From Bonfire to bossfight

[andrewb]

After finishing the Old Iron King DLC, I've been thinking about this thing. Do people prefer long and arduous paths from bonfire to the bossfight (prime example would be Sir Alonne or Lud and Zallen) or do you enjoy bosses like Royal Rat Vanguard/ Authority, Sinh, Fume Knight where bonfires are pretty much just before the bossfight?

I really LOVED the Fume Knight because the bonfire is really close to the fog gate which encouraged me to try and master dodging all his moves. I died a lot but I didnt really mind because I knew I could try again without spending 20 minutes getting there.

Whereas with Sir Alonne, after dying for the first time I was like...screw it. I pulled out the biggest shield I had and just turtled througout the whole fight because I didn't feel like going through 20 Alonne Knights and fire-spewing salamanders.

I don't know, some people might say they get a bigger sense of accomplisment when they beat a boss like Lud and Zallen, which I suppose is true but I would still much prefer if the bonfire was closer because that would encourage me to actually master the bossfight instead of using the scummiest tactics possible to just 'get it over with'.

[LightOfJudgment]

I find long runs to bosses to be tedious and feel they detract from the fun in learning and overcoming a boss fight. I tend to not feel any shame in summoning for such fights.

[76561198251716120]

Long runs are better IMO. It makes the bosses more interesting because it feels more like you're risking something. Also, as someone who's been playing since Demon's Souls, it feels cheap to have a bonfire right in front of the boss.

[TrueArchery]

Originally posted by Lost Satyr:

Long runs are better IMO. It makes the bosses more interesting because it feels more like you're risking something. Also, as someone who's been playing since Demon's Souls, it feels cheap to have a bonfire right in front of the boss.

Yeah, same here. The bosses are easier than in Demon's or DkS1 anyways.

[76561198251716120]

Originally posted by Archer:

Originally posted by Lost Satyr:

Long runs are better IMO. It makes the bosses more interesting because it feels more like you're risking something. Also, as someone who's been playing since Demon's Souls, it feels cheap to have a bonfire right in front of the boss.

Yeah, same here. The bosses are easier than in Demon's or DkS1 anyways.

Yeah, truth. The difficulty in this game comes way more from regular enemies than bosses. Generally hordes of enemies who get to play by different rules (SHrine of AMana I'm looking at you with murder in my eyes).

[TrueArchery]

Originally posted by Lost Satyr:

Originally posted by Archer:

Yeah, same here. The bosses are easier than in Demon's or DkS1 anyways.

Yeah, truth. The difficulty in this game comes way more from regular enemies than bosses. Generally hordes of enemies who get to play by different rules (SHrine of AMana I'm looking at you with murder in my eyes).

I remember the Flamelurker... even with my Purple Flame Shield +6 he ♥♥♥♥♥♥ me up so hard

[76561198251716120]

Originally posted by Archer:

Originally posted by Lost Satyr:

Yeah, truth. The difficulty in this game comes way more from regular enemies than bosses. Generally hordes of enemies who get to play by different rules (SHrine of AMana I'm looking at you with murder in my eyes).

I remember the Flamelurker... even with my Purple Flame Shield +6 he ♥♥♥♥♥♥ me up so hard

Flamelurker is one of my favourite bosses of all time, even though he killed me more times than any other boss in any Souls game lol. And I went up against him with an archer.

[TrueArchery]

Originally posted by Lost Satyr:

Originally posted by Archer:

I remember the Flamelurker... even with my Purple Flame Shield +6 he ♥♥♥♥♥♥ me up so hard

Flamelurker is one of my favourite bosses of all time, even though he killed me more times than any other boss in any Souls game lol. And I went up against him with an archer.

Hyper Mode Archers are no joke - around 800 dmg per shot with a sticky compound longbow and enough dex is the minimum

[76561198251716120]

Originally posted by Archer:

Originally posted by Lost Satyr:

Flamelurker is one of my favourite bosses of all time, even though he killed me more times than any other boss in any Souls game lol. And I went up against him with an archer.

Hyper Mode Archers are no joke - around 800 dmg per shot with a sticky compound longbow and enough dex is the minimum

Oh yeah, but Flamelurker very rarely gives you time to shoot. Basically run, run, run and get off a shot every minute or so lol. Good times!

