RimWorld

RimWorld

xybolt Oct 21, 2019 @ 10:18am
Open Door! Open Door! No wait, close this door first. Hey! Nooooo... Stupid doors.
According to the wiki, some doors have their own open/close time. For example wooden doors have fast moving speeds than eg a slate door. Now I have a "fridge". Well it is filled it with other stuff, but I am still in early phase. My intent is to make this a fridge for prepared meals and medicine. However, the temperature control is not good because of my bad door management. Look at this example I have now (see 1)

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1895389038

I placed a wooden door; followed by a slate door. Guess what, when a rim (= colonist) opens the inner door, the wooden door is still not closed. By this, the freezer room temperature got increased by 3~5 degrees. I want to keep it constant and low. So my idea is to open the next door once the outer door got closed. Sorta an airlock. Yet I am unable to achieve this. The cold is manage to tell F U at my utterly simple concept. Apparently I am not the first one with this idea. I googled and found this reddit post (on /r/rimworld ) where the idea (aside the walls) are exactly my idea. Not to mention that I tried two slate doors first. But nope, both were open at a given time. Hence I replaced the outer door with a wooden because it should close fast according to this RimWorld wiki[rimworldwiki.com]...

And I am not even at that point that when a rim leaves it. Both doors are open. WTH. How can I ensure that the airlock principle is being "implemented".

Last, but not least: how can I prevent this filthy creature (a tamed animal from start) entering the freezer. See 2 at the image. At least it solved a mystery: I lost a stack of meat. I thought that one of the rim likes raw meat (heh Reddit stories...) until I discovered this piece of dog entered the room himself to eat my meat. Oh boy, the "slaughter" action is an interesting option. (is there any uses for this kind of animal???)
Last edited by xybolt; Oct 21, 2019 @ 10:20am
Originally posted by Preechr:
Replace the slate door with a wooden door, then move it one space to the left. Move your existing wooden door all the way to the right.

Look at your Zones/Areas... you should already have a Zone set up as Area 1. Make that Zone the same as your fridge area, including the airlock, then go to manage zones and "Invert" it. Restrict your dog to that zone in the Animals tab. That will allow your dog to go anywhere on the map except the fridge, unless he gets super hungry.

Dogs can be trained to haul stuff, and they don't leave a lot of filth, so a lot of people keep them for that. You'll just have to deal with him helping himself to some of your food every now and again, or leave him zoned out and he won't haul food in there. You could make a small stockpile right out side the fridge at low priority so he might drop food there and your guys can just take it the rest of the way in.
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Preechr Oct 21, 2019 @ 10:31am 
Replace the slate door with a wooden door, then move it one space to the left. Move your existing wooden door all the way to the right.

Look at your Zones/Areas... you should already have a Zone set up as Area 1. Make that Zone the same as your fridge area, including the airlock, then go to manage zones and "Invert" it. Restrict your dog to that zone in the Animals tab. That will allow your dog to go anywhere on the map except the fridge, unless he gets super hungry.

Dogs can be trained to haul stuff, and they don't leave a lot of filth, so a lot of people keep them for that. You'll just have to deal with him helping himself to some of your food every now and again, or leave him zoned out and he won't haul food in there. You could make a small stockpile right out side the fridge at low priority so he might drop food there and your guys can just take it the rest of the way in.
Last edited by Preechr; Oct 21, 2019 @ 10:43am
Dr. Uncredible Oct 21, 2019 @ 10:41am 
As Preechr says, set zones to keep animals out of the fridge.
Use wooden doors for now, they´re by far the fastest ones available to you right now, meaning less time is spent letting cold air out.

NOW. What you really want to do is research "autodoors", they need a bit of power to function, but they´re fast as all heck, regardless of material.
Kittenpox Oct 21, 2019 @ 10:41am 
The animal part, you can do with the Zone function. Create a zone (possibly via the Manage Zone option), Invert it so that it covers the map, then remove the Zone over the areas you want to exclude.

