Kana as tank

[calabacina]

hi all

so this guy wears heavy armor and a 2-handed weapon, yet if I dare to put him on the front line he usually lasts less than a hamster's yawn... do you think it's possible to use him as a tank? do you have any advice?

[D'amarr from Darshiva]

As in older topics...

Due to class traits, Chanter is not a tank class. Low number of engagement slots bear a higher risk of getting flanked. "Very Low" base Endurance and "Low" base Health is the same as Wizard, Rogue, Priest, Druid, Cipher.

So, even if you shift some attributes, you cannot fix that easily. And high investment into CON would be a waste.

Wielding a 2H weapon, you also take the penalty of not improving Deflection. Chanter comes with "High" base Deflection like monks, but that's still -5 compared with fighter.
Instead of a 2H weapon, you may need to use a shield for the Deflection increase.

Chanter also doesn't regenerate endurance as good as fighters, so choosing Veteran's Recovery from the cross-class talents will make a big difference.


What else? A solo chanter can complete the entire game (including the expansions) on hardest difficulty. But that is not because of being a tank class. You cannot jump into the fray blindly and survive the onslaught. A party chanter just like a solo chanter depends more on food, drugs, equipment, resting bonuses, protection scrolls, potions - and support from a priest can do wonders, of course. And any solo Watcher relies on special strategies and tactics, such as split-pulling and meta-gaming (knowing where to go next, what quests to complete in which order, which enchanted items to wear if facing dangerous enemies).

[Gilmoy]

I get the same results. Kana will always be bad at melee. It's simply not his role.

Comparing Chanter to Fighter, Chanter has:
-5 Accuracy (25 vs. 30, and the same per-level gain)
-5 Deflection (25 vs. 30)
-14% Endurance (36 vs. 42)
- no Constant Recovery healing

My Kana uses his 3 weapon sets like this:
I. sword + large shield in emergency oh-crap mode, for low-80s Deflection (at L11)

The shield gives him the largest possible +Deflection boost.
I don't care that it trashes his Accuracy. His only job in this mode is to not-die.
I don't care if he misses every attack, or Grazes for MIN damage.

II. arbalest
III. arbalest

His #1 job is to summon, and free-heal everybody, including his summons.
That means he stands 3.0m - 6.0m behind the front line, and stays there.

His #2 job is to shoot. He's a decent shooter. (Every class is a decent shooter.)
At L9+, his #3 job is to stack Dragon Thrashed DoT.

He never chooses to melee. His soulbound weapon doesn't require it.
There's zero situations in which sending a Chanter into melee is a top option.
Other characters are far better at melee, and/or have soulbounds that require it.

You could, in principle, spend 5 talent points to turn a Chanter into a weaker Fighter.
But you'll always have that systemic -5/-5 and lower Endurance and Health.

[Baldurs_Gate_2]

Heavy Armor with shield and cautious attack. Buff his deflection with priest. Use consecrated ground on him. Attack speed doesn't matter for his chants.

[D'amarr from Darshiva]

Yet Kana can join 1-2 frontliners and cover them with e.g. Gallant's Focus (= the cross-class paladin-like aura) and also use his cone-shaped offensive invocations more conveniently.

Priests can assume a similar role - with body guards near them while they cast small AoE spells and self-support spells to prepare for combat.

In addition to the few cross-class talents that are attractive, there's also some bits of unique equipment that become interesting. "Measured Restraint", the rapier with +1 engagement slots. "Cladhaliath", the spear that grants +10 Accuracy to an ally attacking the same target, 1H weapons that add +4 Accuracy when attacking the same target as an ally. Cloaks and items in general with spellbind (up to 3x per rest), and this becomes good if the chanter casts from scrolls often.

[calabacina]

yay you all where right I use him badly... I just met a feathered paladin (!) who is definitely more comfortable on the front line, I will still equip a shield to Kana, thanks to everyone for the advices. I come from AD&D (second edition) and some mechanics are not clear to me...

[Zzyl_tsw]

he's still my off-tank (eder first, paladin off tank too), but yeah, in this game, i am pretty sure my party is not really optimized (i play in the difficulty before potd)

[calabacina]

yep i've given up on the idea that hes not a full tank, but still it's handy when some mobs manage to cross the front line to have someone in heavy armor defending Alot, my only real gripe with kana is that giant head... :P

[talemore]

Because of how the game work the less deflection and armor the higher chances the AI will gangbang the character which makes them the tank in the party.

Fighters aren't tanks since many of their abilities is to prevent enemy to walk away from the tank and hit the target when stop attacking the tank. Or attack when the tank disengage.

Chanter improve healing on fighter and the fighter has to heal the tank which makes things like lore useful on a fighter and less on a wizard or priest.

This means that wizards need to use the heaviest and protective gear while the tankers have as less protection as possible.

Chanters focus on mobility and reloading speed and attacking speed of ranged weapons. Running in circles can be a tanking strategy. Chanters gain support from paladin and classes who provide mobility since chanters are build around mobility and escaping that they as well use traps and stealth.

Even if party members are confused high mobility prevent any reaching since they're slower when charmed.

Chanters are built on mobility and disengage has higher deflection when upgraded.

Their spells are likely the least balanced since battles end at 1 to 2 cast spells while the chanter is made to start at the 3rd spell that the lure back to the party has to be a long way back. When the AI want to give up is where the battle start.

The drawback is close quarters where disruption has higher impact and where teams a wiped by being pushed into a corner with no way out.

Spells who blind and slow down and prone,paralyze gains time as well charms disable enemies.

The chanter promise a lot and doesn't provide, the chants is an illusion of choice since there will be only one chant who will ever be active.

Concentration disruption is your main weapon. You don't need to stand still, you still cause disruption while moving.

Normally we set up a periphery where the tank is followed by the fighter in a roman formation of lines with spears in the rear and shields in the frontier while elite archers in the center.

In this case the chanter is light cavalry followed by light cavalry of archers who outmaneuver the opponent like example a paladin or a wizard or a monk with increased mobility. The chanter is in a way replacing the fighter since it slowly replenish.

Wizards rather rely on critical hits than accuracy since it has none. Monks rely on disruption and locking down spell casters. The chanter is most of the time the least fun to play with since it's a scout.

I'd say those who say you can solo on the hardest difficulty would as well spoken that you can win the game without any weapons and armor, showing how little it impact the actual outcome.

[calabacina]

thanks a lot for all the infos