Install Steam
login
|
language
简体中文 (Simplified Chinese)
繁體中文 (Traditional Chinese)
日本語 (Japanese)
한국어 (Korean)
ไทย (Thai)
Български (Bulgarian)
Čeština (Czech)
Dansk (Danish)
Deutsch (German)
Español - España (Spanish - Spain)
Español - Latinoamérica (Spanish - Latin America)
Ελληνικά (Greek)
Français (French)
Italiano (Italian)
Bahasa Indonesia (Indonesian)
Magyar (Hungarian)
Nederlands (Dutch)
Norsk (Norwegian)
Polski (Polish)
Português (Portuguese - Portugal)
Português - Brasil (Portuguese - Brazil)
Română (Romanian)
Русский (Russian)
Suomi (Finnish)
Svenska (Swedish)
Türkçe (Turkish)
Tiếng Việt (Vietnamese)
Українська (Ukrainian)
Report a translation problem
Discussions Rules and Guidelines
Report this post
yeah its gonna be some lame Jon Snow esque revival. like i was saying.
the Mackenzie that I was able to be in my gameplay shouldnt have be pegged the way he was. At this point in the story im a Bear Killing, Wolve Hunting badass. like i was MAULED BY A BEAR SEVERAL TIMES, TACKLED BY WOLVES DOZENS of times. HOW TF did this guy get me?!!?!?!?!
to me, these types of Arcs are cop outs for good writing and creativity.
tbh Ep1 was kinda weak UNTIL the very end, and it was ONLY dialogue at the last moments.
I wouldnt have had my guard down at that point in the dam. It wouldve been a fight. How did this Guy KNOW i was there? How come I had NO time to react or put up a fight? He hit me with a tranquilizer darts? Chloroform?
Its weak storytelling and writing AT BEST.
for it to make sense, he has to know im in that building, he has to know when and where I will be, so that would mean whatever Jaremiah turned on notified this guy, and he then set up a trap. What does that say for the story telling of Jeramiah thus far. (hint, that its not very good) not enough predicating clues and info for us to even make the tiniest assumption Jeremiah might not be a "good guy." a SINGLE shred of paper or ANYTHING easter egg like wouldve made that ALL OKAY. but nope he cant be the bad guy now, doesnt make ANY SENSE. would hinder their story further.
So are we to believe the CORNY ASS TUTORIAL Jeramiah character has some nefarious dark secret?
and whats this guy in the Jail outfit? an "eco terrorist" with the "forrest talkers." and Jeramiah is one of them too?
not likely to make much sense or ADD to the overall story arc. weak again.
im not saying its supposed to ALL make perfect sense, but the way its going, there are only so many ways story arcs can go when theyre unoriginal. and so far the characters in this would make for a TERRIBLE novel. Half of a story IMO is the characters. and Mackenzie is alright so far, but the story telling is INSULTING ME and HIS abilities etc. bad story telling. the story telling should work with the character or present obstacles that dont have plot holes that will need external storytelling LATER to make sense. weak story telling and writing. good writing leaves clues and plenty to help make sense of what is happening, and then a GOOD twist happens which makes the story make sense in a different light. this isnt a twist. this is LACK OF INFO to creat FALSE INTRIGUE. its weak. im trying not to say it sucks.
To fix this, either within the first 5 mins of ep3 theyll fix the mistake with more bad storytelling, ORR theyre ignore this problem and then try to come back to it with more WEAK storytelling, WAY LATER, OUT of the moment to explain who caused this and why these things were happening. thats like me writing a story where the characters explain whats happening using dialogue, instead of acting it out. mary says "and then Joe walked over to me to say hello." joe "I said hello to mary."
usually people within their first 4-5 years of writing suffer from inability to create dialogue and portray emotions, and instead just write what needs to happen and have the characters say that. its a cheap way to go around the needed time and budget to tell individual stories about the characters in entertainment. like Jeramiah, we wont learn about who he is from his actions and stuff. SOMEONE WILL NARATE IT. "Jeramiah was a BLAH BLAH BLAH in the old times." like i said this is because of 2 factors, BUDGET/TIME CONSTRAINTS and lack of creativity in writing/story boarding.
