Recommended CP for DLC Vet Dungeons?

[Accel Lex]

ESO Vet Dungeons

Question in title sums it up. But I added my armor set and experiences with DLC Vet Dungeons below in case that makes a difference.
Overall I’m liking the game as a tank. I just want to see at what point will I not be seen as unworthy of the big bad dungeons.

I’m around CP 350, Dragonknight Imperial Tank. I use Leeching Armor Set, Master Mace/Shield, and alternate between Winter’s Respite for additional heal, Deadly for extra DPS and stamina regen, Gloom Grace for heal and damage reduction from aoe but Winter’s heals more reliably so I don’t use it as often, and I used to have two monster set pieces Bone Warden or something to increase resistances. All of them are Gold Rarity. I have about 45k health, and with two damage shield abilities, can get 35k extra damage shields.

When I joined either Skycaller something, or Coral something, don’t remember names. I said that I haven’t done that one before so I’ll follow their lead. One person left right away. The other said in a polite way to mean no offense, that it was probably too high level for me and he’d bounce, especially since the regular mobs hit like a truck apparently. I said no worries. Last guy said no hard feelings but he would as well.
I wanted to see how the dungeon was myself. I managed to solo the first boss up to 10%, but it was a slow process since I was still in my tank build. And by that point I was getting bored.
Next group that joined walked me through the specific mechanics I didn’t know and we did great. So I was glad it is possible.
Since then I’ve been getting the Vet ones down so I’m not as intimidated, but still make mistakes now and then.

Im not an expert at all. Im often asking for feedback or direction if they need me to change what im doing. I’ve been completing Vet dungeons lately as part of Pledges and Random Vet Dungeons. Some end up being the DLC ones that I was told are more difficult.
I’ll die sometimes, and be the only one alive to revive my team in others. I’ll feel bad since I was supposed to take the agro away, but they reassured me that some bosses don’t always stay exclusively to taunted effect, and some game mechanics/ abilities go all over the place anyways.

For one, apparently we were all way under leveled since one guy said he couldn’t pass it even with everyone being double our CP. I was the lowest CP in that group and it was the Vet Dungeon where we turn into werewolf beasts from potions against a Mad Scientist. Highest CP was Mabye around 800.
One Vet dungeon where the end boss turns into a big bear, one of the people asked that no one rage quits since this was her 5th group. My team did great.

Yesterday someone in my guild asked if anyone can tank for last boss in a dungeon. I said I didn’t know which dungeon that is but if he can’t find someone else, I’d give it a shot.
He said that I’m likely too under leveled.
I said it’s fine. I figured he got someone else which was completely acceptable and less time investment for me trying to help out, but it led me to wonder what would be the CP rank so that I wouldn’t be doubted as often.

[Kissing Fish]

Recomend to join a guild of like minded individuals so you can experience vet dungeons in a fun progressive and more enjoyable way.

[mimizukari]

600

[DargonBlak]

Автор сообщения: deneb altair vega

600

This

As Basil points out, Vet dungeons are not really hard if you are in a coordinated group.

PuG'ing Vet Dungeons usually doesn't end well, but i've run with Guildies as 4 DPS through Vet Dungeons and had a blast.

And in a decent guild, u could probably start around CP420, if you have two good sets (at purple) so your're not being completely carried. (don't bother golding out until u get close to the soft cap ~1500CP)

And prob start with the easier dungeons to grab some basic helms like Slimecraw (WS1)

[Kissing Fish]

"He said that I’m likely too under leveled.
I said it’s fine. I figured he got someone else which was completely acceptable and less time investment for me trying to help out, but it led me to wonder what would be the CP rank so that I wouldn’t be doubted as often."

In Eso, its not really about your CP level rank but more about how familiar you are with the mechanics of the dungeon + how familiar you are with your character.
And one sure way to gain that experience is playing with others.

[mimizukari]

Автор сообщения: Basil.ThreeKings

"He said that I’m likely too under leveled.
I said it’s fine. I figured he got someone else which was completely acceptable and less time investment for me trying to help out, but it led me to wonder what would be the CP rank so that I wouldn’t be doubted as often."

In Eso, its not really about your CP level rank but more about how familiar you are with the mechanics of the dungeon + how familiar you are with your character.
And one sure way to gain that experience is playing with others.

It is about CP rank when playing with randoms. If you have less than 600 people won't want to waste their time in the veteran dungeon since that's around how much you need to maximize dps/tankiness/healing (whatever role you're in)

[Thomas D.]

