*Resolved* Instrument Rating Checkride extremely frustrating

[hodor]

The Instrument Rating Checkride. After passing the first VOR beacon, climbing and leveling out, and reaching 5 nm on the DME, it says I failed. It will list every single criteria as failed without saying which one triggered the failure. My best guess is maybe my heading wasn't accurate enough at the transition point. But I've repeated this about 6 times now and it keeps failing at that exact point. Some of the attempts I think I was too far off the heading because I was trying to line up the VOR course. But at least a few times I'm pretty sure I was within 5 degrees of 339. This is especially frustrating because it's 20 minutes of flight wasted for each attempt.

Looking at the lesson's task list and YouTube vids, the Checkride probably lasts close to 1 hour. I'm not sure if I want to keep trying it if the script is going potentially cause failures for unknown reasons anywhere on the task list.

I had a similar problem with the Private Pilot Checkride where it would immediately fail after taking off to 2000 or so altitude. It would say "your rollout was too soon' but there was no roll involved, just ascent and level off. I couldn't figure out what was wrong but after a dozen tries it f inally let me past that checkpoint. My guess was the plane took too long to go from 80 to 100 when reaching the target altitude, so I reduced my ascent rate towards the end of the climb to shorten the time needed to accelerate.

Other lessons would have weird bugs where they wouldn't progress even though all the current task seemed to be completed. Some of them were fixed with altering the script with Notepad.

Is anyone as frustrated by these issues as I am?

Edit: The point where the Instrument Rating Checkride kept failing me, it appears to be a bug in the lesson. After climbing for the missed approach, it tells you to keep a 339 heading. But that will cause you to go slightly West of the PARKK intersection where the next checkpoint is. If you are too far West of PARKK, it will fail you. Instead I kept around 341-342 and I ended up closer to PARKK and it let me continue.

I also used this guide for the holding patterns, since I figured it would fail me if I was slightly off for those next tasks. http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/showthread.php?157446-Finally-passed-the-instrument-checkride-here-s-a-guide

[Old fart gamer]

Are you able to make periodic saves mid mission using the semicolon key? Just save mid flight, then keep overwriting your save as you go. Then if you mess up, just reload last save.

[gspectre]

There is a Youtube video that shows how to pass the "Instrument Rating Checkride". Yes, there is a bug with that lesson that's never been fixed. If I am not mistaken, I think I recall that video stating that after the auto-pilot feature is turned off and you are told not to use it, the video recommends using it.

[SteveFSX/P3D]

The lessons are actually a hinderance after a bit because of this extremely fussy and vague restarting. The written content of the lessons is well worth reading though, but I learned a lot better using the lessons included with the book below ....

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Microsoft-Flight-Simulator-Pilots-Training/dp/0764588222/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1482687704&sr=1-1&keywords=Fsx

[hodor]

Thanks, I will try these tips. I didn't know we could save during lessons.

Edit: Won't let me save during the checkride, the menu option is also greyed out. Tried the autopilot so the heading and altitude probably had only 1 degree and 10 feet of variation. I'm pretty sure I'm in the VOR corridor, the needle is almost centered. Still fails me at that exact point just 5 nm after the "missed approach." This is driving me nuts. I'm going to skip this checkride and move on.

Well, reading the task list again, it says to cross the PARKK intersection. But on the GPS, that place is off to the NE when the failure point occurs. Maybe I'll try going 341 degrees the whole time then turn back to 339 just before 5nm on the DME, and see what happens.

Edit 2: Yes, that appears to be the problem with the Checkride. I kept a heading of 341-342 after being told to perform the missed approach, instead of 339. On the GPS, the adjusted heading let me closer to the PARKK intersection and that appears to be what allowed me to proceed to the next task in the Checkride.

[gspectre]

Congrats

[hodor]

Edit: I've finally finished the Commercial Pilot Checkride. I think the issues are worse than the Instrument Pilot Checkride.

The first issue was that I kept failing right after the first climb. The abl file for this checkride has an error. For case CaseClimb1_1: //climb to 1600', it has a target of 22 MP and 2300 RPM, but all the other climbs have 25 and 2500. I changed this line.

Remember to follow the correct flight profile for initial takeoff, then standard climb, cruise, and descent. Other than initial takeoff, I think the checkpoint for the transitions is within 100ft of target altitude, instead of immediately after the announcement, which happens 500ft from target altitude. Remember that MP changes by itself with altitude so you have to keep an eye on it. Engine cowls do not appear to matter.