Depending upon the creature, they can be trained to fight, haul items to your stockpiles, rescue fallen colonists and drag them back to a bed, or be used as pack animals to carry stuff with your caravans.
Yorkshire Terriers can be used for combat, and provide meat+leather when killed. Labradors are large enough to Haul items for you, which makes them pretty useful once they've been trained to do that task. They're still vulnerable to attack from predators, though, but there are various ways you can choose to handle that situation; and I think the game is often best enjoyed when creating your own solutions to a situation.
Monoxide Oct 21, 2019 @ 10:43am 
also, when you can, you can make them autodoors. Plasteel is the fastest IIRC. I usually make my freezer doors out of steel/plasteel depending on availability once I have autodoors. Freezer is my most traveled area, so these are generally the only autodoors I have.

Additionally, 3-5 degrees isnt bad of a shift, it should reset pretty quickly. Sure you can go for super efficiency, but ultimately its unnecessary. If it remains a problem, just set your cooler a few degrees lower so it never kicks over to not frozen.

Final tip, double walling your fridge will maintain that temp better. youll still have the door loss, but it will most likely be a slight bit less, and will cool back down faster/easier.
M.K. (Banned) Oct 21, 2019 @ 11:00am 
Wood Autodoor causes zero delay for a passing colonist, and closes almost as fast.
Note that you will always have some cold spillage when you open a door. In your screenshot, make the "airlock" room just 1 tile wide. Smaller room steals less of your cold.
Astasia Oct 21, 2019 @ 11:06am 
It really doesn't matter, set the temp to -10C and make both doors wood. The amount of watts being wasted there is in the single digits or less (it might be 0W if the freezer is at high power all day anyway). If you want your freezer temps to fluctuate less from airlock traffic, make the freezer bigger. Temperature transference between rooms with an open door is based on room size and temperature difference. Smaller rooms change temperature much faster, and that is a very small freezer you have there.
LIMP BISQUICK Oct 21, 2019 @ 11:16am 
Was about to say something similar to astasia. Adding more coolers would help out as well. Surprised people recommending wooden doors considering it's flammable and easy to break down. Always used auto-doors myself.
xybolt Oct 21, 2019 @ 11:41am 
Originally posted by Preechr:
Look at your Zones/Areas... you should already have a Zone set up as Area 1. Make that Zone the same as your fridge area, including the airlock, then go to manage zones and "Invert" it.

I don't understand this. Do you mean the Zone menu in the Architect tab? There is no "areas" thing. I checked the icons at the right bottom corner (need to figure out three of them yet) and the only option zone relate-able is about its visibility.


Well, gotcha try the wooden doors. I did not know about training animals. It takes a while to have the haul level unlocked. And I was thinking that playing fetch is easier than training the dog to defend me.

Originally posted by M.K.:
In your screenshot, make the "airlock" room just 1 tile wide. Smaller room steals less of your cold.

Ah, that explains that one block spot in the reddit pic. I was going to put something there in the corners. Idk what yet. Gotcha scratch that.
xybolt Oct 21, 2019 @ 11:44am 
Oh, according to the image (see the reddit link), wall material does not matter. Is it okay'ish to build the outer wall with slate (I aim to use slate for walls only, sand/lime for floors) and the inner with wooden ones to utilise my resources better?

PS: just noticed that my dog has hepatitis K. Not gonna waste time on taming him.
Last edited by xybolt; Oct 21, 2019 @ 11:49am
AlP Oct 21, 2019 @ 12:26pm 
Originally posted by xybolt:
According to the wiki, some doors have their own open/close time. For example wooden doors have fast moving speeds than eg a slate door.
Yes, but the only door materials you want to use are wood and metal. They have nearly identical open/close time. Stone doors indeed work much slower.


