Killed Colony Animal

[Omega13]

So for those not yet aware, A17 imposed a -5 social penalty for "Killed Colony Animal." I can only believe this must have been a mistake, as it's a pretty boneheaded change to make your butchers suddenly the most hated people in the colony. It isn't even imposed intellgently, as I currently have two kitchen staff that are man and wife who BOTH hate each other because their partner slaughtered animals bred specifically to be food. They are apparently locked in a dance of vocational self-loathing.

I have to assume maybe this was meant to be limited to dogs and cats, or perhaps even animals that have real names (and are thus more pet than livestock). Applying it to all animals seems like a pretty heavy-handed nerf to animal farming, which was already pretty impractical in vanilla (outside of chickens, caravan animals, and haulers).

I'm surprised that I've not yet seen a mod that removes this new penalty, as it seems like the sort of thing a modder would address pretty quickly. Does anyone know of one?

[Bryan=0101]

I think you misunderstood

I think colonial animal as someone considered then as part of the family

[Omega13]

No, that's not how the debuff works. If you kill a baby chick that has been alive for five minutes, that was literally raised for this specific purpose, you get this debuff. You get it for killing any colony animal. I agree you should get it for killing beloved pets or named animals, but not for cows and such raised specifically for slaughter. At the very least you shouldn't get that debuff from EVERY other colonists, including those with Bloodlust, Psychopath, or various other traits that indicate they probably should not care about such things. Seriously, try it in game. Slaughter any colony animal and check your social breakdown.

[Omega13]

If you were not aware that this was happening or how it works (and it sounds like you're not), trust me, it's a new thing in A17 and it's suuuuper weird.

[bigsengineer]

i have killed thousands of animals since A17 and havent seen this debuff. maybe its got to do with bonded animals because everything type of animal u can/would train i have tamed and killed without any negatives

[Omega13]

Check your social breakdown, not your mood. As in, if Fred kills an animal, go to Tom's social and see what he thinks of Fred. I guarantee you that it is there, for any animal.

[Omega13]

The only really positive thing to say about it is that it's a relatively small penalty, and it doesn't stack. That being said, it shouldn't be there at all, except in certain circumstances (such as the aforementioned beloved animal or perhaps in the case of colonists with non-violent or Wimp traits).

[Omega13]

Here, rather than explain this repeatedly, I'll post a screenshot. I started a 100% new game, went into dev mode, spawned and tamed a cow and then ordered Gray to slaughter it. No one was bonded to this cow or had any particular attachment to it in any way. It had existed for literally two seconds, didn't have any bonds or even a name, and is an animal traditionally bred specifically for meat. Here is what Camisa (who is a Psychopath, by the way) now thinks of Gray: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7TsoVqWHD44Z0YyeUJnZ0ZVdUk/view?usp=sharing

[bigsengineer]

Originally posted by Omega13:

Check your social breakdown, not your mood. As in, if Fred kills an animal, go to Tom's social and see what he thinks of Fred. I guarantee you that it is there, for any animal.

having checked it looks like yes but it also looks like a 1 time thing all ur handlers will have and doesnt stack so its not a big deal.

[Omega13]

It's a small penalty but a nonsensical one. It's not the first nonsensical social penalty in the game to be sure, but it's definitely a new one so I wanted to let people know it's out there and see if anyone has created a mod to fix it yet.

[Bryan=0101]

Originally posted by Omega13:

It's a small penalty but a nonsensical one. It's not the first nonsensical social penalty in the game to be sure, but it's definitely a new one so I wanted to let people know it's out there and see if anyone has created a mod to fix it yet.

Geez next thing you know is they add cookies to the game and u'll want a mod to remove that

[Astasia]

It's a -5 penalty that becomes -3 after like a week then goes away another week or so later. It's fine. It makes some sense, whether or not they were bonded with or bred for slaughter, somebody kills an animal that's been around the colony for a while and people would look at them a little differently. They wouldn't hate them, or be angry with them, but that's why it's only a -5, it doesn't do anything, it's just RP flavor.

[Omega13]

It lasts 25 days, give or take, and if it's a character who works as a butcher, it won't ever go down because he needs to keep feeding the colony. Again, the animal doesn't have to "be around the colony for a little while." They can be farm animals bred for slaughter and killed immediately after birth (as I posted above, the cow was three seconds old).

It’s not “RP flavor” to hate a butcher for doing his job unless you’re an animal rights activist, particularly kindhearted, or just looking to pick a fight with said butcher. It's not "RP flavor" because it's unilateral - the penalty is the same whether it’s a calf bred for slaughter or someone’s beloved dog. I have already allowed that some characters MIGHT care. It would be grand if it was even more severe in the cases of pacifists and whatnot. The problem is that *everyone* cares, regardless of context. Pragmatic characters, psychotic and bloodthirsty characters, characters who just slaughtered an animal themselves, everyone hates the butchers and that is *nonsense.* I would posit it’s the opposite of RP flavor because it so frequently ignores context and thus belittles certain characters (albeit in a minor way).

At the same time, it’s inconsistent. Nobody in the colony applies a social penalty to a hunter regardless of how much cute bunny blood he’s doused in when he strolls back into camp. Nobody applies a social penalty to the negotiator who just recruited a pirate that killed three colonists. That hatred, currently, is purely reserved for the guy that makes the bacon.

Yes, it’s a minor thing, so minor that people above who have had it happen to them allegedly “thousands” of times failed to notice it without a screenshot. Yet, I am bringing it up just the same to let people know about it (some people might care) and perhaps to seek a modding solution. If you feel that it makes sense to tell a butcher that he's a terrible person while simultaneously eating the steak he made for you, then clearly you do not need such a mod and this thread is unworthy of your time.

Kudos on the cookie joke, though. I think like two people have noticed that in my bio ever and they've both been total strangers haha.

[Alphie]

I agree with Omega, it looks like a bug or at the very least an unintenional mistake. Maybe they should keep it -5 for killing an animal, but give the butcher +20 for feeding us and helping us survive! lol that was a joke.

[bigsengineer]

Originally posted by Alphie:

I agree with Omega, it looks like a bug or at the very least an unintenional mistake. Maybe they should keep it -5 for killing an animal, but give the butcher +20 for feeding us and helping us survive! lol that was a joke.

its just 5 on the social window. no mood debuffs and if this tips the scale into rivalry then was gonna happen anyway. either way its a way to stop u just having every colonist do the slaughtering and maek it just the 1 handler. as has been said its just 5 and doesnt stack u get worse just being a hard worker

[Xilo The Odd]

huh that is strange. good catch though.