Real question to PDX: When are you going to undo all of the changes made since 1.0.10

[Nuclear Captain Winters]

Johans original vision for the game was good, stop appeasing redditors. We want a simulator. Not whatever this ♥♥♥♥ is.

[Nuclear Captain Winters]

"Give us your feedback"
I made a dozen steam threads giving feedback and I was redirected repeatedly to the paradox forums where I would be mocked by redditors and where people have been repeatedly banned for expressing frustration with the Eu4 dlc policies and with the use of AI in developing paradox games. Now you come back here begging for advice from every person who spent a year posting on the steam discussion forums hoping to help make this a good game. Pathetic.

[Rooter]

Paradox have responded by putting EU5 on sale 20% off.

[Red]

well managed ai use in coding is meta....... it is a studio magnifier, not a downside, especially for such a complex game with significant maths.

[ABoxFullOfKittens]

Originally posted by Red:

well managed ai use in coding is meta....... it is a studio magnifier, not a downside, especially for such a complex game with significant maths.

Did you not see Shogun2:CE?

[Red]

i said well managed and that had little to do with code actually • Mangled "AI Slop" Artwork: To make the 2011 game scale to 4K UI resolutions, the developers used lazy generative AI to upscale the iconic hand-drawn unit cards and campaign movies. The AI processing heavily degraded the original aesthetic,

• Violating Steam's AI Policies: Valve requires developers to formally disclose if generative AI is used in game development. The Complete Edition lacked this disclosure, sparking fury and fears of an outright platform delisting......

coding is done far more efficiently by the leading ais now. it still require humans of calibre :p

[ABoxFullOfKittens]

Originally posted by Red:

i said well managed and that had little to do with code actually • Mangled "AI Slop" Artwork: To make the 2011 game scale to 4K UI resolutions, the developers used lazy generative AI to upscale the iconic hand-drawn unit cards and campaign movies. The AI processing heavily degraded the original aesthetic,

• Violating Steam's AI Policies: Valve requires developers to formally disclose if generative AI is used in game development. The Complete Edition lacked this disclosure, sparking fury and fears of an outright platform delisting......

coding is done far more efficiently by the leading ais now. it still require humans of calibre :p

Sarah Conner would like a word with you.

[Nuclear Captain Winters]

Originally posted by Red:

well managed ai use in coding is meta....... it is a studio magnifier, not a downside, especially for such a complex game with significant maths.

I agree but it is a violation of valve's terms of service not to put an AI disclosure on their store page and paradox has not done that. They also admitted recently quote
"Why wasn’t this done initially in October as part of the open beta?
It was discussed, but at the time there were some technical hurdles that needed to be solved first. Enough so that it wasn’t something we were willing to promise or announce at the time. It’s in part thanks to deeper investigations (partially with AI assistance) that we were able to untangle a solution."
in the november 4th dev diary.

[Nuclear Captain Winters]

Originally posted by Red:

• Violating Steam's AI Policies: Valve requires developers to formally disclose if generative AI is used in game development. The Complete Edition lacked this disclosure, sparking fury and fears of an outright platform delisting......

Ah, I see you had the same point to make as me. It seems every strategy developer is doing the least strategic thing possible on the steam storefront. weird, that

[StrayCat]

That vision has sailed on; they're just scrambling now to recoup the loss of players.

It's quite the conundrum Tinto finds themselves in these days.

[Nuclear Captain Winters]

Originally posted by StrayCat:

they're just scrambling now to recoup the loss of players.

The permanent loss of players happened after 1.1 and 1.2 released and the performance of the game dropped by easily 90% because of slopcode though.

[Red]

right but there are two types in reality. Generative creative content like narrative and art. often panned. then there is coding and deep logic use which almost every studio on earth uses and you have not been disadvantaged at all by living in the 80s thanks to them. No loss of players due to ai lmao. except luddites ofc. they need to fix bugs ui and polish and the numbers will grow because eu4 isn't even close so it is beyond me why it would be picked over eu5. migration will happen and I have 1000s of eu4 hours but reality is its dated and this is objectively better

it doesn't help[when people have limited understanding of a tec well suited too paradox and its maths. And demonstrably better than the average human coder........

The single biggest issue of across the pillars ??? PRICE. Thats almost exclusively why it got panned at twice the price of byz .

if it had been 10d or even 12.99 half the player base wouldn't have bat an eyelid its the 20d entry and now they think to charge 30d for the next one and that is what will destroy them ultimately. They guarantee their updates get panned no matter what they cant make sufficient content to make it feel enough like you are buying a second full game.

remove ai use and would they even manage any content at all?? you have to understand what you are saying . their work is slow and at first i thought they were bads but now i just think its a game which is pushing technology.

All i hear about is too slow optimise but you can only do so much hardware has caps on how many flops etc....after a point optimisation becomes game deconstruction... the people don't get what they shout for. The game is so serial too so hyper threads must be so tough.... think countries must act in specific orders to allow it to work. you can't parrell everything. if A declares war on B, C needs to see that result to then act..... ai is good for solving those problems like nothing else

[Nuclear Captain Winters]

"All i hear about is too slow optimise but you can only do so much hardware has caps on how many flops etc....after a point optimisation becomes game deconstruction"
Literally just run eu5 on 1.0.10 and do a benchmark and then run a benchmark on 1.4 and click some provinces while playing as a nation (not spectator mode) and you will see an extreme and drastic difference in performance that has everything to do with ai slop code. Idk why you're arguing otherwise where there are two versions of the game that perfectly show us what exactly went wrong and how and that it's claude's code that is the problem.

[Red]

yes im not saying it hasn't got issues hyper threading is a serious issue mate. don't misunderstand me i m not that thrilled with the total state yet either. Large swathes of earth are dead and colonisation is a joke. and i doubt they use just claude. mate you don't have much ai experience and its showing and i'm not being mean. As for people that hold up eu4 numbers constantly. that game has had sales so cheap it was practically free and then their is the massive hardware upgrade for this. Does anybody consider they might not have the hardware or the money to move yet??? you dont have a clue what you are talking about with your complaints and that the biggest issue.

You have jumped on fomo applied it to eu5 and that is wrong.

ai in the hands of a human coder is a force multiplayer.

plus winters i have 1k + hours on this with an open profile. I have played every single patch and on reasonable hardware performance has always remained tolerable and that's what counts not benchmarks

I have used 100billion ai tokens and more that i can prove what's your experience with it out of interest? I use it for phd maths algos and white paper replications, things like Markov, Bayesian, Gaussian.

Ai meta now is 10 20 100 agents operating in swarm with human overlord..... all the leading frontier (work) and some home such as Gemma 4 and qwen 27bil.....don't accept just one... hallucinations and slop are massively reduced when they operate as mini teams.

variance between models is real.....opus/fable, codex, qwen deep seeker are all better at different things and combined they are amazing

your game is more like a science experiment i taught my agents to play it via console to help with my game theroy work:):):):)

I can only assume the old dog johan must be utilising to run epic simulations...........i am very glad you are not luddites because i really feared why is dev so slow are they even using every possible tool

[Rooter]

Did you use Ai to write that response Red?
Its not very well written, quite rambly not a very good flow.
You should add Grammarly to your AI repertoire.

[truehunter]

It seems that they give reddit comments 90% weighting and steam comments 10% weighting, which is insane since steam is their store front. The result will be dismal sales and the executives will wonder why. This likely continues until we all stop buying their games, which is sad.