Originally posted by xybolt:
And I am not even at that point that when a rim leaves it. Both doors are open. WTH. How can I ensure that the airlock principle is being "implemented".
You can't, unless you use a long enough corridor inside the airlock, which defeats the purpose. With a one-tile airlock, it's impossible to have one door close before opening the other. It's not a real airlock in the literal sense of the word.

Best you can do is use wood/metal autodoors for both doors, that way the airlock closes in the shortest amount of time.

You can also set the main cooler to anything like -200C. That way it'll constantly maintain a very low temperature, and it will outweigh any temperature loss from the airlock traffic. Your colonists will not be bothered by it, it takes a while to develop hypothermia.
Astasia Oct 21, 2019 @ 12:27pm 
Ya wall material does not effect insulation at all. Using partially slate and partially wood will not effect the efficiency of your freezer. If I've started stone production I build everything out of stone though, it's an unlimited resource and having flammable walls can be problematic in some situations (like if you have wires under them and get a short circuit event). Double walling a 5x5 early game freezer should not be a high priority though, if you are concerned about material costs I wouldn't bother. Once I build a full size freezer, like 15x15 (trade beacon size), that's when I might double wall it and start considering efficiency.
Morkonan Oct 21, 2019 @ 12:32pm 
Originally posted by xybolt:
According to the wiki, some doors have their own open/close time. For example ...
And I am not even at that point that when a rim leaves it. Both doors are open. WTH. How can I ensure that the airlock principle is being "implemented".

With the speed that a pawn moves over one tile, it's difficult to set the opening speeds for optimum efficiency using the quality of materials, alone. Auto-doors move a lot faster, but they are fairly expensive and if there is a power outage they move very slowly. Trying to min/max a single-space Airlock so that the outside door closes rapidly while the inside door moves much more slowly is going to mean there's a pawn standing there, waiting for the door to open, which lowers the efficiency of whatever that pawn is doing there... If you're trying to make the whole thing more efficient, include an extra space in the airlock and make wooden autodoors. L-shaped airlocks seem to work best, but that's extra tiles, extra manuevering, and they are still going to be subjected to multiple pawns moving through them, holding both doors open.

Don't put too much emphasis on an airlock going from a Room to a Freezer - The returns are "OK'ish" enough, but it's not critical. If you want to min/max your airlock, shift one of the doors over so the pawn has to move through two tiles. It won't help a bunch, though, until you get autodoors. And, even then, you are likely to have multiple pawns moving through those doors quite frequently. The more use your freezer gets as your colony gets larger, the more instances the doors are going to both be open at the same time.

One way to help keep a central freezer from getting a ton of needless door-openings-and-closings is to build a secondary freezer to store Meals in. That way, the only ones going into the main, critical, freezer areas are the cooks/haulers and maybe Hunters. Every pawn is going to be replacing carried meals twice a day. (Note: I don't normally present mods for "work arounds" where vanilla mechanics serve very well, but "Rimfridge" is awesome for keeping too many pawns out of central Meal storage areas. It doesn't make them prefer those Rimfridges to get their meals unless they're stocked with better meals than what may be in a central storage area. For pure vanilla, you can do something very similar just by storing meals on Shelves and putting those near areas where pawns frequently go. (Dining rooms) Nothing spoils if it's on a vanilla Shelf and they can be placed anywhere.)

And, yes, your freezer is going to be much more susceptible to small changes because it is small, too. Space has temperature retention, "mass", momentum, an unwillingness to achieve thermal equilibrium quickly unless something acts on it. UNLESS something gets connected directly to the dreaded "Outside," that is. "Outside" is big. It doesn't take much for a freezer to seek equilibrium with "Outside" once it is exposed. (ie: Once it no longer becomes a "Room" because a wall/door/ceiling is missing.) But, venting into another "Room" space? It has less impact and your main Freezer is likely going to be one of the larger rooms in your base.

Note: On the inside of your freezer, keep one space of floor clear beside the inner door. It can help pawns get inside the freezer area and past the inner door's area a little quicker. (IIRC, they slow a bit as they're moving into an obstructed tile. I need to check that, though.)

