The Elder Scrolls Online

The Elder Scrolls Online

Game isn't authentic to its roots
Every quest, companion and false decision you're allowed to make in this game forces you to be this goodie hero. Edler Scrolls games have fallen so far from Oblivion and Morrowind.

What's the point of Blade of Woe if every companion is going to get upset over it? I should be allowed to use it on them too. Why are we not allowed a morally grey companion?

Why are we not allowed to ally with the ascended knight? entire game makes me feel like I'm on the wrong side of history.

I put 70 hours into it. I just can't. I know I'm going to get flamed but it's an authentic critique.
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Showing 1-15 of 16 comments
Yep. There are quest-givers I'd rather kill, and "villains" I'd rather side with.
The three alliances are terrible as well, IMO.

It's funny: Railroading is a hallmark of a bad D&D campaign (or any RPG for that matter), but here it's somehow acceptable. Make it make sense.
Last edited by Bloodwyrm Wildheart; May 9 @ 6:40pm
Vyrtualis May 9 @ 6:45pm 
Originally posted by Darksynapse:
What's the point of Blade of Woe if every companion is going to get upset over it? I should be allowed to use it on them too. Why are we not allowed a morally grey companion?

Because murder is obviously a reprehensible crime, so most people would revile you for it. Ember, Azandar and Sharp-as-Night are notable for being the only companions to not give negative rapport for murder, killing innocents or using the Blade of Woe.

Originally posted by Darksynapse:
I put 70 hours into it. I just can't. I know I'm going to get flamed but it's an authentic critique.

Not flamed, but 70 hours is peanuts in an MMORPG, especially ESO. You didn't even scratch the surface of what the game has to offer. If you are really interested in giving the game an honest go, you should strap in for a longer ride.
Originally posted by Vyrtualis:
Not flamed, but 70 hours is peanuts in an MMORPG, especially ESO.
70 hours maybe not able yet to get something they like, but it only need 1 hour to see what thing u hate. like if i give u a childish game, u will notice them immediately, no need 70 hours or more. so its ok for him to point out what he saw and dislike for that 70 hour itself.
dont over defend eso.
Originally posted by Vyrtualis:
Originally posted by Darksynapse:
What's the point of Blade of Woe if every companion is going to get upset over it? I should be allowed to use it on them too. Why are we not allowed a morally grey companion?

Because murder is obviously a reprehensible crime, so most people would revile you for it. Ember, Azandar and Sharp-as-Night are notable for being the only companions to not give negative rapport for murder, killing innocents or using the Blade of Woe.

Originally posted by Darksynapse:
I put 70 hours into it. I just can't. I know I'm going to get flamed but it's an authentic critique.

Not flamed, but 70 hours is peanuts in an MMORPG, especially ESO. You didn't even scratch the surface of what the game has to offer. If you are really interested in giving the game an honest go, you should strap in for a longer ride.


I'd agree if you could give one example of allowing my player agency at least one chance at a morally grey decision? Not even talking Blade of Woe'ing some npc. I mean even saying the Ascendant Lord wasn't completely wrong? because he wasn't.
Last edited by Darksynapse; May 9 @ 7:09pm
Originally posted by shionuzuki2021:
70 hours maybe not able yet to get something they like, but it only need 1 hour to see what thing u hate. like if i give u a childish game, u will notice them immediately, no need 70 hours or more. so its ok for him to point out what he saw and dislike for that 70 hour itself.
dont over defend eso.

70 hours is enough to have played the game for maybe a month, given an average gaming session length and played daily. That might be enough time to form an educated opinion for a regular game, but certainly not for an MMORPG.

The Massively part of Massively Multiplayer doesn't just apply to the number of players - the game is also massive, with many different way to play. It's impossible to experience all of those aspects in such a short amount of time.

Originally posted by Darksynapse:
I'd agree if you could give one example of allowing my player agency at least one chance at a morally grey decision? Not even talking Blade of Woe'ing some npc. I mean even saying the Ascendant Lord wasn't completely wrong? because he wasn't.