The higher the better. There is no specific mark. If you get queued with a bunch of CP 300 you would be seen as a very experienced player if you have CP 600. If you get queued with a bunch of CP 1600+ you will be seen as a noob with CP 600.

But no matter which role you are playing, I already have seen a few CP 300 guys that did great and which I would always choose instead of the standard CP 1000+ guy. But this cases are very rare because you need a lot of skill / experience and a good build to compensate for the missing CP, but most low CP people tend to lack in any of this categories. But most (not all) of them were experienced players with alt accounts.

Also I see plenty CP 1000+ guys who just play bad no matter which role. As a DD they do almost no damage and / or die to anything. As tank they can't survive, taunt, stack, debuff and buff, sometimes not even anything of that list. Or healers who don't do any meaningfull healing, give no buffs and no sustain and sometimes try to do neglectible damage instead. Luckily the Healer role is often not needed to finish dungeons.

So what matters more is how good you are playing on your role. If you are bad even having CP 1600 won't help you, if you are great you can just do vet DLC dungeons with CP 300.

But the sets you are mentioned are ego sets and
thus they aren't great. Becausee as a tank your job isn't only to stay alive and take aggro. It is also to debuff the enemy and buff allies. Also to control the fight (stack adds so that DDs can maximize their damage). And the least is to provide damage, it's fine to do damage but it's your lowest priority.

But on CP 300 you probably need at least one ego set to stay alive in the most difficult content. So it is ok for now. Because a dead tank is by far worse than a tank that gives no buffs / debuffs.

Just two debuffs should be active at all time (at least against bosses and elite mobs) if possible and which will have the highest impact of any buff / debuff: major and minor breach (6k + 3k pen)! Because adds have about 18k resistances and DDs expect that the tank provides about 11-12k pen (crusher glyph on top of minor and major breach). This alone can make the difference if a DD does just about 20k or 40-50k+ which will make stuff much faster and easier (even for the tank).

[Andrey]

There are guides about dungeon mechanics. In Vet DLC dungeons you need to know them.
Alcast site for example.

[Accel Lex]

Thanks you for all the responses. Hopefully I didn't come off as having an angry rant. I'm not upset at all about it since people are investing their time so I can't blame them for thinking they'd be wasting their time. I was just curious, and think it's funny when a lower leveled CP person fills in and we complete the dungeon right after a much higher CP said we wouldn't be able to complete it.

Knowing the mechanics for sure helps. Some group members would ask who hasn't done it before and gives tips on what to do, which helps a lot.

I think I'd be a selfish tank then. Didn't think much of armor sets that buff or debuff the enemy since I figured it wouldn't do much good if I can't survive myself. Especially since I'm considered Underleveled. Currently I'd say I do a good job surviving. Despite being self conscious about being newer, most groups I've been at say I did great, especially for being so underleveled.
It's mainly the hard hitting AOE attacks, or I'm I get distracted and don't block or dodge an instant kill ability. Running out of resources is a big one too. Luckily, ally synergies help a lot to replenish stamina, and I have a potion and Ult as a backup.

My back bar loadout is my Masters bow, and I put my DOT abilities there, that also lower enemy resistance, so I figured having that instead of a dedicated set would help at least a bit.
Yesterday's dungeon was the first Vet dungeon we couldn't complete. It was one of the Undaunted Pledges, a bone colosus or something would spawn skeletons and keep spawning them while growing stronger. We kept trying but then one DPS had to go, then the other one left. I kept asking what I could do differently, but the healer said that I did perfect surviving the hits even at his stronger forms, and the issue was mainly that DPS couldn't kill skeleton hordes that power him up fast enough.
Looking at the top comments, that's probably what you meant by saying buff/debuff armor sets would come in handy. So thanks for the recommendation.
Leeching armor I'm likely going to keep. It served me well this whole time. Master's set comes in handy too so I'm keeping it for the time being. I'd likely replace the other one since at the moment I'm using the set that increases DOT abilities by 15%, since Winter's Respite and Gloom Graced didn't really make a huge difference with Leeching serving me so well.
I'll look up which sets are good for tank to help team out. I was told as a tank just worry about surviving and drawing aggro. Leading enemy where the team need. Revive healer first if everyone dies. With my Shield Ult, I can easily tank hits while Leeching and skills heal me for most fights I've been on. Only issue is getting interrupted.

[Accel Lex]

Автор сообщения: Thomas D.

But the sets you are mentioned are ego sets and
thus they aren't great. Becausee as a tank your job isn't only to stay alive and take aggro. It is also to debuff the enemy and buff allies. Also to control the fight (stack adds so that DDs can maximize their damage). And the least is to provide damage, it's fine to do damage but it's your lowest priority.

