COUGAR discussion -- all threads will be merged here

[Hinterland_Studio]

Since so much of the Cougar feedback is similar and there are many threads, it makes sense to consolidate them in one place for the dev team to consult the feedback.

[Frytka]

Feedback about cougars.

I think many dislike the idea of it spawning just in front of you. It would be better idea, to actually add it as wandering animal somewhere in the region instead of it being just another version of invisible Darkwalker. It could be impossible to hunt it, as it would always be in random position, watching you from far or escaping if you get too close. (I am not National Geografic, I do not know how exactly they behave. Those are my speculations). Now, for the attack itself. Cougar could slowly start getting closer and closer without any alerts. Then if you magane to see it, it would be running fast to you and then jumping on to one of your poor Mackenzies. So if you would see it quick enought, you would be able to defend yourself and possibly defeat it. In my opinion it is quite better form of cougar. The feeling, that it actually is physically somewhere on the map, instead of it being Darkwalker wich is even worse, because it just jumps on to you, without any warning (Darkwalker had "Anxiety", and "Fear", and you could hear it (It was terryfying at some point)). I hope you enjoyed reading, and do not get me wrong. Rest of the update is really great. This is just one thing that quite bothers me.

[Yuri]

Sadly the craftables are also pretty useless in my opinion. The knife is a nice trophy, but once you managed to kill cougars, I doubt a wolf would pose any real challenge (the only animal you can use the knife against). As far as harvest and crafting efficiency goes, as far as I know its on par with the improvised knife, so no advantage there.

The head wrap is even worse in my opinion, just barely better than a rabbit, but also 3x as heavy. So sadly no incentives there either.

[Goof]

be careful what we wish for with hinterland. same thing as cabin fever, they took a decent idea and implemented it so poorly that we wish we never brought it up

[mranders]

I'm not really excited about the way its been implemented, but I totally understand why Hinterland did it the way they did. Unlike other wildlife the Cougar seems to exist physically as a cut-scene with minimal interaction during the end phase in order to kill it. The audio is introduced during play quite easily and is fine. Sure it would be great if the player could catch glimpses at a distance, maybe get off a lucky shot, even successfully defend against an ambush attack if in the open and in good visibility, but that might involve a bunch more SW challenges than is worth it at this point. I'm only going by what I've observed from streamers trying to kill it so perhaps the Cougar cut-scene doesn't trigger if the player is alert, armed, in the open, and with good visibility. Instead it waits for that "Oh hey! Cattails" moment - and Boom!

[Yuri]

From what I've seen from streamers and observed from my own game: The cougar is never visible before the cutscene. The youtuber Zaknafein has a clip where he was in PV, in open terrain, good weather, kept looking around and then out of nowhere it ambushed him. Had the same experience in front of the camp office in ML, where I was waiting for it to appear. Clear skies and still no spawn until the cutscene.

[Subjekt One]

I was about to make a discussion about it, but I'll just add to this one instead.

I completely agree! The cougar appearing out of thin air is dumb. I wish we could see it in the distance, stalking the player, until it come close enough to start charging at the player, very, VERY fast.

Apart from that, everything else is good. Even great in my opinion.

If they decide to rework it in the future and make it an actual wildlife animal acting in the world, I would love it if it was almost ALWAYS stalking the player when entering the region, sneaking around following the player, hiding behind the environment (trees, buildings, etc) until it comes close enough to charge! Even being above the player, on a hill, and waiting for the player to pass under so it can jump on us.

So the best way to counter it would be in an open area.

That would be VERY cool and terryfing!

[Setora]

Any ways to trigger its attacks ?
I've been stalked by it for like 6 days now and nothing is happening, I already don't like the mechanic but I wanted to see it play at least once, i've been playing for like 2 hours running around in the region listening to its meowing constantly and that's pretty much it.

[Martial.Lore]

I enabled the cougar in my long term Voyageur save but after being forced to leave the new region before exploring half of it, I left the region and thought to myself: that's it, I'm only playing Pilgrim from now on (I hate timber wolves so all wolves must now be nerfed) or custom games.

I got ready to abandon my long term save but then when Hinterland issued the update allowing us to reset our previous saves again, I disabled the cougar. Forever. I'll never enable it again.

Being forced to move around by the threat of a quick time event is not why I play TLD. It has always been my chill exploration game, first and foremost, which is why I bought the DLC: more regions to explore.

[Shiro]

I thought that even though really badly implemented, the cougar can be easily avoided, turns out I was wrong. I had the warning "Cougar encroaching 1 day". at sundered pass, moved to forsaken airfield through the cave and then waited till the 10 day countdown timer till the cougar in sundered pass disappeared.

Went back through the cave after that and thought I can finally finish exploring the new region. About half a day after I arrived a new messages props up "Cougar encroaching 5 days".

