Industrial forge.... Another novelty?

[Steel Jacket]

Serious discussion about a growing problem in ark. I love the new tech tiers I really do, I want to see stuff like this forge added they look so awesome and make it feel like you are still progressing. However they are all turning into retractions. A tribe that spends the resources to make this thing is going to fall behind in pvp and these are just a few reasons why.

Cost effectiveness. The cost of this forge is insane, building this forge alone will set my tribe back in pvp so there's no real reason to make this thing.

Usefulness once made. This thing burns gas, which in pvp when you're already running tons of generators so you can't be knocked out by the enemy finding your 1 genny means we don't want to waste gas on something that we really don't need to waste the gas on.

Reduction to momentum. By producing this forge we are cutting ourselves off from 1 useful resource that we also make en masse when we do masse smelting, and that's charcoal. We use more charcoal than metal while fighting, so smelting more metal without making charcoal just means we would need to use gas and wood, meaning we still need the normal forges running to produce our gunpowder anyways.

Issue of space. This thing is huge, ridiculously so. By having this we need to build an even bigger base and building an even bigger base + the multiple players of steel on the outter rim means we have to expend and even greater amount of metal and resources just to house this thing. Again more waste that just doesn't work for pvp.

Engram point waste. 90 EP? That's insane, the amount of items a player cuts themselves off from by choosing this is just crazy, especially when it's not really providing a benefit.

All in all this thing is a novelty. It would be awesome to see in pve, again not very useful but nice to look at indeed.

A way to fix the "novelty" problem is actually really simple. Give this bad boy the option to run on wood. Then you could increase the amount of charcoal it supplies and even increase the amount of metal you get, not by alot, but by enough to make it worth it.

For instance you could make the forge smelt 20 metal every 15 seconds instead of 30 every 20 but instead of getting 10 ingots you could get 11 ingots for a 10% increase. You could also make the forge consume 10 wood every 30 seconds but give 12 charcoal in return.

By making these very minor changes you could make a novelty item into a useful item, still extremely expensive, but possible to get a return on given enough up time on the forge.

Until there are changes (highly unlikely) unfortunately this item will not see much use in any serious pvp tribes.

Just my 2 cents from a pvp perspective since 90% of my time playing this game has been pvp oriented. PvE players will probably enjoy the new toy though.

Cheers.

[Steel Jacket]

Just the perspective of a pvper, don't flame me I'm just pointing out a problem with the higher tech tier stuff not really fitting into pvp due to cost vs effect. When time in > benefits compared to the lower tech tiers the game will always stay in the middle tech tier.

[Silver Salvation]

why is the engram on lv 85!? <_<

[Shion]

What HAVEN'T they added to the game recently that WASN'T a novelty? Because honestly, I cannot really think of anything besides maybe the angler and its gel.

[Sean]

Actually. In our serious PVP tribe, we are all building one. Cementing paste is easy. Metal is easy. Polymer is even easier. If you are level 85, and are complaining about 2500 metal ingots, then your tribe is doing it wrong.

One quetz and one ankyl can get you 10k ingots in a few hours. We do this every few days.

One quetz and one ankyl will get you 3k oil in 30 minutes. We do this once a week.

One frog will get you 800 cemetning paste in 1 hour. We do this each morning when spawns are fresh.

And, still, we build and prepare for pvp. We prepare for new updates with stockpiling resources. We prepare for war by always having supplies on hand. This is far too cheap for the benefits, to be honest.

[FredTA]

Yeah, I kind of agree, this sort of fits into the category of gathering the resources and spending the EP to make the composite bow, and then it turning out worse than the crossbow

[FredTA]

Originally posted by Seands9:

Actually. In our serious PVP tribe, we are all building one. Cementing paste is easy. Metal is easy. Polymer is even easier. If you are level 85, and are complaining about 2500 metal ingots, then your tribe is doing it wrong.

One quetz and one ankyl can get you 10k ingots in a few hours. We do this every few days.

One quetz and one ankyl will get you 3k oil in 30 minutes. We do this once a week.

One frog will get you 800 cemetning paste in 1 hour. We do this each morning when spawns are fresh.

And, still, we build and prepare for pvp. We prepare for new updates with stockpiling resources. We prepare for war by always having supplies on hand. This is far too cheap for the benefits, to be honest.

