Steam telepítése
belépés
|
nyelv
简体中文 (egyszerűsített kínai)
繁體中文 (hagyományos kínai)
日本語 (japán)
한국어 (koreai)
ไทย (thai)
Български (bolgár)
Čeština (cseh)
Dansk (dán)
Deutsch (német)
English (angol)
Español - España (spanyolországi spanyol)
Español - Latinoamérica (latin-amerikai spanyol)
Ελληνικά (görög)
Français (francia)
Italiano (olasz)
Bahasa Indonesia (indonéz)
Nederlands (holland)
Norsk (norvég)
Polski (lengyel)
Português (portugáliai portugál)
Português - Brasil (brazíliai portugál)
Română (román)
Русский (orosz)
Suomi (finn)
Svenska (svéd)
Türkçe (török)
Tiếng Việt (vietnámi)
Українська (ukrán)
Fordítási probléma jelentése
Hozzászólási szabályok és irányelvek
Hozzászólás jelentése
Once you detach yourself emotionally from any individual match you gain the ability to look at what you did right and what you did wrong from the perspective of an observer instead of the extremely biased position of an invested player. Just play about 10 matches and watch for what is generally going well and what isn't.
Pretty soon you will develop a picture of what you are doing right and what you are doing wrong. Now you can focus on deliberately trying to force a match to play to your strengths and when you can't, you can focus on improving the areas where you are weak. Even when you take a loss if you are not getting crush countered by sweeps anymore by pushing buttons at the wrong time (this is what I cut out of my play in beta 4) you can still claim a victory because a mistake you were making is now cut from your play. Work on one thing at a time but understand you are fighting a person not AI. There is often not going to be solution to a particular player. When you solve one of their tactics they will mix it up to solve your new approach. Give the other player credit for their own ability, even if they beat you with raw wake-up super in round 3 while at a pixel of life. You should have been looking at their meter and anticipating they would try to panic win the round and it would have been a free win.
I used this method first in League of Legends and after getting salty for 4 seasons and ending in Bronze or Silver for 4 seasons I went from Silver 5 to Platinum 2 in one season and only about 500 games. 4 seasons and thousands of games getting salty and blaming my team never got me anywhere close to that level of improvement. Of course I didn't win every single game on that run but I almost never hit losing streaks longer than 3 games and winning streaks of 5+ games were commonplace because I was never going on tilt. Over time my win rate just kept climbing until I reached the point where other players were simply genuinely better than me, even then I learned to steal some games away with smart play but it gets difficult.
I did the same thing in the SFV betas and I'm extremely new to fighting games vs. actual players. Beta 2 I only got as high as 150lp. Beta 3 I got to 450lp and this last beta I finished at 850lp, I played the 3 betas for a combined total of 24 hours. It really doesn't take as long as you might think though the better you get the more the payoff will deminish. When you lose a bunch of matches in a row and feel the salt starting to rise, pause the matchmaking, go make a sandwich, eat it while you watch a YouTube video or do whatever really, just step back and get your mind on something other than the game and come back in 20 mins when the salt is gone. It will get better (and less expensive) for you that way, I promise.
please see a shrink
I can vouch that I have lost so many matches in fighting games that I no longer feel anything after losing.
Win or lose, it's an experience to me. The matches I lose are more valuable to me because they show my weaknesses.
I can't help but care about it. In team-based games I can have some small consolation. I can think to myself, we lost but: I was simply out-numbered; I wasn't the worst player in the match; I did my job; my teammates were morons; et cetera.
With a 1v1 game, there are no excuses. It's you, your opponent, the game, and lag. Your opponent too good? Get good. The game too hard? Learn to play. Lag? Upgrade, shut up, or don't play. You have to take 100% of the blame.
So even though I have the mindset to improve, it's still frustrating. I made another mistake. I hit the wrong button again. I lost yet another 5 matches back-to-back. This is my failure. I'm not as good as other players. I can't beat them. It's my fault, and I can't do anything about it.