But on CP 300 you probably need at least one ego set to stay alive in the most difficult content. So it is ok for now. Because a dead tank is by far worse than a tank that gives no buffs / debuffs.

Just two debuffs should be active at all time (at least against bosses and elite mobs) if possible and which will have the highest impact of any buff / debuff: major and minor breach (6k + 3k pen)! Because adds have about 18k resistances and DDs expect that the tank provides about 11-12k pen (crusher glyph on top of minor and major breach). This alone can make the difference if a DD does just about 20k or 40-50k+ which will make stuff much faster and easier (even for the tank).

I've never heard the phrase "Ego Sets" before so thank you for elaborating. For sure I've been focusing on self sustain since I used to get thrased by minor mobs in normal dungeons (Imperial Prison) until I got leeching set, then started building myself up with other pieces, skills, experience, and suddenly dungeons weren't an impossible barrier anymore. Especially being able to contend against the DLC Veteran Dungeons. So I suppose I always had that mentality that so long as I can survive, I did my job.

I'll have to look up which sets do well for tank. The build I based mine on had different variations, some for improving team damage, raising resistances, lowering enemy resistances. I disregarded those thinking that as a tank, it's not my job to focus on damage since I should just be able to take more of it. So this realization helps a lot.

My taunt ability causes Major and Minor breach. With Master's Shield, I also gain HP and resistances by doing that. And since I do poison damage, I get stamina out of it too.
I have the fire breath ability that does the same thing but I don't think the two would stack. I heard two Majors won't, but Major and Minor would, so using my fire ability for other than that extra DOT and magicka regen for me doesn't seem a good use of my magicka if I'm tanking.

[AmaiAmai]

I saw a dev team member claim that the game testers test all the vet dungeons without CP slotted.

I play without CP slotted, and I can tell you that I doubt it's true, as Lair of Marseelok and other vet dungeons with hard DPS checks become a massive slog, as they're nothing but places you DPS or die.

ZOS really needs to stop pretending that they play like players do; they probably all play other games. Gilliam, Gina, etc. are known to not actually play the game...I bet they even forgot the game for U35!

[mimizukari]

Автор сообщения: Thomas D.

The higher the better. There is no specific mark. If you get queued with a bunch of CP 300 you would be seen as a very experienced player if you have CP 600. If you get queued with a bunch of CP 1600+ you will be seen as a noob with CP 600.

But no matter which role you are playing, I already have seen a few CP 300 guys that did great and which I would always choose instead of the standard CP 1000+ guy. But this cases are very rare because you need a lot of skill / experience and a good build to compensate for the missing CP, but most low CP people tend to lack in any of this categories. But most (not all) of them were experienced players with alt accounts.

Also I see plenty CP 1000+ guys who just play bad no matter which role. As a DD they do almost no damage and / or die to anything. As tank they can't survive, taunt, stack, debuff and buff, sometimes not even anything of that list. Or healers who don't do any meaningfull healing, give no buffs and no sustain and sometimes try to do neglectible damage instead. Luckily the Healer role is often not needed to finish dungeons.

So what matters more is how good you are playing on your role. If you are bad even having CP 1600 won't help you, if you are great you can just do vet DLC dungeons with CP 300.

But the sets you are mentioned are ego sets and
thus they aren't great. Becausee as a tank your job isn't only to stay alive and take aggro. It is also to debuff the enemy and buff allies. Also to control the fight (stack adds so that DDs can maximize their damage). And the least is to provide damage, it's fine to do damage but it's your lowest priority.

But on CP 300 you probably need at least one ego set to stay alive in the most difficult content. So it is ok for now. Because a dead tank is by far worse than a tank that gives no buffs / debuffs.

Just two debuffs should be active at all time (at least against bosses and elite mobs) if possible and which will have the highest impact of any buff / debuff: major and minor breach (6k + 3k pen)! Because adds have about 18k resistances and DDs expect that the tank provides about 11-12k pen (crusher glyph on top of minor and major breach). This alone can make the difference if a DD does just about 20k or 40-50k+ which will make stuff much faster and easier (even for the tank).

People with just 300 shouldn't be queueing random vets. The number to do vet dungeons is a static number, it's exactly 600. that's how much you need to maximize the potential for whatever one of the 3 roles you're playing.
If you have under 600 people will quit and you only have yourself to blame for queueing with such a low level :\

[Hayley]

600

[Thomas D.]