But, honestly, while an airlock is fine, it's not going to contribute to efficiency a great deal. Double-walling the freezer will do more and if the airlock area opens into an interior, climate controlled space, like an enclosed cooking area, it's not a big deal. However, if that airlock leads to any "Outside" area it really should be a good airlock. (I never "plan" a freezer that has direct access from outside, even with an "Airlock." Certain early-game necessities exempted.)

Last, but not least: how can I prevent this filthy creature (a tamed animal from start) entering the freezer. See 2 at the image. At least it solved a mystery: I lost a stack of meat. I thought that one of the rim likes raw meat (heh Reddit stories...) until I discovered this piece of dog entered the room himself to eat my meat. Oh boy, the "slaughter" action is an interesting option. (is there any uses for this kind of animal???)

Zones, as others have said, are the answer. Create a Zone that allows the Warg to go where you want it to be able to go, but forbids it from going where you don't want it to go. Assign that Animal to that zone in the Animals tab. You can change their assignment as necessary and change the Zone's coverage whenever needed.

Be advised - Wargs require raw meat and corpses. They're also very "Wild" so don't let them into your living spaces unless you want to have to clean up a ton of poop. :) Animals with a Wildness percentage of "0" don't poop in the house. (Dogs, mostly.) Higher Wildness percentages mean they're more likely to do so and they're more difficult to train, in general.
xybolt Oct 23, 2019 @ 12:05pm 
Made some changes. I think that I figured it out. Thanks for all everyone. I have marked one of the posts here as an answer but in fact all of them have been helpful.

This is my situation now: I have built a freezer room in the area below it and moved the freezer so that I have a corridor to dissipate heat away.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1896937094

However, my approach is not so fault-proof. See that little slate wall that pops outside. Initially it was placed in that open spot (so that the corridor is not accessible anymore), but it led to a room temperature of 120+ degrees making adjacent room warm >.> so moved that block wall.

I suspect the roofs being a problem. I noticed that there is a Architect -> Zone option to remove roof area's. Gotcha remove three blocks of roofs (on spots that aren't connected to my freezers).

And ... I have to admit that I still don't understand how to zone my meat-thief out the freezer/fridge. I am stuck at that "create a zone" step because idk what to do. Which zone? In Architect -> Zone as asked before? Did not got a response.

Originally posted by AlP:
You can also set the main cooler to anything like -200C.

does it not draw a lot power? o.O In the above setup, it works fine with setting the freezer to -5°C. My food kept being frozen, even if my cook entered it to get some meat.

Originally posted by Morkonan:
For pure vanilla, you can do something very similar just by storing meals on Shelves and putting those near areas where pawns frequently go. (Dining rooms) Nothing spoils if it's on a vanilla Shelf and they can be placed anywhere.)

neat; that's an useful furniture then. I am going to use it for my prison area.

Originally posted by Morkonan:
Double-walling the freezer will do more and if the airlock area opens into an interior, climate controlled space, like an enclosed cooking area, it's not a big deal.

I have seen the double walling concept on reddit. And went forth with it. A good thing, but as you can see, I need some time to finish it :D

Originally posted by Morkonan:
Zones, as others have said, are the answer. Create a Zone that allows the Warg to go where you want it to be able to go, but forbids it from going where you don't want it to go.

Well, as said here above: I am stuck at the create zone step....


Originally posted by Morkonan:
They're also very "Wild" so don't let them into your living spaces unless you want to have to clean up a ton of poop. :)

poop? Maybe that explains why two of my rims are complaining something something environment with a -2 mood. I have to figure out that cleaning work job atm

I have disabled it for all rims in work tab because they should not waste their time on it. Might be a bad decision...
Morkonan Oct 23, 2019 @ 12:28pm 
Originally posted by xybolt:
Well, as said here above: I am stuck at the create zone step....