IDK im very cynical about things so i make a terrible critic. Im just losing hope for the storyline.
its not "bad" i just feel like they got tired. becasue EP2 was announced as being LONGER to compensate for ep1 being so short. i waited for Ep2 and some hope fixes to play. and yeah i would attest that ep1 was a little short, and shouldve been the tutorial. Ep2 felt like it had somewhat of a genuine storytelling experience, UNTIL the last 30 mins. basically kill the bear and traverse the dam, and blackout. (tranverse the cave, pop out, Ep1 OVER!)
It feels like REAL WORLD CONSTRAINTS with money and time it takes to make the actual story mode,that has led to these moments. thats why i say its WEAK, not bad or sucky. its just weak. I understand how or why it couldve happened, and i did exagerate a little for effectiveness, but i can tell you understand what i mean, and i get what youre saying, Will isnt ME.
as a little background for me on the survival mode, i played maybe 40 hours of it on the 2nd hardest mode, and i played the entire story mode on the hardest level, only spamming save during the bear fight. i contracted Food poisoning twice, i also Killed the bear in Forlorn Muskeg in one shot AT night.
40 hours in sandbox. i used to be a pro gamer, but i was again taken aback because i thought Will was tougher.
on the point of being will, not the badass version i play, why dont they make the world and environment reflect that since will is not "supposed to be badass" then why FORCE ME to be badass when, that doesnt reflect the story. So like i am confused then? why and how could i possibly live as Will, but in the story im not supposed to good at survival. well the survival should be easier then, so these parts MAKE SENSE! or write Will MAckenzie to be better at survial and not some tutorial noob. Its like the writers couldnt decide, Make Will badass, or make him a weakling. but then why is there 20+ wolves i have to fight, if im not a badass. this line of logic, is illogical and kinda makes me dislike the situation more.
as a question, even though Lee was scripted to die, did you get a chance to fight back as him or for him? basically this wouldve been a better end to Ep2 if Will was just given the chance to fight back for a moment before being overcome. its nitpicky but Video Games give us that personal connection to Entertainment. a chance to FEEL in control. and this game is all about trying to control your own mortality within this environment.
Ive had characters die before in games and its made me mad, because i was CONNECTED to the character. but this was like, right after it happened, you say to yourself "okay, so either i messed up and missed how to fight back?" so you retry, which i bet SO MANY PEOPLE DID. then you say "well hes probably knocked out, and theyre gonna do blah blah blah to explain this when we come back, or maybe well be Astrid and well have to save Will." or if youre a cynic pessimist "well hes dead and thats freaking dumb, i worked so hard to get taht gear." or "REALLY i just killed a FRICKING BEAR! and this happens!"
basically what im saying, is its like 1/10-3/10 people that would experience the ending of Ep2 and say "THAT WAS FREAKING AWESOME!"
like is hinterland kinda dumb? like you dont have to CHANGE the story that much to make that ending feel AWESOME! but they missed the mark, on 2 episode endings in a row.
so what they have a massive build up to the ending and then YOURE DONE! like im just CONFUSED what the writers goals are for their audience. I really think they are a combination of the tv show Lost (making it up as they go) and George RR Martin, creating a new sense of value by showing how fragile life is. but theyre kinda doing both ways poorly, instead of really well. in my opinion.
what they have done well is MANY of the mechanics. Food/hydration and the weather, and the clothing. fires and so much good cool stuff. And it took them years and what a great accomplishment, but Its like the money was divided 85% for core game - 15% for story.
after such a strong showing with the sandbox they created, I really expect better writing and execution for wintermute. so far it would make a bad movie and bad novel.
But anyway, I don't know why you assume he's dead. To me, nothing suggest this. Honestly, the fact that the episode end this way, so abruptly, strongly suggest that he's not dead. The death of our character would have a better set than this. Hinterland would have made a better, more emotional staging than this end, which to me just give us the hint that we will know what happened to Will in the next episode.