Автор сообщения: deneb altair vega

People with just 300 shouldn't be queueing random vets. The number to do vet dungeons is a static number, it's exactly 600. that's how much you need to maximize the potential for whatever one of the 3 roles you're playing.
If you have under 600 people will quit and you only have yourself to blame for queueing with such a low level :\

Plain toxic BS! For sure you can do most Vet dungeons with < 600 CP. I did this myself with friends as soon as it was accssible to us and we leveled most of our CPs with dungeons. Btw. we did this at a time before the new CP system where a big chunk of the previous CP power was given away to anyone and you needed plenty CPs to just reach the power of a non CP character we have now.

Here are some of those changes:

All characters have had their base Health increased to 16,000, up from 8744 and their Magicka and Stamina has increased to 12,000, up from 7958.

These changes were made to offset the loss of the 20% stat increases gained from the original Champion Point system, where spending 100 points in a tree would increase the base stat of the tree by 20%.

Characters now also take 15% reduced damage at base, to reduce the loss of the mitigation from the Champion Point system.
Characters now also start with 20 Weapon and Spell Damage at level 1 and gain an additional 20 per level, up to 1000 at level 50.

Source: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/559360/pts-patch-notes-v6-3-0

And some of the dungeons like lair of maarselok even were way harder back then than they are now (it got nerft like some other ones)!

Only noobs (who need stronger players that can carry them) or those idiots you even dont want to play with that get angry if they have to wait 1 second and probably just run directly to the end of the boss, skipping everything will instantly leave. Not a single good experienced player will do this until he sees how well or bad the players are doing.

Btw. most often I hear what you wrote from mediocre players who think they are great but are truely only mediocre at best...

The only thing that is true is that most low CP guys lack the experience and highly probably a proper build, especially considering how quick you get CP 300-600 nowadays and thus will play bad, but this can and does happen with some high CP guys who start to do such dungeons the first time, too. Its the lack of experiences and / or a proper build not the lack of CPs.

And btw. I have seen several low CP guys (300-400) who did great, better than most CP 1000+ / 2000+ people you meet, lastly someone below CP 400 who did constantly over 40k / 50k DPS (in peek much more), while plenty CP 1000+ / 2000+ guys even cant manage to constantly deal more than 15k DPS. Also I have met plenty low CP tanks who did well (even most of them were in ego sets and the total damage lower than usual) while I regularly see CP 1000+ / 2000+ tanks who cant stay alive and die if the boss starts farting, and cause wipe after wipe and sometimes even dont give any buffs, often have a big ego, but play like absolute trash...

Just the chances are higher that a low CP player plays worse than a high CP player but its not a rule or law also there is nothing in the whole CP system which can replace skill and experience, even mediocre or bad players often think so and start wondering why they are failing even on high CPs and then just blame others (maybe the low CP player who did well / better...)

Btw. people who really wait until they get CP 600 or even more will get called out by people like you that they are "bad" or "noob" or "trash" because they should be able to do that dungeon with such a high CP even if they never did it before...

Also the only way to get the experience is just to play the dungeons, the earlier the better (after you got a proper build). Nothing in the overworld (except a few world bosses) will prepare anyone for vet dungeons no matter how many CPs he will accumulate...

Автор сообщения: tfmf

When i came back to the game in 2017 i did vMA flawless run being a CP 200 on stamina NB.

I first step into this arena when I was slightly above CP 300 without reading any guides, I even didnt knew that there were 2 difficulties (or how to set them for solo arenas) and went in on vet accidentaly. The first arena was boring and I thought: "is that this hard arena anyone is talking about?". The second was fun, did only wipe once at the boss. The third arena took me 2 or 3 tries at the endboss. But the 4th arena was the only show stopper for me, because I didnt understood the mech of the boss but it was also buggy (I had no visual areas and didnt knew if I have to stay close to the boss or away from the boss) and I hadnt enough damage to just skip all mechs and burn it like I have now.

At another day (only a few CP more) I read up how the 4th boss works and managed to get to the 5th arena. Which was so far easy until the endboss where I didnt understood what was killing me (ice ghost adds and the smash attack from the boss).

All in all I think the arena was doable even at those low CP I had at that time but I didnt want to read up guides or keep trying for several hours, so my first clear was at about CP 500-600 and at about CP 800 I did the flawless conquerer.

Автор сообщения: AmaiAmai

I saw a dev team member claim that the game testers test all the vet dungeons without CP slotted.

I play without CP slotted, and I can tell you that I doubt it's true, as Lair of Marseelok and other vet dungeons with hard DPS checks become a massive slog, as they're nothing but places you DPS or die.

