Ideology: Raider

[Chuck]

Having a colony with mostly raider ideologies should increase the frequency of camps / the amount of camp loot.

IE if your colony is mostly raiders, you should find more camps (so you can raid more frequently or have a higher chance of a camp with a resource you actually need) OR camps should have much more loot in them. Right now, the raider meme is kind of bad (as is many of the memes).

All raider does is make the game more tedious by forcing you out to do pointless raids every 25 days or all your colonists get big mad, as well as reduce work speed at ALL TIMES. Without more frequent or better camp loot, sustaining yourself off raiding is really difficult and annoying, and currently you lose out more on the mandatory raids and work speed debuff than what you get back from raiding.

[MadArtillery]

Pretty sure what counts as a raid is actually pretty flexabile, as in anything on the world map that generates a map for your pawns to move on. May as well farm luciferium from ancient complexes while your at it.

[Lord Freedom]

Actually, I'm fairly certain the raider meme does in fact increase frequency of camp events. I used to drown in them, but I rarely get them now that I no longer use the meme. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am.

[Jaggid Edje]

Any world map location that involves fighting enemies and 'claiming' the map counts as a raid. So in addition to the camps with resources, you also get those various missions to shut down a machine (droning, weather control, etc. etc.).

I have that precept right now in my current playthrough and am swimming in choices to keep my pawns satisfied most of the time. I did have one dry spell though a few (game) years back, where I went a bit over a quadrum with nothing I could raid.

[cinless]

The purpose of ideology isn't to provide a balanced experience, but to change how you play.
The point of the raider meme is the challenge and how it changes your story, it's not supposed to be balanced against something.

[Astasia]

The benefit of raiding is the +12 mood boost you can keep up at all times, not the loot you get from raiding. You can setup rituals to spawn ancient complexes to ensure you always have a raid target when you need one. Is that worth the hassle of going out and raiding or losing a small amount of workspeed? Probably not, but that's not the point of Ideology as cinless mentioned. Many of the memes are intended to change how you play or add challenge to the game, it's not about balance. Pick raider when you want to force yourself to leave your colony more often to mix up your usual gameplay.

[Red Bat]

IDK, I generally find raiding pretty lucrative. In addition to whatever resource you are after, you can often take a battery, a mini turret, some weapons, a bunch of furniture, possibly a captured pawn or two, some mechanoid slab chunks, components if you deconstruct the generator before you leave, and various other items. That's for the generic "camp" raids. For ancient complexes, mechanator complexes, mechanoid clusters, etc, you can often get even better stuff. The "deserter" quest also spawns a camp that has a meditation throne and some other royalty items such as utratech melee weapons in addition to the two neuroformers.

My issue with the raider meme isn't that I expect it to be balanced. I don't expect anything in this game to be balanced. My issue is that it's functionally identical to taking the supremacy meme with the raider precept. I don't think even generating more camps would do enough to make the meme actually feel unique. Oh well, at least taking both Supremacy and Raider stacks the goodwill penalties which can be interesting I guess.

[MadArtillery]

Originally posted by Red Bat:

IDK, I generally find raiding pretty lucrative. In addition to whatever resource you are after, you can often take a battery, a mini turret, some weapons, a bunch of furniture, possibly a captured pawn or two, some mechanoid slab chunks, components if you deconstruct the generator before you leave, and various other items. That's for the generic "camp" raids. For ancient complexes, mechanator complexes, mechanoid clusters, etc, you can often get even better stuff. The "deserter" quest also spawns a camp that has a meditation throne and some other royalty items such as utratech melee weapons in addition to the two neuroformers.

My issue with the raider meme isn't that I expect it to be balanced. I don't expect anything in this game to be balanced. My issue is that it's functionally identical to taking the supremacy meme with the raider precept. I don't think even generating more camps would do enough to make the meme actually feel unique. Oh well, at least taking both Supremacy and Raider stacks the goodwill penalties which can be interesting I guess.

Welcome to ideology, where functionally similar and does not have a function are the norm. It's not a well done dlc. I assure you, the more you look at it the worse it gets and I doubt they'll ever take another look at it.

There is a difference between supremacist and raider though, raiders can have charity, for some reason, which is really strong for fluid ideologies to develop rapidly through royalty quests. That is the only difference. Other then perhaps natural goodwill changes I haven't dug into yet.

[Maltsi]

What i find annoying with raiders is that you need to send ALL pawns for raiding missions. it would be so much better if you can have dedicated raiders and keep your cooks and researchers at base, but no, if a pawn haven't been raiding then its mood debuff for that pawn. unless this has changed in the last few years since i touched that meme?