[Rain]

I like something in between. Maybe not something like the way to Fume Knight, but not as ridiculous as the way to Lud & Zallen. Something like the way to Ruin Sentinels or Smelter Demon is the right balance in my opinion. Still I'd always prefer a short over a long way. The enemy hordes to Lud & Zallen or Sir Alonne are a reason alone why I don't fight them often compared to other bosses.

[Hatrix_]

Originally posted by Archer:

Originally posted by Lost Satyr:

Long runs are better IMO. It makes the bosses more interesting because it feels more like you're risking something. Also, as someone who's been playing since Demon's Souls, it feels cheap to have a bonfire right in front of the boss.

Yeah, same here. The bosses are easier than in Demon's or DkS1 anyways.

Same here. The bosses in DkS2 felt waaaaaay easier to me than DkS1.
The only one in DkS2 I've ever had a challenge with was the Fume Knight.

[Dusk of Oolacile]

I'm not sure what people's problem with the Frigid outskirts is. Just summon the 2 NPCs and stick to the south wall, and all 3 of you will safely arrive, having full health etc. You only have to fight 2 or 3 ponies, and you faced tougher mobs in this game too.

[Rain]

Originally posted by Dusk of Oolacile:

I'm not sure what people's problem with the Frigid outskirts is. Just summon the 2 NPCs and stick to the south wall, and all 3 of you will safely arrive, having full health etc. You only have to fight 2 or 3 ponies, and you faced tougher mobs in this game too.

But it takes so much time even if you're safe. Bit offtopic, but do you fight them with the NPCs? I'm a bit surprised that they can be helpful.

[AMDG]

Originally posted by Dusk of Oolacile:

I'm not sure what people's problem with the Frigid outskirts is. Just summon the 2 NPCs and stick to the south wall, and all 3 of you will safely arrive, having full health etc. You only have to fight 2 or 3 ponies, and you faced tougher mobs in this game too.

well, not everyone likes to summon helpers as soon as it gets a bit harder, some want to play solo (due to CoC, for example), and that's where the frigid outskirts become a "problem". i don't see how ...

Just summon the 2 NPCs and stick to the south wall, and all 3 of you will safely arrive, HAVING FULL HEALTH

... can be any fun. you could just as well hack the game and become invincible.

What i'm trying to say is: I prefer mid-long ranges between bonfires and bosses that don't feel unfair when playing solo (or plain impossible in CoC). Frigid outskirts were defo too long

[Ellixer]

I prefer closer bonfires. If it's longer I am much more compelled to clear out an area permanently so I don't lose souls for good because of some careless mistake since it's a finite resource and burning an ascetic is irreversible (my brain won't let me forget that fact for a second, it works in funny ways). Furthermore if the way is longer I am much less likely to take risk as I immediately start thinking of how long it would take before I get to take on the same boss again. I think there are room for both but overall I definitely prefer closer bonfires. After the first few times I clear an area out it just feels like busywork and I start being careless. Dark Souls teaches the virtue of patience but there are times when it goes too far with that in my opinion.

[Reoden]

Originally posted by TacticalFX:

I like something in between. Maybe not something like the way to Fume Knight, but not as ridiculous as the way to Lud & Zallen. Something like the way to Ruin Sentinels or Smelter Demon is the right balance in my opinion. Still I'd always prefer a short over a long way. The enemy hordes to Lud & Zallen or Sir Alonne are a reason alone why I don't fight them often compared to other bosses.

I agree exactly, though I found Smelter Demon's gate in Scholars frustrating to try to run to ignoring enemies. A gate like the one for Fume Knight, Rat vanguard, etc, is a little too generous imo. I feel you should have to either run past or kill a few enemies, maybe a bit of both, to add some stakes to the fight. But then something like Lud and Zallen was just ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ ridiculous, especially if you get invaded on top of it. ♥♥♥♥ those infinitely spawning-out-of-the-ether reindeer.

Originally posted by Dusk of Oolacile:

I'm not sure what people's problem with the Frigid outskirts is. Just summon the 2 NPCs and stick to the south wall, and all 3 of you will safely arrive, having full health etc. You only have to fight 2 or 3 ponies, and you faced tougher mobs in this game too.

Well the problem is that some people who play this game actually like to play it themselves, as opposed to summoning NPCs or other players to play it for them.