Are you serious? Since Lair of Maarselok got really nerft hard you literally dont need big damage anymore and its barely more difficult than a non DLC dungeon right now, its just long. And if alking about vet clears and not hardmodes or trifectas I totally believe that those dungeons are doable without CPs, just with slightly different builds than you would usually play with full CPs. I did some naked runs and some runs with a missing DD or healer (only 3 players) even DLC dungeons on vet. And haveing no CP is probably less bad than haveing a complete DD less.

Автор сообщения: Accel Lex

My back bar loadout is my Masters bow, and I put my DOT abilities there, that also lower enemy resistance, so I figured having that instead of a dedicated set would help at least a bit.

Do you mean an infused bow with the crusher glyph? Then this is ok but usually tanks use the frost staff and wall of elements for this. Or do you mean something like focused aim? Then this is bad because you get the same debuff from the Pierce Armor Skill and it wont do anything.

But in general have a look at this:
Tank Sets: https://thetankclub.com/eso-tank-sets/
Dragon Knight Skills: https://thetankclub.com/eso-dragonknight-tank/
General / Weapon Skills and Skilllines: https://thetankclub.com/eso-general-tank-skills/
Generic Dungeon Builds (use the tabs on the top, they are only examples not necessarily the best in any situation and the best for you): https://thetankclub.com/eso-dungeon-tank-build/

[mimizukari]

@Thomas D
that's just how it is, have 600 or people quit, I'm not saying whether it's right or wrong, but if you want to do public random vets then have 600+ or you won't have a good time in matchmaking.

[Accel Lex]

Автор сообщения: Accel Lex

My back bar loadout is my Masters bow, and I put my DOT abilities there, that also lower enemy resistance, so I figured having that instead of a dedicated set would help at least a bit.

Do you mean an infused bow with the crusher glyph? Then this is ok but usually tanks use the frost staff and wall of elements for this. Or do you mean something like focused aim? Then this is bad because you get the same debuff from the Pierce Armor Skill and it wont do anything.

But in general have a look at this:
Tank Sets: https://thetankclub.com/eso-tank-sets/
Dragon Knight Skills: https://thetankclub.com/eso-dragonknight-tank/
General / Weapon Skills and Skilllines: https://thetankclub.com/eso-general-tank-skills/
Generic Dungeon Builds (use the tabs on the top, they are only examples not necessarily the best in any situation and the best for you): https://thetankclub.com/eso-dungeon-tank-build/ [/quote]

This is a lot of useful information. Thank you very much. :)
I don't use the infused effect right now. I had to google "Focused aim" since I just started using bow shortly after getting the bow and not being proficient trying staff. For Minor/Major breach I use the Shield/Sword Taunt since it does both, taunt, and regen my health. But the backbar ability I meant was the fire breath ability but it only does one of those breaches. But it gives more dps, along with other DOT abilities. I used to run pure tanking abilities but that did not work out for quite a couple dungeons.

It's my experimental Tank with some DPS build. I only got back to the game about a week or two ago, and coming back reminded me how bad I was with no sets or experience. Investing in leeching set then adding other stuff through experimentation definitely helped to the point where I could solo world bosses, some dungeon bosses, compared to dying at the first group of trash mobs like I used to. For me this is progress, but it's also why I always appreciate feedback and constructive criticism.

Is 2k dps as tank in PVP good?
I decided to try PVP because I had a writ that required an area of the map that was under enemy control. But I needed to control the town to do that. When I left off, I couldn't even kill the NPCs. This time, I was able to take them all down, and even defeat players above my CP level. Before, I would die to anything with a pulse, and NPCs without one, so I was proud. At one point, I fought off and defeated two players that had the guards on their side. It was a tough battle since they had above 800cp. Then I went to cyrodil and did better than I thought.
There was one guy at 2k that was too tough, but I lasted about a minute surviving since he healed whenever I got close to killing.
One player whispered to me saying I surprised her since she saw I had about 44k health and maintained good dps on her. But since I'm not experienced in PVP I wasn't sure if that was good, or if I was just fighting against players trying out new builds.

For sure I have much to learn, but I feel much better going forward knowing I'm not the one that dies first all the time anymore. Sometimes I have to revive the rest of my dungeon, which I felt bad about since I knew my job was to keep them alive, but they said some mechanics damage anyone regardless.
Luckily, with the exception of two groups that quit for seeing low CPs, I haven't fought a single Vet Dungeon we couldn't finish. Even if it did take a couple times with everyone learning the mechanics of it.