Celtic factions and Guerrilla deployment

[Emrys of Ailliau]

I just started a campaign as the ebdanians, and the Celtic faction trait is Guerrilla deployment. which took my mind on a fanciful vision of starting a battle close enough to the enemy to genuinely surprise them like the already implemented Ambush type battle or at the very least close enough to rush them before they have the chance to reorder their army to defend against mine. What I got was six inches more than id have playing as any other faction, and i have to say that disappointed me.

There is no negative bonus for enemy morale or stamina, as far as i know there is no difference in the stealth capabilities of your troops so how exactly is this meant to be used? Am I missing something critical because aside from the very edge of the map itself I cannot even put troops on the enemies side of the field and the maps are so huge and the battles so fast that any troops there would get to the fight just in time to clean up the mess.

Someone please help me see the silver lining in this because with tissue paper units and an ineffective faction ability it looks like i'm playing the celts for the color green and the triarch symbol which looks kinda cool.

[Mile pro Libertate]

Some maps you will not have any space, like you describe; but on others you will have room to put units behind the enemy. It depends on the layout of the terrain you choose to fight the battle on from the campaign map.

A big advantage of guerrilla deployment is that you can take advantage of a terrain feature that you otherwise couldn't reach in time from the normal deployment zone.

For example, there might be a steep hill on the enemy flank that is right near them, but far from you. With normal deployment the ai or human enemy would occupy it long before you could get to it, forcing you to fight uphill, especially if they are defending. With guerrilla deployment, you can turn the tables.

Guerrilla deployment also lets you hide units easier. A normal deployment might be smack in the middle of a flat plain, and no way to hide any of your units for a flank attack. With guerilla, that copse of trees or dead ground just out of the normal zone is now within reach, so you can have some units start hidden from the beginning.

Also, guerilla makes the effective deploy zone much larger, meaning you can spread your units out much more. Even if they aren't going to be hidden or can't take any great tactical position, sometimes just spreading out has great benefits because the enemy now has to decide which part of your force they are going to move against.

It can be a good way to lure isolated enemy contingents off to be destroyed piecemeal, or to distract parts of the enemy force you'd rather not fight right away so you can achieve local superiority against their weaker parts. This tactic works well if you have numerous light units, like javelinmen or skirmisher cav, and the enemy is strong in heavy infantry. With normal deployment, your force is more concentrated and closer to the enemy, leaving lights vulnerable to a rush from a superior enemy.

Deploying farther away from the enemy, even if it is just to your own rear, also makes it easier to fatigue enemy units who must cross more ground to get to you, especially if you have light infantry and you keep them shifting position. You can get enemy heavies to be running back and forth trying to catch two or more lights, alternating retreating with one, only to have the other move in and throw missiles at the enemy heavies' rears. The casualties from this, combined with exhaustion, can leave enemy heavies vulnerable to breaking against a good charge by much weaker melee units.

Additionally, if you are fighting a delaying action, and you just want to inflict some damage and not fight a pitched battle, guerilla allows you to deploy near the edge of the battle map, making it easier to withdraw.

Finally, sometimes when you have multiple stacks taking part, the enemy attacks your most ill positioned stack on the campaign terrain, or the weakest stack, and your reinforcing stack is actually what you want to hold the line with. Guerilla lets you deploy your weak stack's units at the area of the battle where the reinforcing stack will come in, letting you link up basically as soon as fighting starts. So this lets the weak more easily reach the shelter of the strong.

It also prevents the enemy from splitting your force. Even if the forces are split on the campaign map, the guerilla movement essentially nullifies this in the actual battle.

PS: The general idea with guerilla movement is not to start right on top the enemy, aiming to bum rush them with melee.

This can work sometimes, especially if you are going for a "lop the head off the snake" tactic like surprising their faction leader and killing him in the first moments, or if you have a contingent of very strong melee.

But usually, the idea is to wear the enemy down with attrition, secure commanding ground first, fatigue the enemy, isolate specific units you think are dangerous (like some elite shock unit) or want to capture (siege engines and artillery), and to divide his stacks from each other.

This generally means that speed, endurance, and ranged attacks work best. So the Celtic guerilla movement favors using fast, relatively light units equipped with missile weapons.

PPS: All of this means that guerilla movement is also useful when besieged, because you can hide units outside the walls more easily. This lets you do attacks as diversions to keep the enemy from going straight for a gate or something, and also makes it easier to do a strike on their siege equipment or machines.

[Teh_Diplomat]

Yeah I'm having a blast as the Picts, it's reminescent of playing as the Hattori and setting up some unique deployments - like skirmisher cav luring units (say their good shock/heavy cav) into the forest and your spearmen.

Then place some berserkers/unique's into the forest and lure their remaining army into your heavy infantry and flank them with more infantry laying in wait, or even skirmishers from the rear.

Typically - and as you'll find being the Celts taking on their WRE heavy infantry; you need to micro your army more as you'll be paying attention to most, if not all, of your units in rapid succession. This combined with the increased battle speed, lends these factions into having a more advanced nature to their campaigns, and especially their battles.

[Mile pro Libertate]

Yeah that's a great point about micro. It is too bad that the battles move so quick now.

It's be awesome if CA had kept the speed of RTW or Med 2, but with the new mechanics.

[Emrys of Ailliau]

it had occured to me to use the units like that however that level of micro managing is extremely difficult for me to pull off even. Im coming to Attila from Rome 2 on legendary and i figure hey its pretty much the same engine so ill just continue playing legendary.

Lol boy did i get the surprise of my life when their archers/ skirmishers destroyed my army before we even got close enough to make them move. We should really stop asking for harder games and start asking for smarter games. Did some experimenting and found that Normal is just about the same as Rome 2 on legendary as far as combat capabilities even though the enemy units flee a little more easily. But i have the solution, Assasinate the general, then attack with dogs, berserkers and heavy cavalry covered by archers using a mix of flaming and whistling arrows. keep a couple medium axe warriors for their heavy units.

[Teh_Diplomat]

I happen to choose one of three stances for my unit: Isolate, re-inforce, or rest. Beyond that it really depends on your current circumstance.