Too Many DPS, Not Enough Damage

[Noteworthy]

Too many times am I queued for a dungeon, and I get two worthless "DPS" who just spam light attacks, followed by a single skill. No buffs, no debuffs, and crummy looking gear. If you queue for a random normal dungeon, I suppose it's fine. But certainly not a random vet. C'mon guys, learn to build some proper damage. Also, why do some people not have at least one self heal on either ability bar?

[Green]

Lots of new players. They just have not learned how to DPS yet. Often they follow the in game default skill suggestions which are not great and do not give a self heal most of the time. I find if you are friendly to them, they often open to build advice.

For vet, could also be some newer players trying vet for first few times. I have also encountered people that link me "solo all content" build guides from youtubers that rely entirely on damage done and light attacks for healing and sustain. I personally do not like the build, but I guess it can be popular at times.

[HNTR]

The no self heal is because have you looked at the meta builds? None of them have self heal. Why waste a potential dps skill int he rotation for healing that a healer should always provide?
But yeah, too many scrubs around. Why anyone would want to still start into this game puzzles me as long time players don't want to be bothered with filthy noobs

[Alun1]

Originally posted by Noteworthy:

Too many times am I queued for a dungeon, and I get two worthless "DPS" who just spam light attacks, followed by a single skill. No buffs, no debuffs, and crummy looking gear. If you queue for a random normal dungeon, I suppose it's fine. But certainly not a random vet. C'mon guys, learn to build some proper damage. Also, why do some people not have at least one self heal on either ability bar?

the problem with the game is people have this exact mentality with normal dungeons as well.

if a person who is obviously still leveling to 50 in the group, unless everything melts immediately a tank or healer rage-quits.

it's a videogame and not everyone has put in as much time as you have. learn a bit of patience.

[PinkFluffyGoat]

fake dps is a very common thing. my friend always asked me why i would leave dungeon when i tank. tis b why

[Elendir Blue]

Vet dungeon with PUG is risky. You can get good group, but sometime you dont.

[DazzieBoi]

I see it all the time, just because a boss takes more that 2 minutes to kill vet players moan about low dps players then quit the dungeon, players dps should not the be all end all for this type of content, yes it matters to a degree but it shouldn't make vet players quit instead just enjoy the game.

So many tryhards its starting to feel like battlefield , not everyone understands the whole mechanics of the game and play for entertainment not speed running dungeons, if you want to speed run dungeons than maybe make your own party instead of joining a random one then you wont have to rage quit cos some other player is doing less damage then you'd like.

[MISO4EVER]

or they are new players still trying to learn how to play (its not like the game explains well how to light attack weave or make a heavy attack build) it takes time to learn they are just trying to level their character and learn how to play. its a game its not that deep or serious not everyone is a bad actor or trying to be a problem they are just trying to play the game. thats the risk you run with pugs. eventually people will learn how to play better or they will leave, but at the end of the day its just a game...let people have fun.

[markos.zarras.outlook]

Plenty of reasons.
Many DPS think they just have to focus purely on DPS so much they think using 1 Slot for a Selfheal for example is wasteful.
But all you need for DPS except weaving, is at least 1x Dot, 1x Debuff, 1x Spammable.
Game already gives you much more when you spec for DPS and allows you to stack even more this way.

Example DW/2H DK: Deadly Cloak (Has an uptime duration), Venomous Claw, (A Dot and Status Effect application with a long duration) does the damage for you, boosts poisoned attacks, Noxious Breath (Damage and Debuff that is close to a spammable), Molten Whip (Spammable and boosts your damage), Flames of Oblivion (An AoE 3 Target attack you can renew constantly) add to the fact, you build up stacks of seething fury and empower your Molten Whip to hit harder, plus an Ultimate (Flawless Dawnbreaker) that gives you both the benefit of your Class Passives that trigger immediate Sustain and full resource recovery in an instant, (Stamina/ Magicka/ Health) and empowers your overall damage.
Add to that, lets say a Monster Set that Procs some Burst if the target is constantly affected by a Status Effect (for example Valkyn Skoria) very powerful actually, although i find Zaan set better and thats already one bar.
Oakensoul can make this overperform.

Add Crushing Enchantment on Backbar and use your Debuff to lower target Resistances and enhance your group's damage. You don't even need a Group dmg buff set, though it can be usefull in some Trials.

That was just the first bar.

You still have a 2nd bar, Barbed Trap (Bleeding Dot), Carve (Another Bleed Dot), Stampede (Spammable which provides mobility, hits hard and affects the area around a target), Erruption another AoE/ Spammable with Damage over Time effect (Also Procs Valkyn Skoria)
and a second Ultimate (Standard of Might, providing both Damage, Self Sustain and provides a Group Synergy.