All I see in your criticisms is how YOU would write the story versus Hinterland write it. Honestly, I really don't see anything in how you describe a good story writing be objectively better than what we got here right now. It's a pure subjective point of view. You compare everything to how you, your person, as an human being with his own thinking, would react to situation or interpret things against what the character do and everything that is divergent to how you would do things is, to you, bad writing. Well, this is not Eclipse's story.
I could easily address all points in your critic by my interpretation of the story, but that would made a tedious answer to read and I don't think it worth the time to do so.
i dont think its bad per se. i think its Weak. lackluster. it is not a WOW, or that was really good. both endings to ep1 and ep2. critically speaking and not objectively speaking they are lackluster. They both literally END on the CLIMAX. 2 times in a row. if you LIKE THAT, cool. i enjoy a little closure and alternate pacing from ending to ending. keepst things more interesting, things dont go stale, it just doesnt feel repetative in the end.
i would LOVE to hear you interpretation of the story. and there isnt an infinity number of divergent thought patterns from this story, if you believe that, then youre putting your own imagination to a story that is lacking character content in general. i like mackenzies profile and development, but in both ep1 and ep2 there is no real development which then in turn builds connection to will or the world that is Wintermute/Great Bear.
if you disagree thats fine, we jsut have different taste in things. i believe so far that Wintermute is realtively shallow and a bit pretentious, set in a game that itself has fun mechanics. the strength isnt in the story basically and thats very dissapointing, since i backed this on 2 platforms.
All in all if this story was say being told via a movie, Tv series or Novel i think the flaws would be blindingly obvious, but because the story is set in TLD world of game mechanics, they get away with the first 2 parts ending nearly identically in theme.
LASTLY im not worried about him being dead. as a writer myself and a person that enjoy varying fiction and nonfiction, it simply is hard to understand what Hinterland Writers are trying to accomplish. i speak only for myself but after that ending, im not DYING for episode 3. After how Episode 1 end ON THE CLIMAX, and then this one, maybe theyre trying to reinvent the pacing of story telling with little character development.
i dont think cheap intrigues are a good way to create a complicated story, it comes off pretentious and like youre supposed to get it, and if you dont, or if youre confused or off put by it, it makes you an outsider. I know Im not the only one that feels this way thus far.
i have TREMENDOUS hope ep3 will be good as well as the rest, as far as a video game. but the story. its weak.. it just is. its not a STRONG EMOTIONAL TALE. its rather weak.
would love to here a random person personal interpretation tho, im sure that would clear up the blurry story. when the rest of the story is complete we can both reflect on what we shared here, it will be interesting no matter what.
i feel like theyre limiting themselves to a certain set of outcomes, of course there isnt just 1 but several. within story writing, the heros quest is often used, and is being used here. the story arcs being used to motivate the story along are not strong so far.
find astrid.
wintermute message.
dont get killed by guy who makes the rules for HIS WORLD, (what assumptions are needed at this point to make this plausible)! <- REALLY??!?!?!! thats our "bad guy" - I laughed at the voice acting and dialogue lines. (WHATS IN THE BOX!? MY WORLD, NO LOCKS!)
and dont let nature kill you.
who is astrid? your ex? well 20hours in and IDK!
wintermute! "BUT YOU DONT UNDERSTAND! JUST LISTEN MACKENZIE" - super cringey
and then after murking a 1000lb bear that nearly nerfed Jeramiah Permanently, we get PUNCHED BY SUPER PRISONER AND KNOCKED OUT.
if a mauling only does eh 25% damage, well im having a hard time BELIEVING whats happening with no locks man.
im really hoping they pull some CRAZY twist outta there butt that makes it AN AMAZING STORY, but i think its just gonna be some bland stuff, basically rewashed stories that have been done already splashed together in a somewhat fresh way. not what i was hoping.