So this means you actively have to stay out of a cougar infested region for at least a whole month before you can re enter it with the full safe period. It actually punishes exploration and encourages sitting in a neighbouring region for a month, exactly the opposite of what they intended...

[»SoD« Thekillergreece]

Cougars need to be REDUX-ed (SPOILERS) - Criticism, Feedback

https://hinterlandforums.com/forums/topic/45207-cougars-need-to-be-redux-ed-spoilers-criticism-feedback/#comment-280128

[MadBone12]

I haven't encountered the cougar yet so no clear opinion on how it works. However, I don't like the UI element it introduces. It's very immersion breaking to have some sort of visible counter. Since when do we have such warnings about danger in survival? I would prefer if we could disable that.

[Seriously Unserious]

Ideas for a Better Implementation of Cougars

I'll start off with saying I'm not a fan with the current "ghost cougar" implementation of the animal. That breaks the whole premise of the game's realism format with an animal that materializes out of thin air while not being in the world for real.

Here's what I'd like to see in a better implementation of the cougar, which still captures the overall idea Hinterland was going for of an animal that's hard to spot and kill, and is very dangerous.

The encroachment part is ok, but what I'd do with the cougar is first off, have it be in the game world, like every other animal, so it's not a ghost that phases into existence randomly to attack with the player having absolutely no control over the situation.

The cougar would be elusive still, but here's how, and this implementation should involve animal AI mechanics that are mostly already in the game for other animals, just with a new behaviour model applied.

Unlike most animals that just openly wander about, the cougar would be very elusive. He'd use the terrain and blindsides to keep out of sight of the player, though on rare occasions you may catch a glimpse of him if he's close and you're in open terrain, but mostly the cougar keeps to cover, so he'll be behind stuff that blocks your view of him.

When he first enters a region, he'll be keeping his distance from you, stalking you and learning your favourite routes. As time passes, he'll grow more interested in you, and start stalking and tracking you much closer. If you're spending time stinky that'll attract his attention faster.

As he grows closer to you, the danger level ramps up. Eventually, he will begin attempting to jump you from behind or from blind hills or corners. Unlike all other hostile animals, he does not vocalise and charge at you in a frontal assault, he'll attempt to charge or pounce from cover or from behind.

if you're quick, you may just get a shot off as he's pouncing. If you're lucky, and catch a glimpse, you may have a moment to try a shot at him, but when he knows you've spotted him, he'll run for cover, making him hard to shoot, if you can even catch a glimpse.

How does he interact with other wildlife?

Rabbits, deer and moose, he will hunt and eat. The Cougar is the one predator the moose should fear. However the cougar is afraid of bears and will keep his distance. If startled by a bear appearing from a blind corner, he'll panic and run like wolves will, which can give a rare chance to catch a cougar in the open.

Wolves are afraid of cougars and will run away whenever they see, smell or hear one. The longer a cougar is in the region, the more wolves will avoid that region and thus they'll start spawning less, as will deer.

Timberwolves can be a more interesting interaction. As they're in packs, the cougar will avoid them, and flee if startled by them. Timberwolves will engage in a pack attack on any cougar encroaching on their territory, meaning timberwolf regions will give the player a slight reprieve from the cougar - at the cost of having to deal with timberwolves. If a pack manages to surround or corner a cougar, the cougar will fight back, If he can wound, scare or kill enough timberwolves, their morale will break as it does when they attack the player character, however a large pack can kill the cougar. A cougar killed by timberwolves will have its hide and claws ruined in the fight, so you'll only be able to harvest some guts and meat, so no freebies on the high value cougar parts by letting a pack of timberwolves do the dirty work for you.

so the TLDR: Cougars are very difficult to spot and hunt, as they'll actively keep out of your line of sight, They'll interact in interesting ways with the other wildlife and truly be a part of the world of Great Bear Island. They are pretty much every bit as dangerous as they are in the current implementation, but their being actually present in the world becomes far more immersive as you may catch glimpses of the great cat stalking you, giving a more visceral and visual feeling to it, rather then a ghost animal making ambient noises and randomly jumping you.

[Seriously Unserious]

You all should check out my ideas on cougars in my threat titled "Ideas for a Better Implementation of Cougars" -I think we're on the same page with wanting a more compelling and immersive implementations of them.

[Seriously Unserious]

That sounds like me and TehKillergeese are on the same page. I'd love to hear your thoughts on my suggested implementation in the thread here titled "Ideas for a Better Implementation of Cougars" - to see if we could refine the ideas a bit more and get the attention of the developers, particularly Raff.

[Great_Puffer]

im not sure how i feel about the cougars

it seems like they want you to move like a nomad now,
which could be cool but id rather it be not invisible until it attacks you?
what if it just stuck near you meaning it has a higher chance to attack and maybe it be evasive so you have to do it the coded way or smth