Well, there are a few options throughout various stories to take a more morally grey option, but almost always the options you're presented in dialogue will be binary choices, and almost always they lead to similar or the same outcome - they're just there for flavor. To be honest with you, the quest roleplay in ESO is one of its weakest points IMO. Like other MMORPGs, the quests are more of an on-rails experience, with too few branching choices or narratives. If you're looking for a deep roleplaying experience akin to the single player TES titles, ESO is not going to deliver. There are roleplaying opportunities in ESO, but they're almost entirely player driven. Where ESO thrives for me is in the lore, having added more to TES lore than the rest of the TES games combined.
Frostea May 10 @ 4:54am 
I don't know Ember seems like morally grey companion seeing as how she loves stealing stuff and gets excited when you do it. She also doesn't care about you using the Blade of Woe or biting people.
Last edited by Frostea; May 10 @ 5:00am
Murder is not morally gray, murder is morally hellish black.
Nah, dude. Elder Scrolls games have always had railroad ethics in their main quests. You're the Nerevarine and you shall respect the important NPC's. If you aren't, then you get a soft-locked game. Can't kill anybody important in Oblivion; you will help the Emperor. Can't kill anyone important in Skyrim, either, and you are the Dragonborn. Daggerfall is easy to soft-lock, too, if I have heard correctly.

I'm having a hard time thinking of any game series that actually lets you be the bad guy, and supports it fully. Usually being the bad guy is a short lived venture and you have to restart to experience the game fully. Or you still save the world, just as an anti-hero. So, this take is bad and not authentic, despite your claims.
Last edited by Ghoul Hunter; May 10 @ 6:59am
Originally posted by Darksynapse:
Every quest, companion and false decision you're allowed to make in this game forces you to be this goodie hero. Edler Scrolls games have fallen so far from Oblivion and Morrowind.

What's the point of Blade of Woe if every companion is going to get upset over it? I should be allowed to use it on them too. Why are we not allowed a morally grey companion?

Why are we not allowed to ally with the ascended knight? entire game makes me feel like I'm on the wrong side of history.

I put 70 hours into it. I just can't. I know I'm going to get flamed but it's an authentic critique.
I don't recall the elder scrolls game where I could play true evil....or even true good. I mean, all of them are kinda morally grey.
Originally posted by Ghoul Hunter:
I'm having a hard time thinking of any game series that actually lets you be the bad guy, and supports it fully. Usually being the bad guy is a short lived venture and you have to restart to experience the game fully. Or you still save the world, just as an anti-hero. So, this take is bad and not authentic, despite your claims.
Knights of the Old Republic.

Divinity Original Sin.

Baldur's Gate 3.

Pathfinder.

Fallout: New Vegas.

Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines

-- All of these are RPGs that fully support being bad to downright evil and really embrace the dark side.

Dragon Age: Origins fully supports being bad throughout the game, but there is the ultimate goal of stopping the Blight (though you can sacrifice allies for that) -- however, you can't support the Blight so it might not fit up your alley.
Originally posted by Elendir Blue:
Murder is not morally gray, murder is morally hellish black.
Every quest I go around butchering my enemies....there's very little game content where I don't fight my way through a whole bunch of people. There's no non-lethal takedown option, there's no option to avoid fighting, and nobody ever asks the inconvenient questions that should be asked of a hero with as many kills as I have.

So IRL, murder might be black, but in this game, it's just all grey. I don't have the option to be good or evil.
Andrey May 10 @ 9:06am 
We are playing for a dead/killed person. Even their soul is used by somebody else. It is nothing, only "vestige", memory. They dont live in the game world and cant save nothing. It is only a slight link between game world and us (real people). So we can look through their eyes like in cinema but closer. You want to make decisions? - make them in your own mind. Sometimes it's not clear who the NPCs are talking to - to our character or us. Maybe.
There are a lot of choices you can make in the game that are just outright evil, so I don't see the issue. Of course it would be great with quests branching out into multiple endings that affect the province and how NPCs treat you. But I remember after talking to an NPC, the game out of the blue offered us to push the NPC off a ledge to his death, lmao.
Midas May 10 @ 10:40am 
Several companions are morally-grey, but even morally-grey people have preferences and standards. Not everyone less-than-good is going to be okay with senseless murder. Ember
and Sharp-as-night don't care about murder or dark brotherhood stuff, but other things bother them.