This is what I've been trying to explain. My salt, my anger, my frustration... It comes from the never-ending failure. Losses are merely the result of failing. I'm mad because I block the mix-up incorrectly about half the time. I get hit by cross-ups about half the time. Nearly every time I launch a projectile I get kicked in the face. Every decision I make seems to be the wrong one. Can you imagine a game with 6 buttons, and whenever you press a button you get shocked? Yet... you are told that the only way to win the game is to press the buttons, and you are told the buttons won't always zap you. Yet every button zaps me every time! That's what fighting games are like for me. It's not about losing. It's about the infinite frustration of being locked-down, and completely unable to take any action whatsoever.
No matter how much I play, or how positive I try to be, the game (and the players) wear me down very quickly. I am to the point I cannot play for longer than 30 minutes without wanting to flip-out. I used to love fighting games. Now they are only a source of failure, shame, frustration, and rage.
I can recognize right and wrong choices most of the time. The problem is that everything my opponent does is in any effort to force me into making the wrong choice. I grew-up in the 8-bit era. If someone online does the same thing 3 times in a row, my mind is trying to work out how to beat it. (And why not? The last guy I fought just spammed a similar trick over and over. This guy probably will too... right?) Then, on the 4th run, I attempt to "beat" their trick... they mix things up in a way that punishes me for trying to beat them. I can't think that far ahead. I never see it in time to stop, and I don't think I ever will.
The fact is, the worst of the players are so far ahead of me, that my hope is 100% gone. That last beta destroyed the last of my confidence in playing fighting games. I was fooled for a bit. I thought I'd try being competitive in SFV. That just isn't going to happen. Not in SFV, nor any other fighting game, not for me... ever.
I can't deal with it at all. A simple break doesn't help me. I've tried. A mere 20 minutes of online play of any fighting game makes me want to throw my computer out a window. I'm being quite serious when I say, I can't do anything. I can't counter. I can't attack. Anything and everything I do results in me getting hit. This has been happening, non-stop, for years. I really can't be anything but pissed-off at this point.
It can take me hours, or even days to get over it. I haven't played a fighting game since the last beta. Why? I got crushed super-hard. Lost nearly every match. Got nowhere. Couldn't hang on to any LP. I had maybe... 150? 200? Something pathetic.
The fact is, I have anger issues, and competitive players look for the cheesiest, most rage-inducing tactics to exploit. It's all about unblockables, or limiting options down to something predictable. They don't want to fight. They want to set-up situations in which their opponent can only lose.
I want to press buttons. I want to attack. I want to jump! Ironically, fighting games aren't meant for me... at all. They are meant for people that like to wait in lines at grocery stores. People that don't mind waiting for the perfect chance to attack and not be countered/punished in any way. It's ridiculous. It's like every person online (no matter what fighting game) is playing Geese. They don't attack me. They just wait for me, and then punish me for attacking. Nothing can possibly get through their defence if they are willing to wait out the clock. Absolutely nothing. And this happens in every fighting game. Infuriating. I would rather die IRL that wait for my opponent to attack. That is so boring!
I can't deal with any of it. It's beyond me. Beyond my comprehension, and beyond my skill.
I had around 3500 matches played in SF4. If you count every other fighting game I've played, the number would be over 5000.
I still get mad. Every time.
All I do is lose. If they are so valuable, you can have mine! I learn nothing. I get opponents that are so far beyond me that it is pointless. If I find something that works, they change. Even if it works this time, the solution won't work next time! (Because it will be tricky, and they will bait it.) Which forces me to wonder if perhaps it was a fluke. Maybe it was the wrong thing to do in the first place. Maybe there is no defence. Maybe I did it wrong. Maybe the timing was off. Who knows?
No matter what, it's one difficult situation after another. I can't escape, and I have no time to think. It's just constantly reacting to their infinite pressure. I lose because they have 100% control of the match. Not fun, and I learn nothing.
That's not fun. That's not entertaining. It is torture. I fail, I can't stop it, I can't do anything about it. No matter how hard I try or work to improve.
