by admins and the owner(tribe/player)
Beds will have an respawn timer introduced.
(this can be a flat respawn timer, or a respawn timer triggered by damage dealt to the bed.
(as in hitting the bed, not actually damaging it)
This timer would prevent people from endlessly respawning while their base is raided.
In short, raiders get to run away with loot, you get to wake up in your base, now with better air conditioning and more storage area/space for your, uhm, future stuff.
And you get to repair the aftermath.

Personally I think mortar pestels etc should be included but eh, it's not as major an loss as a bed is to an outpost/base.

Anyway. That's my solution to get roughly the same result, just less of an way that leaves an bitter aftertaste in the owners mouth, and is less of an horrible thing to do by players

(I'd also like to mention, if you enjoy the idea of breaking someone's bed ingame, and you revel at that, you're a jerk.)

Sincirely, a tribeswoman who was hoping to surprise her tribe with an outpost to respawn in :(

[scrappybristol]

wht did you build your outpost out of?

Thatch?

Wood is almost indescructible by low level people.

[Enuin Rose]

Well, I did built it out of thatch, but unless wood has a far greater durability (as in you do less damage to it) then it just takes 10 times longer to break into a wooden wall.

Considering it took someone 4 minutes to break into my base, that'd be 40 minutes, still more than plenty time to break into someones base. Also strength of walls isn't the thing being brought up in this post.

I'd like to keep it focused on beds.
(the flamability of my base and how it's a glorified campfire waiting to happen, is not really the point of this post)

[scrappybristol]

Wooden material can't be broken by stone materials or punching which makes it infinitely better than thatch.

Only level 25+ players or really big dinos would be able to knock those walls.

[Viperdh]

I built mine with wood, went to sleep, woke up, all gone.

[Enuin Rose]

Okay, that's a good plus for wooden buildings then (kind of makes thatch a useless contstruction material and a waste of points then, but whateves.)

Again though, let's keep this focused on the bed mechanics and such if you don't mind.
Base wall strength wasn't particulary the point of this discussion.

[Viperdh]

Well on the topic of bed mechanics, While I was just starting to build my wooden house....

I was in my thatch house and some lvl 2 came up behind me and killed me, lucky I had a sleeping bag in my wooden house right next door, I spawned, came up behind him and got my revenge instantly while he was still busy looting my body.

There should be a delay on respawning, otherwise people are just going to hide beds sleeping bags around there base to respawn as much as needed to defend an attack. Killed by player, or player pet 1 min before you can spawn, if your bag/bed his hit/takes any damage 5 mins before you can respawn.

This way you'd come back after 5 minutes, they should have left with everything they can carry and you can rebuild.

[Intra]

It's mostly annoying that it might take some time to cut into a house with wood, but it's still worth it. It shouldn't be so easy risk vs reward to cut into a base like that.

I'm probably going to build a base off the ground and make a solitary pathway that needs like 4 gates to be broken through with dinos ready to trounce people who get past the 2nd set of gates. Then have a bunch of trick rooms made of thatch so if someone somehow levels up enough to fly into the base, they'd have to cut down a lot to get to items or beds.

Since you can fit spitters inside doorways, I'd probably keep like 5 indoors to kill people who get through those. Apparently they don't use much meat if they aren't being used by a player.

[Rodso]

Originally posted by Daniel:

I built mine with wood, went to sleep, woke up, all gone.

ive seen wild dinos "rampage" through peoples bases

[Crux]

I swear my sleeping bag vanished after 1 respawn, can't be 100% sure though, I CAN say the bed had a cooldown though.

[Rodso]

Originally posted by DPS StevenCrux:

I swear my sleeping bag vanished after 1 respawn, can't be 100% sure though, I CAN say the bed had a cooldown though.

yeah sleeping bags are a 1 use item

[Crux]

Originally posted by Rodso:

Originally posted by DPS StevenCrux:

I swear my sleeping bag vanished after 1 respawn, can't be 100% sure though, I CAN say the bed had a cooldown though.

yeah sleeping bags are a 1 use item

SO, beds are balanced as far as respawn, making them unbreakable, or HARDER to break, would seem to fit in better with the way the game seems to be set up.

In my opinion the issue with most survival games is: Reaching the higher things is based on either LUCK or having a GROUP. With luck you may climb the tree to having better gear, less likely to be robbed while ofline or killed while online, issue is getting there.

IMHO the lower teir of these games should be easier, and they higher teir harder. I can't get my hands on the first tool without taking damage since hitting a tree for wood/thatch hurts me...that's a tuff cut for a freshy. If low-tier was easier to get mats for, while high teir remained harder, that's a good balance. Spears are a good first weapon for hunting things that run rather then fight (easiest target for low levels) but they weigh so much, you can't really carry many untill your high enough you'd rather use a bow.

BUT ON THE TOPIC OF BEDS, I say the same, maybe make sleeping bags take less hide? Cause dying while trying to gather hide for a one-time use sleeping bag quickly becomes pointless, and having your bed broken when you FINALLY got one of them done? It's bad enough to wake up in a empty base with the door missing, even worse to wake up on the beach knowing the only thing you have to show for your hours is your level =/

[Elrondel]

Beds are balanced. However, I would agree with making sleeping bags cost a little less hide. If you guys remember Minecraft, a Bed cost nearly nothing to make. They were also easily destroyable. I'd like sleeping bags to be like this..one - time use, easy to make (5 hide maybe) and increase the respawn timer to 30 seconds.