For a big tribe maybe, but what about people who play solo?

[のらとムれ]

for pve is a great item, and about the charcoal... the industrial oven will maybe produce it

[Steel Jacket]

Originally posted by Eldar Seer:

What HAVEN'T they added to the game recently that WASN'T a novelty? Because honestly, I cannot really think of anything besides maybe the angler and its gel.

Exactly. It's a growing trend that the higher tiers are just not worth it comparatively to the lower tiers. One I hope they can curb so the upper tiers can see some use outside pve flash.

[Drago]

Originally posted by Eldar Seer:

What HAVEN'T they added to the game recently that WASN'T a novelty? Because honestly, I cannot really think of anything besides maybe the angler and its gel.

Once they fixed TOTALY BROKEN at release tranq darts they became usefu but it took them a few weeks to figure out they were broken.

[yabadabadoo]

Seands9 what type of server you play on and what sort of pop?

[Evir the Warrior]

Originally posted by That rock over there:

For a big tribe maybe, but what about people who play solo?

You can do this with a tribe of 2 honestly, I have seen it done, I have done it on different servers.

I am pretty sure you can do this solo also, but it would be more difficult.

I am not sure why anyone would play solo on a game like this, there is a single player mode for that. If you are looking to be that one guy that stands up to large tribes, you will most likely fail every time.

[DrathDragoon33]

Personally, I think the new forge is fantastic.

Just my 2 cents on it. Way better than dealing with 12 forges. Plus, I can fit 2 on my quetzal, which is like putting 30 refining forges on it. pfffft, amazing.

[Steel Jacket]

Originally posted by Seands9:

Actually. In our serious PVP tribe, we are all building one. Cementing paste is easy. Metal is easy. Polymer is even easier. If you are level 85, and are complaining about 2500 metal ingots, then your tribe is doing it wrong.

One quetz and one ankyl can get you 10k ingots in a few hours. We do this every few days.

One quetz and one ankyl will get you 3k oil in 30 minutes. We do this once a week.

One frog will get you 800 cemetning paste in 1 hour. We do this each morning when spawns are fresh.

And, still, we build and prepare for pvp. We prepare for new updates with stockpiling resources. We prepare for war by always having supplies on hand. This is far too cheap for the benefits, to be honest.

10k every few days? That's minimum 1 day for my tribe, no offense. 3k oil once a week?! This is again minimum for every 2-3 days. 800cp is nothing. If you stockpile resources in pvp you're going to get squashed by any serious pvp tribe. My tribe has wiped out 3 major tribes on our server by repeatedly raiding and stealing. If you stockpile resources a decent tribe will raid you and take them from you. On a war day it's not uncommon for my tribe and our alliance to go through dozens of c4 dozens of rockets from 150% rockets + and however many grenades we see as necessary.

If you have the time to spend making this forge and you don't get blown off the map by a tribe that uses those same resources for explosives you're not on a competitive pvp server. 10vs10 fights are extremely common on my server on a daily basis, there is no time to waste on something this expensive. It is not worth it since there's only so much metal you can bring back to it. My tribe runs 16 forges for hours on end and we can't supply them metal fast enough, and we use up all the charcoal, a giant furnace does not add anything to the game, not in its current state.

Again I am not saying the amount of resources is high, it's not, all that can be farmed in under an hour by my tribe. The problem is that that's 1 hour we aren't spending crushing other tribes, which on my server will get you wiped out. Especially when you factor in the space you need to build for it. You HAVE to house that thing in metal or else a few nades and the enemy is in and your expensive forge is forfeit before it even sees enough use to warrant making it.

[Darckray]

Originally posted by DrathDragoon33:

Personally, I think the new forge is fantastic.

Just my 2 cents on it. Way better than dealing with 12 forges. Plus, I can fit 2 on my quetzal, which is like putting 30 refining forges on it. pfffft, amazing.

These things should not be for high level players (i'm lvl 82 but still) neither should their cost be that high compared to the industrial grill...

I don't really care about the cost (it needs a nerf still) but i do care about their size, i can't fit these things anywhere...

[rob_arend]

The problem I see is that the engram is lvl 85. That's pretty bad. I wouldnt mind it being 65 or 75th level, but grinding up to 85 has been really rough(currently 76).

I wouldn't mind spending the resources, but yeah...