Understandable - It doesn't actually lead you to a "create new zone" option easily. That whole bit is kind of hamfisted. You have to create a zone to manage it, but have to manage a zone to be able to create it... :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bz_Mzm4l2Mc

Once it's initially created, you can select and make changes from the drop-down lists in the Architect tools. You assign animals to specific allowed zones in the Animal tab.

Originally posted by Morkonan:
They're also very "Wild" so don't let them into your living spaces unless you want to have to clean up a ton of poop. :)

poop? Maybe that explains why two of my rims are complaining something something environment with a -2 mood. I have to figure out that cleaning work job atm

I have disabled it for all rims in work tab because they should not waste their time on it. Might be a bad decision...
[/quote]

"Cleaning" is necessary. It's sometimes a critical task... That Filth and Trash doesn't go away by itself in the interiors of your base. (Outside, Filth and Trash will be washed away by rain. But, some other unsightly things that Cleaning will get rid off won't be removed by rain.)

You will battle with "Cleaning" assignments for a long time. They're necessary. The only time you'll ever have a truly clean base, and one that doesn't upset colonists every time they look at it, is when you have some extra colonists assigned primarily to Cleaning.

IOW - Cleaning is on the Job list because it's an important type of Job. :)

"Animal Filth" is... poop. When you see it in areas you don't want filth, make sure Animals aren't allowed in that area. Newborn animals, btw, don't inherit the Allowed Zones of their parents, so you have to also assign them to their allowed areas. (It's a good idea to keep newborn animals and other animals that can't defend themselves near the base or other protected areas, only allowing larger, more capable, tamed animals to range very far from home.)
Preechr Oct 23, 2019 @ 12:37pm 
Not cleaning will kill your colony. For now, you should probably set the priority for it on all colonists to 1 so they get your base spotless, and then figure out who your most useless colonist is and set them to do it on a 2nd priority or something. If you ever have a pawn that runs out of stuff to do, that's a good one to give it to as well. "If you're leaning, you should be cleaning," if you will...

I use Zones and Areas interchangeably, which is a bad habit I guess. Zones are for growing food and sorting out what goes where. Areas are for restricting movement as well as defining your Home Area, where roofs go, and where you want snow cleared from.

In your architect menu, you should see a button for Zone/Area. (You will also see a column for Area Restrictions under your Restrictions and Animals tabs so you can assign People and Animals to whatever Areas you wish. By default, everyone is assigned to Unrestricted.)

For Areas, you should see buttons for expand area and clear area, as well as a button for manage area. I'm going by memory here, and if you are using a non-English version the words might be a little different. Anyhow, you start off with an undefined area called Area 1. You can see this if you open up the manage areas button. You can define it by clicking on the expand areas button, and Area 1 will pop up to the right. which you can click. That will let you define Area 1, draw a box over the interior of your cooler, then open up the Manage Areas screen, rename Area 1 to STOP EATING MY MEAT, and click the Invert button.

That will invert the area you just defined so that only the interior of your cooler is restricted. Now go to your animals tab and change your infected doggo area assignment to STOP EATING MY MEAT and your dog won't go in the fridge anymore unless he's starving to death.

You can create up to 5 areas, and you can assign colonists and tamed animals to these zones AREAS! ahem, but there are exceptions to how they will obey these restrictions. Drafted pawns and animals that are following them will go anywhere you tell them to. If you create a zone AREA DAMMIT that has two or more separate areas in it, they can travel across the restricted area to get from one allowed area to another. Similarly, if you were to open a hole over an area you didn't want them to go into, if the path to get from point A to point B crosses that forbidden area they will still path through it but not interact with anything in it. Finally, as I said before, a starving pawn or animal, or a pawn on a mood break, will ignore area restrictions.
Last edited by Preechr; Oct 23, 2019 @ 12:41pm
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Date Posted: Oct 21, 2019 @ 10:18am
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