The irony of the OP's complaint is that the companions actually ARE designed for reasonable choices and roleplay. They are all individual people with likes and dislikes specific to themselves, and they will tell you about them if you talk to them. None of them are going to be totally okay with everything you do, likewise they're going to like some things that might not be obvious at first glance.
Vyrtualis May 10 @ 10:13pm 
Originally posted by Darksynapse:
Every quest, companion and false decision you're allowed to make in this game forces you to be this goodie hero. Edler Scrolls games have fallen so far from Oblivion and Morrowind.

I dunno if you're still checking this topic, OP, but I rememebered something I thought you'd enjoy.
This was from last month, and will be an upcoming feature.

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/67975

"Already present in the free Seasons of the Worm Cult prologue quest, the new Player Response Options truly showcase their potential in the upcoming Seasons of the Worm Cult Part 1, going live alongside Update 46."

Crafting Speech

At the most basic level, Player Response options add another layer to the existing dialogue you’re familiar with in game, one that is more nuanced and emotionally charged.

“The Player Response Options provide a wider roleplaying choice for players,” says Project Narrative Director Bill Slavicsek. “In key situations during certain quests, we give you the option to respond to an NPC in a variety of ways. This will always lead to a different reaction from the NPC and sometimes might even alter the path or ending of a quest.”

A dramatic moment deserves attention

Players have always made choices in ESO, whether attempting to bribe officials, intimidate guards, or simply resolve a quest that requires choices. In this regard, the Player Response Options continue building on what exists—and aren’t even the first examples of their kind!

“We’ve experimented with changing up the player’s usually neutral voice over the years, specifically in tense or dramatic moments in a questline, but now we’ve made it an ongoing and visible part of the game.”

Player Response options in action

These options won’t always be available, but you’ll find them more often than past quests offered, and more clearly marked as to the intended tone. There are several such options available, including Kind, Grim, Merciful, Ruthless, Joker, and Flirty.

“You’ll always have our usual neutral tone response, but other options will now be available, most notably Kind and Grim,” explains Slavicsek. “Kind lets the player show support or compassion for an NPC, while Grim lets them reply with a darker, sterner response.”

Characters with Character

One of the great parts of the new Player Response Options is the characters you get to respond to, of course! Fan-favorite characters have had repeat appearances in many ESO stories over the game’s history, but this is the first time you’ll get to interact with them on this level. Or is it? In the case of some characters, the Player Response options codify and expand the groundwork that has already been laid by your interactions with them.

Razum-dar has a way with words—now, so do you!

“The secret is, we’ve experimented with this using recurring characters a lot over the years,” says Slavicsek. “When you got to flirt with Naryu or Darien or Jakarn, that was us testing the waters. When you got to get angry or sympathetic with Eveli Sharp-Arrow during the Orsinium main quest, that was us letting the player earn those variations from our usual neutral-voiced responses because of where we were at that point in the story.”

Your first taste of the new Player Response Options is already on live servers for you to try out via the new prologue quest, with a great deal more coming alongside Update 46 for the release of Seasons of the Worm Cult Part 1 and the Solstice zone.

Have a chat with Prince Azah in the new Prologue quest

If you’re the sort of player who likes to dig into your character’s motivations and get inside their head, this makes the new content better than ever before. Even if you’ve never been much of a roleplayer, you might find the options provided invite you to start thinking like one.

“For example, in the Prologue, you really get to test out the system when you encounter a wounded Worm Cultist and need to get some information out of them,” says Slavicsek. “Is your character the kind of hero that uses the carrot or the stick to get what they require? Now you can explore both of those options in this key moment in the story.”
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