[Swarmrein]

As far as i understand, the sleepeng bags (the hide one), is 1 time use, and you can put only 1. If you put 1 sleeping bags inside the base, and another one outside, you will lose the bags inside the base. What i don't know is how the "simple bad" works. IS a 1 time use also? You can build more than 1 in different places?

[[GOTR] Cetrius]

Sleeping bags are single use - they are destroyed after respawning at one
Sleeping bags are set to MAX one per server (active) placing a second removes the first.
Wooden Beds (second available bed) is a permament fixture - its not destoryed on respawns
Wooden Beds have a 5 min cooldown - there is no spam respawning;
That 5 min cooldown applies to Tribes as well - Tribe member 1 respawns, tribe member 2 is affected by the 5min cooldown;

The point of destroying their bed on a raid is because when they respawn / If they respawning during the raid - eg; they log on whilst you are busy raiding; prevents them from instantly spawning in their house - armed or not, it means you have more time to raid and escape before being detected.
If you knew who raided you; you would know that they are probably nearby and can counter raid them next chance you get;
So you may never know that your 'friendly' neighbour is actually the guy who logs on during your sleepy time and drains you of blood or fills your butt with berries.

Personal opinion - bed destroying is a perfectly sane thing to do; especially considering they introduced 8 more spawn points, you wont spawn too far from home, unless you live in the center of the map - then having a well designed and multi-walled house is a must. also having secondary beds / outposts nearby is a smart thing to do.


Side topic of houses;
Thatch is fine for starting, if you are just throwing down shelter - it should not be a permament structure - however, you can replace the walls / door frame / floor / roof / foundation with the next teir of structure - or even the final teir - just by placing it down.
This allows you to very cheaply plan your house out with thatch, then replace it with wood - which becomes expensive rather fast - unless you dont care for deforestation.

Walls - you cant damage a wooden wall with stone tools or fists.
You require metal tools - and even then, a wooden wall ( pre 171.7 patch "- Structures now have 50% increase damage resistance globally. " ) took Almost a full metal axe to destroy - so post patch, means it takes a full axe to destroy a wall, it'll almost take a full one to destroy a wooden door, if my math is right;
So, you can make it extremely expensive for a raider to break into your house if you have a double-door system, or a surrounding wall around your house;
And raiders hate expensive raiding - if you have no metal in your wooden house, they wont want to waste 1+ or even 2+ tools breaking in.

Second side note - that patch, 171.7 - unsure if that applies to beds, they break easily anyway, but if a raider gets inside, they should be able to break the bed.

Originally posted by crimefridge:

I'm probably going to build a base off the ground and make a solitary pathway that needs like 4 gates to be broken through with dinos ready to trounce people who get past the 2nd set of gates.

Careful with that - taking out the supports will cause your house to come crumbling down

[Swarmrein]

Originally posted by Cetrius:

Sleeping bags are single use - they are destroyed after respawning at one
Sleeping bags are set to MAX one per server (active) placing a second removes the first.
Wooden Beds (second available bed) is a permament fixture - its not destoryed on respawns
Wooden Beds have a 5 min cooldown - there is no spam respawning;
That 5 min cooldown applies to Tribes as well - Tribe member 1 respawns, tribe member 2 is affected by the 5min cooldown;

The point of destroying their bed on a raid is because when they respawn / If they respawning during the raid - eg; they log on whilst you are busy raiding; prevents them from instantly spawning in their house - armed or not, it means you have more time to raid and escape before being detected.
If you knew who raided you; you would know that they are probably nearby and can counter raid them next chance you get;
So you may never know that your 'friendly' neighbour is actually the guy who logs on during your sleepy time and drains you of blood or fills your butt with berries.

Personal opinion - bed destroying is a perfectly sane thing to do; especially considering they introduced 8 more spawn points, you wont spawn too far from home, unless you live in the center of the map - then having a well designed and multi-walled house is a must. also having secondary beds / outposts nearby is a smart thing to do.


Side topic of houses;
Thatch is fine for starting, if you are just throwing down shelter - it should not be a permament structure - however, you can replace the walls / door frame / floor / roof / foundation with the next teir of structure - or even the final teir - just by placing it down.
This allows you to very cheaply plan your house out with thatch, then replace it with wood - which becomes expensive rather fast - unless you dont care for deforestation.

Walls - you cant damage a wooden wall with stone tools or fists.
You require metal tools - and even then, a wooden wall ( pre 171.7 patch "- Structures now have 50% increase damage resistance globally. " ) took Almost a full metal axe to destroy - so post patch, means it takes a full axe to destroy a wall, it'll almost take a full one to destroy a wooden door, if my math is right;
So, you can make it extremely expensive for a raider to break into your house if you have a double-door system, or a surrounding wall around your house;
And raiders hate expensive raiding - if you have no metal in your wooden house, they wont want to waste 1+ or even 2+ tools breaking in.

Second side note - that patch, 171.7 - unsure if that applies to beds, they break easily anyway, but if a raider gets inside, they should be able to break the bed.

Originally posted by crimefridge:

I'm probably going to build a base off the ground and make a solitary pathway that needs like 4 gates to be broken through with dinos ready to trounce people who get past the 2nd set of gates.

Careful with that - taking out the supports will cause your house to come crumbling down

4
I didn't understand how you put a second wall in your house. All building have snap, and as i could see quckly, without a snap you can't build right? Or you can build a wall without foundation, or in a nother point of the foundation without the snap.