sending a 97 year old as an envoy is a bad idea

[Von Faustien]

i mean they were deaf had a bad back demtia scars on half there of their body parts and a major artery blockage. i mean maybe you wanted them dead but dam declaring me an enemy of the tribe because they had a heart attack well outside my actual base is a ♥♥♥♥ move.

[GeneralVeers]

Uhhh.....that doesn't mean sending a 97-year-old is a bad idea. It means sending somebody with deafness, bad back, scars, dementia, and an artery blockage is a bad idea.

Far as I know, age doesn't have any influence on Social skill rolls.

[kajidiablo]

most of the time old age=dementia in rimworld even with animals lol and as for the original post, they did a good thing not a bad thing, how else you going to kill off the useless member by placing blame lol

[Jigain]

Old age does not equate dementia. Not in Rimworld, and not in the real world.

Speaking strictly of Rimworld, each time a pawn ages a year there's a chance they'll get a condition like dementia, bad back, frail, et cetera. But that doesn't mean age is the same as any of these things. It's perfectly possible to have a 240 year old pawn (since there's no "death by old age" in the game) that's fit as a fiddle if you're extremely lucky with dice rolls, just as it's perfectly possible for your 22 year old pawn to get struck with both dementia and bad back if you're unlucky. Thus, age and any of the above conditions are related by correlation, not causation.

[AlP]

Originally posted by Jigain:

It's perfectly possible to have a 240 year old pawn (since there's no "death by old age" in the game) that's fit as a fiddle if you're extremely lucky with dice rolls

No, it's not possible.

At 99 years pawns will have 3.1 conditions on average, so your 240-year-old-pawn that is "fit as a fiddle" will have around 7 on average.

Originally posted by Jigain:

just as it's perfectly possible for your 22 year old pawn to get struck with both dementia and bad back if you're unlucky.

That's also impossible, since dementia starts rolling at 69, and bad back at 41.

[Jigain]

Originally posted by AlP:

Originally posted by Jigain:

It's perfectly possible to have a 240 year old pawn (since there's no "death by old age" in the game) that's fit as a fiddle if you're extremely lucky with dice rolls

No, it's not possible.

At 99 years pawns will have 3.1 conditions on average, so your 240-year-old-pawn that is "fit as a fiddle" will have around 7 on average.

Of course! The average makes it impossible! It's not like a random outcome is, at all, random; that it can have more than one result! Just like flipping a coin will always alternate between heads and tails when you flip it; because the average is every second flip will be heads, it means you cannot get any more than one heads in a row! Let's try it out.

Heads.
Heads.
Heads.
Heads.
Heads.
A weaker man might be moved to re-examine his faith, if in nothing else at least in the law of probability.

Originally posted by AlP:

Originally posted by Jigain:

just as it's perfectly possible for your 22 year old pawn to get struck with both dementia and bad back if you're unlucky.

That's also impossible, since dementia starts rolling at 69, and bad back at 41.

See, that I did not know. There's plenty of other ailments commonly attributed to age that starts happening long before that though. Like asthma. Artery blockage. Or cancer.

Still doesn't invalidate my previous point.

[AlP]

Originally posted by Jigain:

Originally posted by AlP:

No, it's not possible.

At 99 years pawns will have 3.1 conditions on average, so your 240-year-old-pawn that is "fit as a fiddle" will have around 7 on average.

Of course! The average makes it impossible! It's not like a random outcome is, at all, random; that it can have more than one result! Just like flipping a coin will always alternate between heads and tails when you flip it; because the average is every second flip will be heads, it means you cannot get any more than one heads in a row! Let's try it out.

Heads.
Heads.
Heads.
Heads.
Heads.
A weaker man might be moved to re-examine his faith, if in nothing else at least in the law of probability.

That's not how any of this works.

80% of pawns will have at least one dementia by the age 99. At least. Good luck flipping coins for your 240-year-old.

[Preechr]

They sent a guy to plant a dead body as a pretext for war.

Very clever. Especially since the guy they sent was also the body.

[Jigain]

Originally posted by AlP:

Originally posted by Jigain:

Of course! The average makes it impossible! It's not like a random outcome is, at all, random; that it can have more than one result! Just like flipping a coin will always alternate between heads and tails when you flip it; because the average is every second flip will be heads, it means you cannot get any more than one heads in a row! Let's try it out.

Heads.
Heads.
Heads.
Heads.
Heads.
A weaker man might be moved to re-examine his faith, if in nothing else at least in the law of probability.

That's not how any of this works.

80% of pawns will have at least one dementia by the age 99. At least. Good luck flipping coins for your 240-year-old.

Consequently, 20% of pawns will have exactly no ailments (I assume you mean ailments, as there is only one dementia in the game, that being dementia; thus saying "at least one dementia" makes no sense), by your own mouth. One in five? That's some pretty decent odds.