Overshooting or undershooting MP and RPM with your joystick or buttons might cause you to fail, so gradually change these. However, I think it only gives you maybe 10-20 seconds to change them after triggering a checkpoint, so don't take too long. I kept failing at least 2 MP or RPM tasks upon landing at Harvey. This was very frustrating because it wouldn't tell you anything was wrong until 30-45 minutes into the checkride. I left the (shift-1) console open so I could get an enlarged view of the MP/RPM guages. I think it might also fail you if you get hit with turbulence during the checkpoints and the needles on the guages are jumping around.

After many tries, I think I finally had 0-1 MP RPM errors, because I started getting crash warnings when landing at Harvey, even though I was sure the landings were OK. I don't understand the lines related to the crash checkpoints, and I don't know if this did anything, but I changed bCrashCheck = TRUE to FALSE under case CaseClimb1: //climb to 800'. This appeared to stop the crash messages.

But then, after all of this, now it was telling me that I was going off the end of the runway, even though I clearly was not. After many additional attempts, I think the lesson considers the end of the runway as the horizontal line or rows of V's, instead of the actual physical end of the runway. Do not take too long to touchdown to avoid going past these markings. Don't forget to use full flaps at landing, raise flaps before beginning the next takeoff.

I don't understand why none of the devs from MS and DT have corrected these bugs in the lessons. They appear to be just a few lines of script. For me, the Commercial Checkride was even more upsetting than the Instrument Checkride.

[hodor]

Edit: I just finished the Airline Transport Pilot Checkride with the maximum of 2 failed criteria. This checkride's got issues, just like the other ones.

The strangest one was I kept missing the landing light on takeoff criteria, and I found out that the on/off labels on the cockpit panel are reversed.

I was probably not careful enough when I missed other criteria, but sometimes I'm almost certain that I didn't exceed the limits for some of the ones that the instructor called as failed.

Some of the instructions in the briefing might also be wrong compared to the actual script. For example, the briefing says to rectract flaps to 0 AFTER reaching 200 knots, but the instructor will say you failed to do it BEFORE 200 knots.

There was also a really weird text message saying I didnt lower the landing gears, after I landed, but the instructor didn't mention it as a 3rd error.

I wish after all these years, the new devs would've patched these simple bugs.

[Morag]

you'll laugh about this one day

[Scapegoat]

You have to fly within the criteria, and you gotta be really accurate. You essentially almost have to be as accurate as the autopilot itself.

These are the criteria:
* altitude: +/- 60' (the instructions say +/-100 feet, but I got a fail even within that range, so I used +/- 60' and I never had an altitude issue since)
* airspeed: +/- 10 KIAS
* heading: +/- 10 degrees (you have to be a little liberal with your heading to correctly intercept and fly the radial, but stay within the limit)
* VOR course: +/- 2 degrees (each horizontal dot on the gauge represents one degree, if I remember correctly?)
* NAV frequencies: correct frequency within 30 seconds

1): hold 5000' and heading 066 until you begin to intercept the 338 radial inbound to SEA VOR - don't turn onto this heading until the CDI needle is touching the donut in the centre of the gauge - this will set you up really smoothly onto the radial so that you don't have to overcompensate crazily to stay within heading 338, but pay attention and keep on it
2): hold 5000' until passing FACTS (Seattle DME: 17 nmi)
3): descent to 3000' before passing MILLT (Seattle DME: 11 nmi)
4): descend to 840' before passing DONDO NDB, and be extremely careful not to fly below 840' at all, or you will fail - there's no forgiveness on this criterion - a safe bet is to keep the needle just below 900' and pay very close attention to it
5): for the whole descent, stay centred on the 338 course inbound to Seattle VOR, but stay within +/-10 of heading 338
6): aim to fly almost immediately above the VOR if you can, then when the instructor calls the missed approach, climb to 2100' - it's important that you make sure you climb at a rate of 500 feet/min or more, as this is another fail item that isn't written on the instructions list anywhere (I found this one out the hard way)
7): set OBS to 339 while flying to PARKK, continue flying the course that's already set for SEA VOR - hold it within +/-2 degrees until the instructor tells you to turn left to heading 160
8): climb to 3000' before you get to SEA VOR
9): the heading 160 is supposed to set you up to intercept the 140 radial outbound from SEA VOR, which is the radial you will be flying while in the holding pattern

I haven't managed to get past this point in the checkride, but when I do, I'll post an update of anything else I find.