Sometimes you can even Off Tank and Tank most content with just the same Spec/ Build.
You might just need a few Heavy pieces a Shield and slot some extra Skills (Unrelenting Grip/ Magma Shell/ Igneous or Fragmented Shield/ Undaunted Inner Fire Morphs, Volatile or Hardened Armor and Coagulating or Green Dragon Blood, Deep Breath or Draw Essence, Warhorn maybe and or Rally and Razor Caltrops can also be a nice utility tool and lastly your main skill Pierce Armor. Defensive Stance is also good and useful.
You can make this work even very early just after you hit 160CP, by using Orders Wrath (Weapons/ Accesories) and rotate between Hunding's Rage and preferable Heavy Set for tanking whenever necessary) without the need to respec or use the armory.

Just like the Flex Tape/ Seal Guy says ''Now that's alot of damage''

Which raises the question:
Why not slot at least Resolving Vigor?
My self i use Echoing Vigor (Adds more uptime of Heal over time and heals your entire group) but even if you dont have it, or dont want to use it, you still have Coagulating Blood (or whichever Class Skill, this is just a Dragonknight example) which is one of the strongest Burst Heals in the game.

So, what ''Pure'' DPS skill you can't live without that you have to sacrifice a selfheal for that will offer more then the entirety of your Spec?

And tbh, i rarely see propper Healing in PuGs. Not that i care much, i just sustain myself better and pop Echoing Vigor anyway. The only place where its an issue is Trials were a raid should have dedicated Healers.

Yet DPS Role might be just the only role that doesn't have to change their Build for Trials anyway.

Then there's also the matter of ''Too much Crit''
One that has some basic Crit should build more Crit Damage later, have some ''ok penetration'' and decent weapon damage. So i can't see why focusing purely on Crit is practical like many do.
Just go around 60% Crit and it should be enough, then turn your focus on other stats. Trials for example will require more Buff or Debuff capability plus sustain and alot of Crit with poor Critical Damage isn't better then lower Crit but more Critical Damage and overall Weapon Damage. But the most damage comes from Debuffs and Damage Over time stacking.

Adaptive Rotation = More DPS.

[Nex]

Make your group, don´t PUG = You are Gucci bruh... If you expect trifecta achiev run level group on normal/vet PUG, you will be disappointed (shocking...)

[Burba]

I have been tanking a lot of normal dungeons in the last few days and every other one has new players in it. If I see new players at the start I will just slow down a bit. I even had one where half the players were new and we wiped on a boss. Adds just built up and it was what it was. One person quit and we downed that boss and finished the dungeon with the two new guys me and a companion one of them had. It was a fun time.

It is good to see the game attracting so many new players as well as bringing old vets back.

[Chronocide]

Originally posted by Noteworthy:

Too many times am I queued for a dungeon, and I get two worthless "DPS" who just spam light attacks, followed by a single skill. No buffs, no debuffs, and crummy looking gear. If you queue for a random normal dungeon, I suppose it's fine. But certainly not a random vet. C'mon guys, learn to build some proper damage. Also, why do some people not have at least one self heal on either ability bar?

As long as we're wishlishing, Can we also get tanks that use taunt and healers that heal?

Also DPS that don't taunt would be nice.

I think the problem is that transmutes are mandatory for everyone, so everyone is basically forced into the random dungeons, regardless of them being adequately prepared or not.

[Halcyform]

Whining about quality of PUG groups is no different than complaining about the pain you receive from punching yourself in the face.

[Kissing Fish]

A complaint as old as time.
People have been complaining about pugs since 2014. and the solution will always be:
make your own group.
very simple

[Halcyform]

Originally posted by Burba:

It is good to see the game attracting so many new players as well as bringing old vets back.

As far as veterans go, it's a wash.

They aren't really back. Some of them dip back in to check on new content. Most will be gone inside a couple months and, maybe, a small percentage will stay for greater than that.

[Chronocide]

Originally posted by markos.zarras.outlook:

That was just the first bar.

....

Why not slot at least Resolving Vigor?

Regarding these two points.

Not everyone utilizes both bars. Not everyone even understands the advantage of having two builds on two different bars. The game sure doesn't explain it well. And it's true, you don't actually need a dual bar build.

Resolving vigor is part of the PvP acquired skill line, so players that don't ever PvP won't have it or know about it.

Your dungeon finder group is PvE content...That undaunted skill line is the one that's supposed to be tailored to dungeons (with that healing orb being a morph of the last acquired skill).

And the game gives absolutely zero guidelines on what is DPS or tank or healer. I can have zero weapons or armor equipped and still join the daily random dungeons. Even on vet.

How would a player even know if they are doing enough damage to be good DPS? My guild would tell me...sure, but the game never does.