Just thought you guys might wanna know.
I don't know your skill level or anything and this post might be for someone else who is looking. But here i go:
1. You believe there is a set "right way to win" against each opponent. You are just now grasping that this "right way to win" Changes constantly non-stop against good opponents.
2. You are simply not adapting to what your opponent throws at you, possibly due to lacking observation or simply not knowing what you can use against your opponents next action. In fact you might not be bothering to guess your opponents next action. #2 is just me testing the waters with what i read, but if this sounds true, anger could be the primary cause of this.
3. The best possible action can quickly become the worst against a opponent who adapts. There is no right response. Hell there are cases where not adapting can win. For example throwing an opponent three times in a row puts your opponent in quite the situation. Yeah you could not throw a 3rd time, but that could, by a very small chance, be expected.
4. If you can reconize why you lost beyond just "I got hit by this move" Then you have improved a bit already, Even just getting hit by moves can tell you a lot. But if you are upset that you lost, it becomes "I lost because it was a fluke". I understand that people can get angry in very different ways. But getting angry over "failing" is just harmful compared to the "why did i lose". There are no shortcuts, winning takes a really ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ long time. If you don't take the time to learn how to adapt to each opponent even when he suddenly changes you will lose. The possible scenarios are near infinite and come one after another, you cant be expected to master them all, but be as ready as you can.
I know this sounds like generic "get good scrub" nonsense but the mentality of "I need to be good to have fun right now" is harmful compared to the people getting excited when there is something new to learn. Youre always going to lose, even when your a high level player, why get so strung up about it?
I would assume that your expectation is that you will win at least a certain amount of the time.
Is that fair to say?
Is this an acceptable expectation to hold?
I don’t know how often you have played the fighting games you have played, but it’s always possible you could be ‘unlucky’ and keep fighting truly expert players. While in a normal setting, which is to say a situation in which the general public is present, you could say that based on averages you must be better than some of the people. But fighting game communities are very niche groups, and the people that are part of niche groups tend to be quite committed. As a niche community you are pretty much ensuring that only experts are part of the community. And the more a person is online generally, the more likely you will encounter them online. And they are literally the experts and experienced mostly because of their time online. It’s like joining a poker club, you will probably only find people who spend a lot of time playing poker.
So maybe thinking about whether your expectations are reasonable ones to hold might help.
P.S Spoiler for Series X of Red Dwarf
You could take a page out of Arnold J Rimmer’s book because he modifies his expectations of himself when he find out that his biological father was the Gardener and not the man who raised him. So instead of being a failure because he didn’t become an officer like his father said he should be, he thought about how his biological father would be proud to have a son who achieved as much as what Rimmer did.
1.) Did I give that impression? Adapting to opponents is something I assumed from the start. I'm no stranger to playing games online. Just about every game requires you to adapt to the unique strategies/tactics of other players.
2.) I most certainly adapt. It rarely matters. Sometimes my opponents adapt faster to me than I can adapt to them. By the end of round 1, they can defeat me with their eyes closed. Sometimes I adpat, but they change things-up slightly. Just enough that it actually causes me to get hit rather than to punish. Anger is the result, not the cause.
3.) This is rather obvious. I played seriously for 2 years, and I've played fighting games since fighting games existed. Believe me, I understand the need to adapt. It doesn't matter when most people are a step ahead of you.
4.) I can recognize why I lost. I'm powerless to stop it. Getting hit tells me nothing. I could use a move at an unsafe range, but not be punished. Sometimes it will work, sometimes it won't. It shouldn't be. I'm doing the wrong thing at the wrong time, but I don't get punished. This leads to the natural conclusion that this is safe, even though the reality is that it isn't. How am I supposed to know the difference? How do I know if it is actually safe or not? If it works sometimes but not others, you have gray-area.