If the game has to tell you to correct any of these, even if it's only once, you will get a fail. So if you see that little orange message in the top left corner of your screen, just restart there and then - why torment yourself?

I suggest making your own custom flight to practice it on your own terms, so you can get familiar with everything and learn the whole flight back to front, and try run it as accurately as you can every time (I did this for myself). Practice getting spot on with intercepting radials so that you are flying right above the VOR, cos that's another fail item. They expect you to fly exactly above the VOR to enter holding correctly. Also, after passing SEA VOR with the missed approach, hold the radial you're already flying on as you head over to PARKK NDB

With the ILS part when you get to final, I saw a YouTube video of real pilots explaining a simple and effective way to set up an ILS approach (in a Cessna 172) so that you set up the perfect glide slope. Fly the correct altitude until decision height, until you intercept the localiser, then set up your descent this way:
1): use power to set your airspeed to 90 KIAS
2): use pitch to set your descent rate to 500 ft/min
3): trim to perfection (that perfection is described as your Cessna being able to fly exactly as you've set it without you needing to touch the control column)

With flying, everything is all about the approach - set yourself up well early on, and maintain it so that you barely have to touch anything. If you have to correct anything, don't overdo it - make little corrections and ease into them.

Also, don't lose heart. I got a bit fed up with failing so many times. But the more mistakes you learn from, the closer you get to success.

[Anonymous]

Originally posted by hodor:

The Instrument Rating Checkride. After passing the first VOR beacon, climbing and leveling out, and reaching 5 nm on the DME, it says I failed. It will list every single criteria as failed without saying which one triggered the failure. My best guess is maybe my heading wasn't accurate enough at the transition point. But I've repeated this about 6 times now and it keeps failing at that exact point. Some of the attempts I think I was too far off the heading because I was trying to line up the VOR course. But at least a few times I'm pretty sure I was within 5 degrees of 339. This is especially frustrating because it's 20 minutes of flight wasted for each attempt.

Looking at the lesson's task list and YouTube vids, the Checkride probably lasts close to 1 hour. I'm not sure if I want to keep trying it if the script is going potentially cause failures for unknown reasons anywhere on the task list.

I had a similar problem with the Private Pilot Checkride where it would immediately fail after taking off to 2000 or so altitude. It would say "your rollout was too soon' but there was no roll involved, just ascent and level off. I couldn't figure out what was wrong but after a dozen tries it f inally let me past that checkpoint. My guess was the plane took too long to go from 80 to 100 when reaching the target altitude, so I reduced my ascent rate towards the end of the climb to shorten the time needed to accelerate.

Other lessons would have weird bugs where they wouldn't progress even though all the current task seemed to be completed. Some of them were fixed with altering the script with Notepad.

Is anyone as frustrated by these issues as I am?

Edit: The point where the Instrument Rating Checkride kept failing me, it appears to be a bug in the lesson. After climbing for the missed approach, it tells you to keep a 339 heading. But that will cause you to go slightly West of the PARKK intersection where the next checkpoint is. If you are too far West of PARKK, it will fail you. Instead I kept around 341-342 and I ended up closer to PARKK and it let me continue.

I also used this guide for the holding patterns, since I figured it would fail me if I was slightly off for those next tasks. http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/showthread.php?157446-Finally-passed-the-instrument-checkride-here-s-a-guide

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Plz reply to the following pointwise:
1. In the link of flightsim.com that you have shared, the user tells in the first few lines to open Ratingcheckride.abl file...but I am not able to find that file...when I go to steamapps--->FSX--->script--->lib, following abl files appear: fnuserevents, maths, messages, simqueue, stdcases, stdchktolerences, stdhousekeeping, stdinit, stdconstants, stdvars, stringfns, throttle...but there is no above mentioned abl file..how to find that?...shouldnt there be an abl file for every lesson so that I can make changes in that?
2. As mentioned in the above link, if I change Bcheat to true, it wouldnt end the checkride...so I can move out of tolerences but no move way too out as in landing on different airport as it still monitors our ride....right?...so even if i move out of tolerences and still complete the checkride , it will give me certificate right?.
3. In your commericial pilot checkride, you have mentioned that at each checkpoint, it might give only 10-20 sec to correct/change the MP nd rpm..This you are seem to be telling from experience...but shouldnt there be a code behind it ....bcoz unless that is there how will the system monitor it...or is it that only some part of code for each lesson is visible and we can change and rest part is not shown to us and that is a real bug and we cant change...right?