hell even witcher 3 regurgitates OLD FAIRY TALES, with awesome new twists. another independent developer. compared to witcher, ANY OF THEM, in ANY sense, this story actually sucks so far
which would you rather happen to you and hope you stay concious in REAL LIFE. being tackled by a full grown black bear, or being hit by a man with a blunt weapon.
the answer is NEITHER! youre trying to argue something in which BOTH SCENARIOS you get your ass kicked. ive been tackled over and over by a pack of wolves and came out on top. mauled 3 times in an afternoon by a bear and hunted the bear down. but getting hit by "NO LOCKS WORLD" man, is a one hit unconsciouness. LMAO!
im not mad hes hurt, im confused by the lack on continuity with character abilities and traits. also adds seasoning to an already pretty weak story.
For someone that claim to be a writer, I am very surprised that you don't get it and are upset about it.
now im gonna just spell it out. you can CRITIQUE something without it being UPSETTING. thats what im doing.
youre being challenging by putting words in my mouth, saying "I dont know why its upsetting you."
youve said it twice, in BOTH replies. i get it you salty little monkey. youre trying to do a dig.
lets keep talking but can you quit doing that little game? thank you
That's all.
from the MOMENT he spoke he was Cliche. wanna make a story suck critically speaking, make the characters walking cliches! and he was a cliche prisoner bad guy in orange suit.
1st impressions are everything in all forms of life. If i have to sit and make excuses for hinterland and what i just watched, welp i wont. I wouldnt share that scene with anyone, I wouldnt be "proud" of it. If i showed that crap to a group of people, id be waiting for them to say the same stuff, ie; "why is this so lame? Why didnt they do it better?" and id be stuck saying, "well theyre an independent studio, and its expensive to make games blah balh blah excuse excuse." what about the dialogue between jeramiah and Will about Getting the message to that guy, like that dialogue and voice acting was as if a 15 year old wrote it in my opinion. at least i was writing better dialogue when i was 15. what about when Will asks about the phone ringing, and jearmiah subtitle says "im off the gird for a reason." will ; "whats that reason?" Jeramiah replies basically saying "Im not telling." really? REALLY?! that is literally dialogue of a highschool student play. VERY BAD! VERY IMMATURE unrealistic way of speaking in general. people dont stay rudely closed up after having there life saved twice, no thrice. Jeremiahs character development when cloesly examined is either stupid, or his character is a ♥♥♥♥♥♥ jerk off
would you like me to type out the cringey stuff both jeramiah and the prisoner dude say? if you or I spoke that way, we would be the lamest people on earth.
"whats in the box?"
"i dont know" gets punched
"whats in the box?!"
"painkillers hopefully.." gets punched again
"this is my world, and in my world there are no locks inmy world, what do you think of that?
"i think youre crazy."
"oh we got a joker? well see if youre joking after i do what i did to her to you"
"to her?"
"oh now you wanna talk! blah blah blah"
lights out
basically the ending dialogue for episode 2..
https://hinterlandgames.com/career-opportunities/
I think what they have going is really good. but its like they need an editor or something. I think the writers currently are not being challenged enough by the rest of the team. I think what were recieving from TLD wintermute is a combination of Hard work, crazy ambition and compromises. Im happy to say the only real critique and room for improvement is the nit picking ive done with the story flow. the content is there, but the dialogue needs to be worked on A LOT. its like a 15 year old maturity level in the dialogue. and then the characters NEED to have sections of development BEFORE the end of the episode. the storyboarding is using systematic tactics to create intrigue, from what i can tell, theyre just winging it while using a pretty decent theme and concept of story. NEEDS DETAIL AND POLISH HEAVILY.
There's your main problem. You listed it as YOUR version of the character. It's kinda like saying your super saiyan Super Kid Gooku defeated frieza in two shots in dragonball Xenoverse 2 or some nonsense. That's...not quite canon. Your version of the character isn't the final version and writing a script to accomadate each and every single version of McKenzie: the pack mule, the bare bones survivalist, the all fur no cloth hardcore hunter, etc, would be way too much work even for a large scale team for 20+ writers and his voice actor.