Sort of like viking times, not everyone was sent to raid, only the warriors were

[MadArtillery]

Originally posted by Maltsi:

What i find annoying with raiders is that you need to send ALL pawns for raiding missions. it would be so much better if you can have dedicated raiders and keep your cooks and researchers at base, but no, if a pawn haven't been raiding then its mood debuff for that pawn. unless this has changed in the last few years since i touched that meme?

Sort of like viking times, not everyone was sent to raid, only the warriors were

Pretty sure last time I ran it i only ever sent a specific squad and everyone else was just happy the colony had raided. The people who went were extra happy though

[Jaggid Edje]

Originally posted by Maltsi:

What i find annoying with raiders is that you need to send ALL pawns for raiding missions. it would be so much better if you can have dedicated raiders and keep your cooks and researchers at base, but no, if a pawn haven't been raiding then its mood debuff for that pawn. unless this has changed in the last few years since i touched that meme?

Sort of like viking times, not everyone was sent to raid, only the warriors were

You don't need to send all of the pawns. The main mood bonus is granted to the entire colony, regardless of whether they were on the raid itself.

The ones who did go get an extra buff on top of that one. It's a smaller bonus (half as much).

I have that precept in my current game and have a dedicated group that does the raiding, the rest of the colony never leaves home.

[BuggyFromOnePiece]

Originally posted by Red Bat:

IDK, I generally find raiding pretty lucrative. In addition to whatever resource you are after, you can often take a battery, a mini turret, some weapons, a bunch of furniture, possibly a captured pawn or two, some mechanoid slab chunks, components if you deconstruct the generator before you leave, and various other items. That's for the generic "camp" raids. For ancient complexes, mechanator complexes, mechanoid clusters, etc, you can often get even better stuff. The "deserter" quest also spawns a camp that has a meditation throne and some other royalty items such as utratech melee weapons in addition to the two neuroformers.

My issue with the raider meme isn't that I expect it to be balanced. I don't expect anything in this game to be balanced. My issue is that it's functionally identical to taking the supremacy meme with the raider precept. I don't think even generating more camps would do enough to make the meme actually feel unique. Oh well, at least taking both Supremacy and Raider stacks the goodwill penalties which can be interesting I guess.

If you get vfe pirates it fixes that issue of supramcisy and raider being nearly the same because you can just chose pirate instead of raider

[Astasia]

Originally posted by RobbyRayRotencharlesfromonepiece:

If you get vfe pirates it fixes that issue of supramcisy and raider being nearly the same because you can just chose pirate instead of raider

So the "fix" for two memes doing mostly the same thing is installing a mod that adds a 3rd meme that does mostly the same thing? Was that worth reviving a year old thread to share?

[someonesneaky]

To be fair, the random encampments (raider outposts, farming / mining / hunting worksites, et cetera) were specifically added to give ideologies with the Raider meme something to target besides settlements. But it also counts for things like ancient complex looting, distress calls, and things like that.

[WildStargazer]

Some memes are just not good or simply for flavor, so choose carefully. I never ever chose raider meme for my colony.

[Chuck]

Originally posted by someonesneaky:

To be fair, the random encampments (raider outposts, farming / mining / hunting worksites, et cetera) were specifically added to give ideologies with the Raider meme something to target besides settlements. But it also counts for things like ancient complex looting, distress calls, and things like that.

Yeah, and it was a good step, i just dont think the random camps are good enough to be able to sustain yourself off of them. Seeing as theres a pretty good selection of camp resources, theres a good chance you wont roll for the resource you actually need when camps are generated. For example, Going off of one of my more end-game colonies, steel is a hugely in demand resource, but camps actually containing steel do not generate often enough that you could actually keep up with demand.

work camps generating are great, but i just wish if you had a majority of raider colonists, camps would generate more often, decreasing the amount of time between camps generating with what you actually need. Or, generate outposts, like mini-settlements that have a wide variety of things, but are larger and more well defended, and succeeding a raid on these counts for 2 regular raids (or the mood buff lasts twice as long). I think it would make raiding a more engaging activity because you could actually take risks with greater rewards instead of "fight a few people and then pick up 1000 plainleather".

Originally posted by WildStargazer:

Some memes are just not good or simply for flavor, so choose carefully. I never ever chose raider meme for my colony.

I feel like most of my ideologies consist of some combination of collectivist, supremacist, transhumanist (rarely), proselytizer, or human supremacy. Beyond these, they kind of start to become more restrictive than what theyre worth. I know that a bunch are just for role playing purposes but I feel like they just make the game more frustrating to play because all my pawns are having mental brakes because i didnt build a few statues for them or something.