As far as opponent's moves, a lot of the time, there isn't anything I can do. The problem is typically difficult set-ups. I have to take the correct series of actions or lose. Unless I've seen it before, there is no way I can possibly do that. Even if I have, it's still hard. So I practice against that specific thing right? Well, if I can't do that same thing, with that same character, I can't train against it. To do so, I would have to learn to play a character in which I have no interest. It wouldn't be so bad if I didn't have to get to a high level of skill with that character. Unfortunately, it's like starting over from the begining. Like you learned nothing, and know nothing, and it's your first day. You can't play online, you can't even play story-mode. No. Instead, you get to practice cancelling one specific normal into a charge move. You spend a week doing that, and you still can't do it. Your training has been a complete waste. Next time it happens, you can take random actions, or just sit the controller down. Your opponent wins because you aren't an expert at playing their character.
Again, I don't mind losing. I hate getting locked down. I hate not being able to take any action. I hate waiting. When your opponent is one step ahead of you, it doesn't matter what you do. They are expecting your action (which in theory, should be the correct one for you to make) and punishing you for doing it. Players on yomi layer 3 are impossible to defeat. I'm sick of trying.
Is it not fair to expect to win some games?! You might think that's crazy, but... people playing a video game... believe or not... might actually think they have a chance at winning in that video game. Like... there should be a matchmaking system and stuff. So like... I don't fight super-high-level players that are impossible to defeat at my level of skill. I think that's a reasonable expectation.
Also reasonable? That playing fighting games my whole life would make me not be one of the worst players on the planet. You would think I would have some skill from playing fighting games for over 20 years. If not that, then the 2 years I spent trying to become a pro. Is it not a reasonable expectation after all this time? More specifically, don't you think it's reasonable to assume I would win more than just occassionally?
The only thing unreasonable here is the amount of time I'm expected to put in before I EVER win a match. No thanks.
As far as Rimmer...
I've seen the entire series. Rimmer's father being the gardener was a joke. A multi-layered joke. "...more reliable than a garden strimmer..." The only thing that changed was his perception. He's still worthless. (Even after his time as Ace.) He felt better because the bar was lowered... to beneath the dirt. That was how low a standard has to be for Rimmer to exceed it.
Sadly, I'm just like Rimmer. A complete an utter failure. It doesn't matter what I do. I'm never any good. Everything blows up in my face. No matter how careful and calculated I am... there is always some oversight. Sometimes, it's something I could not have predicted. Some wild x-factor. It's as if fate ensures I will never attain any real success. Work, relationships, games... it's all the same to me. Nothing works out, ever. I always lose. Just like Rimmer.
Now i'm really confused. The goal isnt exactly to always use safe moves.
If an opponent blocks a move and you cant do anything about the punishment that comes for example, Then that move becomes unsafe on block. The question then becomes "how do i make sure the opponent does not block this move?". One way is to not use that move sure, and there is using that move as a punishment option too, and then there is "training" your opponent to get hit by it as well. Right?
Well we have to get you out of getting locked down first.
The same thing CAN apply to getting locked down. The training part. This part is hard to explain because I have played VF/DOA more than 2d fighters. And honestly its not too comparable.
But yeah, I dont know what exactly happens to you. Its really vague, but if you get too specific then the advice wont be general. What a mess you're in :x
Really?
...But maybe you are serious. Somehow, you've never been ****ed over in SF4. Whatever, here's an example of lockdown in SF4:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_upMcn5nOc4
No, this isn't me playing. Guess what? It's the same. (Actually, for me, it's much worse than seen here.) Simply imagine that Dhalsim is Sagat, and that Ibuki is any other character. Also pretend he never escapes or hits Ibuki even once. That's me. That's the replay. Every fighting game. All of them. Just replace the characters, stages, and mechanics. It doesn't matter. No matter what I get locked-down, can do nothing, and then lose.
Just about every character in every fighting game has some ridiculous set-up that is nearly impossible to deal with. Unless you can recognize it instantly, know exactly what to do, and execute the solution perfectly... you are going to lose. To me, that's neither fun or fair.