Oh, and here's another little tidbit. Unless it's been changed recently (and I know many things have in patch 18-1.0, but I don't think this is one; let's assume it isn't), pawns don't actually have birthdays past 99. And birthdays is what triggers ailments. In other words, someone who is 99 years old will never be able to get an ailment. So 20% of pawns reaching the fabulous age of 99 years - again, these are your words, not mine - will have no ailments. And out of these 20%, approximately (actually, exactly) 100% will not have any ailments if they make it to year 240. So in other words, we've gone from you saying "it's not possible to have a pawn that's 240 years old with no ailments" to you saying "on average, one in five pawns that makes it to 240 years will have no ailments".

Now that's progress!

[AlP]

Originally posted by Jigain:

Originally posted by AlP:

That's not how any of this works.

80% of pawns will have at least one dementia by the age 99. At least. Good luck flipping coins for your 240-year-old.

Consequently, 20% of pawns will have exactly no ailments (I assume you mean ailments, as there is only one dementia in the game, that being dementia; thus saying "at least one dementia" makes no sense), by your own mouth. One in five? That's some pretty decent odds.

No, 20% of pawns will not have dementia at 99. They will have 3.1 other conditions.

[Minty Fresh]

I'm always love coming here - you people have the very best maths!

[Jigain]

Originally posted by Kulgan from Crydee:

I'm always love coming here - you people have the very best maths!

I know, right?

I mean, maths is fun and all, but the proof is in the pudding, isn't it? Do you think AIP would admit that pawns can actually become old without gaining any ailments if he was shown a screenshot of a pawn who, after artificially being aged with the dev tools on a completely unmodded game from age 17 up to age 99, had absolutely no ailments whatsoever? Something that he claims is impossible? Ladies and gentlemen, place your bets now!

[xybolt]

Originally posted by Von Faustien:

i mean they were deaf had a bad back demtia scars on half there of their body parts and a major artery blockage. i mean maybe you wanted them dead but dam declaring me an enemy of the tribe because they had a heart attack well outside my actual base is a ♥♥♥♥ move.

I don't get it. Are you sure that he was not on their territory? That could trigger it. That he died there is just ... a bad accident.


PS: I never have had a pawn of that age and being in that state. How did you kept him alive lol?

[AlP]

Originally posted by Jigain:

Originally posted by Kulgan from Crydee:

I'm always love coming here - you people have the very best maths!

I know, right?

I mean, maths is fun and all, but the proof is in the pudding, isn't it? Do you think AIP would admit that pawns can actually become old without gaining any ailments if he was shown a screenshot of a pawn who, after artificially being aged with the dev tools on a completely unmodded game from age 17 up to age 99, had absolutely no ailments whatsoever? Something that he claims is impossible? Ladies and gentlemen, place your bets now!

Ah, something I "claim". That tends to be the usual argument around here when you don't know what you are talking about.

[Morkonan]

I think there's a wonderful solution to all of this that doesn't involve involuntary organ donors...

Check one's pawn's stats before one does something critical with them that is intimately involved in said stats.

And, as a side-note: Old pawns can accumulate higher skill levels, 'tis true. But, they also have to weather more random dice rolls concerning age-related stat decreases.

For myself, if I'm sending an Emissary, I do all I can to maximize their chances of success. (Today it's Cowboy hats, I guess, and maybe Bowlers? Used to be the Chieftain's Headdress thingy, I think, back when I thought sending an Emissary out for Peace Talks was fun...)

"Peace Talks" are Anti-Fun. Refuse anti-fun game mechanics whenever they insert their blasphemous face!

[GeneralVeers]

Okay, somebody in here has no idea how probability works.

Originally posted by AlP:

At 99 years pawns will have 3.1 conditions on average

At 99 years of age, pawns will have 3.1 conditions ON AVERAGE. Some 99-year-old pawns will have 2 conditions, others will have 4. Some will have one condition. Some will have 8 conditions. Some will have ZERO. So, when you said this in reply to Jiggy:

Originally posted by AlP:

Originally posted by Jigain:

It's perfectly possible to have a 240 year old pawn (since there's no "death by old age" in the game) that's fit as a fiddle if you're extremely lucky with dice rolls

No, it's not possible.

At 99 years pawns will have 3.1 conditions on average, so your 240-year-old-pawn that is "fit as a fiddle" will have around 7 on average.

.......you were just flat-out wrong.

A pawn CAN make it to 99 years without a bad back or dementia or whichever. IT IS POSSIBLE. It's just not very common.


Edit: Something else to keep in mind. It's very rare for YOU, the reader (any single reader, AIP or Jigain or M.K. or anybody else) to see a pawn reach age 99 with no conditions. HOWEVER: right now, at this very moment, there are thousands of people playing this game, and hundreds of pawns are aging to 99. So, in the time that it took you to read this, somewhere on Earth, a RimWorld pawn DID reach age 99 without getting saddled with any age-related conditions. It's rare for any ONE pawn--but when there are so many players and so many pawns, rare incidents actually happen on a regular basis.