A thought about research

[Rosario]

So it just sort of dawned on me that research tables are pretty freaking big. Not just that though, it's pretty obvious how much larger they are, what I mean is, there's an age old saying, 'two heads are better than one.' Why can't there be multiple people working at the same giant table, talking over and figuring out how to staple cloth to the ground or make boom boom sticks? It just seems so obvious now that I think about it. Should really make it to where research can be done with research teams, you all remember those lab classes from school.

[The Blind One]

With a little creative placement you can get a similar experience

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2147483288&searchtext=research+bench
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2148706684&searchtext=research+bench

and yes the vanilla benches are stupidly big

[Rosario]

I honestly don't mind them being bigger, just seems like a waste of space and a bit counterproductive to have 2 people researching the same thing at multiple stations, especially if they're not even within communicating distance.

[The Blind One]

Originally posted by Rosario:

I honestly don't mind them being bigger, just seems like a waste of space and a bit counterproductive to have 2 people researching the same thing at multiple stations, especially if they're not even within communicating distance.

I guess it's balance. You never wondered why a single gun takes as much steel and components to make as a whole ass geothermal plant?

With the smaller benches you could theoretically place two across each other ... and imagine they are communicating lol

[Astasia]

The size of the benches somewhat limits how much research you are doing. Making a lab with 5 hi-tech research bench is a pretty large space investment and requires some thought to maximize the reach of a single multi-analyzer, not to mention the cost in sterile tile. If you could fit 20 benches into the same space and had everyone assigned to research as a low priority task instead of going idle, then you could fly through the research.

Like there is a lot of empty space on the benches and they definitely don't need to be that large from a design standpoint. It's purely a gameplay decision. It could be balanced in other ways, like higher resource costs or more power use, but having them cost "space" makes it easier to get started with 1-3, while only being much of a concern if you are trying to make a ton of them to get a huge number of pawns on research.

[The Blind One]

Originally posted by Astasia:

If you could fit 20 benches into the same space and had everyone assigned to research as a low priority task instead of going idle, then you could fly through the research.

I see most meta gamers and twitch players just make a big room for them and have like 5 or 6 guys doing research on them and zip through the basic tech tree lol.

Space isn't nearly as much of a detriment as access too adv. components would be for example (multi-analyzer). The simple research bench is quite cheap at 75 wood and 25 steel. That's like 3 trees and 1 steel ore tile per bench.

The hi-tech research bench is a little harder to come by due to the requirement for 10 components and high metal investment but again, I see pro gamers just build a huge laboratory from the start and pump in 4 to 6 hi-tech research benches when they replace the basic ones. Though at least they build up these rooms as they gain more access to components. It's still way too easy imho.

I haven't done the math but you're probably usually better off just building another hi-tech research bench instead of plating it in sterile tiles. That's more of a luxury thing when you need to burn cash to lower wealth and get something in return for it. (*more on this later)

to sterile tile a research bench area you'd need approx 5 x 3 (x.y dimensions of hi-tech research bench + research spot) x 12 (silver cost) = 180 silver per bench (not counting steel which is another 45 steel * 1.9 = 85,5 silver for a total of 265,5 silver per hi-tech bench.

A high tech research bench costs 100 stuff (I assume steel is used) + 150 steel + 10 components = 475 (steel) + 320 (components) = 795 silver

Silver tiles only get you a +9% research bonus. (correct me if I am mistaken)

You're better off getting another bench if you got another researcher that can contribute.

*interesting thing I just learned. Sterile tiles are worth way more than what you put in. It's 17,7 silver input for a silver tile and it's valued at 24 silver. You're actually increasing your wealth ... if not for the 0.5 wealth factor for buildings making it only worth 12 silver in terms of raiding wealth, so still a positive to actually transform into silver tiles and burn off that excess wealth.

[Astasia]

It's a 9% more multiplier, it's again about saving space but also depends on your researchers. If you have one skill 20 researcher who is a research specialist with industrious and very neurotic, giving them a 9% more bonus to research speed is going to be a lot more useful than building a new bench for a skill 0-5 colonists to work at. Even up to skill 10 or so it's questionable if it's worth adding another colonist working full time on research vs making a super-researcher better at their job.

Multi-analyzers don't require advanced components, but you do want to try to avoid building more than one or two of those, so again it's about cramming as many benches as you can within the range. The large size makes that a bit awkward to do, I think you can maybe get like 8 around one analyzer.

[The Blind One]

Ah yeah you're quite right, I somehow mistook the fabrication bench's adv component requirement for the multi-analyzers which does't need 2 advanced components. It's one of those dwarf fortress moments where you need anvils to produce more anvils (need advanced components to produce more advanced components).

I try make sure to build up to 3 or 4 advanced components asap early on and buy them whenever I see them for sale. 2 for the fabrication bench and 1 for the deep scanner (or two for the long range) to get that gold and plasteel for adv component fabrication. They are absolutely necessary for the mid to late game.

You're also right about research, it may well be better to invest in your star researchers room than if you add just a few low tier researchers. I do find that high end researchers are a dime a dozen nowadays with genies being the absolute research and crafting powerhouses that they are.