Training to defeat one specific gimmick won't lead to overall improvement. You'll just be a little better in that particular instance. Not against that character, or even the gimmick. Instead, you have trained to defeat a specific person, using a specific character, in a specific match-up, that used a specific gimmick, in a specific way. So it would be easy for them to simply change things up slightly. At that point, even your training becomes meaningless.
(Case in point: I trained hard to learn to defeat the Ibuki vortex. I can do it! I can defeat that vortex. Even in AE 2012! However, if she changes things up a bit. Gets a little unusual... If she can throw me off, even a little, she can nail her vortex. I have problems with other characters like M. Bison's scissor kick pressure & head-stomp pressure. I'm clueless on that. I've spent hours training against this, and yet most M. Bison players defeat me using those 2 moves alone.)
Most of my opponents, in most fighting games... they don't do anything unsafe... ever. They pretty much just stand there until I attack. They block the attack, and then punish me. So, there is no way to attack them. None. If I walk towards them, they will hit me. If I jump towards them, they will AA me. They wait for it, and then act appropriately. So, there is no way to approach them. If I use projectiles, they will move to a position from which they can punish me every time I fire one. Then they wait. I cannot trick them into attacking. I cannot approach them in a clever way to bring their guard down. They don't care. They stay just out of my range, ready to block & punish anything I can do.
These people are 100% safe, 100% of the time. How can I win if I can't attack or even approach? It is literally impossible. All I can do is just stand there in an endless face-off. Footsies? It is pointless to play footsies with a person that has no intention of attacking. They'll just play footsies back until you attack.
Some of them will attack... eventually. This usually spells doom for you though. Their attacks are carefully planned and trained to yield the greatest possible results. Difficult block-strings, unblockable set-ups, vortexes, corner ****, et cetera. They take no risks whatsoever. Believe me, their goal is to remain safe at all times.
I cannot condition opponents to do anything. They simply punish my every action. They don't care.
To review:- Can't Attack or Approach Enemy - I'll get punished.
- Can't Defend - Mix-ups, unblockables, vortex, et cetera.
- Can't Just Stand There - Boring and accomplishes nothing.
- Can't Run - I'll get locked-down in the corner.
- Can't Condition - They ignore it.
- Can't Play Footsies - They are either way better at it, (and punish) or they ignore it.
It's been, literally, 2 years of this happening, and I haven't the slightest idea what to do against this type of opponent. None. Everything is safe, and everything is perfect. I don't really see how you train against that.This is why I've grown to hate fighting games. It's just... impossible. You need one-on-one coaching from an expert, or you have to have natural talent. I clearly have no talent, so I need coaching. I don't live near any pros. I don't know any pros personally.
Everyone I've reached out to online has either refused to help me, or expected me to start-over from scratch. I'm sorry, practicing basic fireball execution is not going to solve the problem I have. (Blocking-down/back, then walking forward, then blocking-down/back, then walking forward, then trying to hit my opponent with cr.MK > qcf HP turns into cr. MK > HP Shoryuken.) Practicing anti-airing is not going to help me fight jump-ins. The real problem is that they are jumping as a result of positioning, and then waiting for me to attack. They are winning on footsies. Practicing anti-airing will not change that.
Asking for help results in elitism and trolling. BnB refused to help me because my internet is poor. RNFC refused to help me for the same reason. Any posts I make, people show up for the sole purpose of mocking me, and nothing else.
What choice do I have but to be mad and hate all these people? Why would I feel any other way? They won't let me play online. They just lock me down non-stop. They won't talk to me in a civilized or rational manner. They won't help me. They won't coach me. They won't give me advice. They take every oppurtunity to mess with me. Even going so far as pretending they might help me. Just so they can waste a few minutes of my time with nonsense.
So... screw it. I'm not paying for fighting game lessons. I'm not reaching out for help. It's pointless. Whatever you say will be farmed for scrubquotes. They'll take things completely out of context, and make you look like a moron. Talking to people is a waste of time. Talking to people is a waste of time. Making this response is a waste of time. You don't care. You probably did this just to troll me. Just to waste a few minutes of my time with nonsense.