Vs. Drakken

[SilentDragon]

I've only 6 hours or so of play in this, primarily as the Wild Walkers, so maybe it's just inexperience with the game, but with two games against the Drakken now (both had difficulty on normal), I've had to deal with huge hitpoints compared to my own.

The First game they came knocking, declaring I was all about War (kind of odd when they initiated all fights, but w/e). Each of their units between 250-300 hitpoints and beyond 350 for their hero. And I'm talking about the Drakenlings and the Wyvern(? the flying one). NOT their big Ancient.

I just chalked it up to them spending more on improving troops. However, I started a new game, and about 15-20 turns in I had to get to a quest location in their territory (up to 4 ruins in 15 turns). so they get their troops to me before I can get out and my 2 archers + hero are up against 2 drakenlings + hero and they are all 200+ hp, their hero being 300+.

WHAT?! Unless I'm doing something horribly wrong in handling my troops with only 70+ hitpoints at the start of the game, then either the comp is being given insane odds, or the drakken are broken in their early game and can win 1v1 as soon as their troops go the distance (barring any declaration of war and whatnot)...

[Zednaught]

The Drakken get crazy, especially with higher difficulties.

I encountered a mroe than 2400 HP army by turn 40 on Impossible difficulty. Every unit had 600+ HP. It's absolutely insane.

Of course, I ended up winning by simply playing peacefully and avoiding war.

[Jiks]

Drakken do indeed have lots of hit points but they are not that great in any other respect. The AI is not entirely dumb, however so plays to that strength, adding things/skills/heroes that add more HPs or even more annoyingly, heals.

I can see something you could change that would help - your army make up. As the Walkers you start with a ranged hero and two ranged units. This is not a balanced force, ranged units alone will perform very poorly against a melee heavy force like the drakken. Your army needs something that can shield your Rangers while they get on with the business of killing stuff from afar.

Easiest solution early on is to add Dawn Officers or an assimilated minor faction infantry. Dawn Officers are not great at tanking either TBH, wheras your Era 2 Titan is perfect for this role.

One last thing I do is edit the Ranger build as soon as I start the game to add more armor, improved their survivability a lot.

[SilentDragon]

I see, well it just seemed a bit over the top for the turn number, but I'll see what I can do and take your advice. You've definitely made it sound more reasonable and less game-breaking.

Thanks!

[Jiks]

Thanks :)

My advice was a bit rubbish however, as I listed Vaulter units not Walkers. Much the same holds true luckily, the era 2 Tenai Walker is a great tank. Got Vaulters on the brain, it seems ><.

I should never post anything till I've had a coffee.

[Boink]

Most, if not all, of the Drakken heroes have a skill that boosts total army hp. Their basic unit also has fast XP skills. Six of their basic melee types with 300+ HP (every time the AI kills a wandering mob, they'll level up >.<) is very difficult to stop early game, especially since the current mechanics have little CC options, and damage is low (20-60) at the first tier.


Your best bet is to rush mercenaries & invest in those with chain abilites or beams. Demons or Haunts are so vastly better than any other minor race that they're essential. Haunts have the infantry killing skill, making them even better.

Haunts are also the second best race to assimilate, as they give +5% science / village, and their units are so good. The eyeless with +5 happiness are better on higher difficulty levels if you're playing peacefully, but their units are only useful for heals.


TL;DR


Get Haunts. Fast.

[Done25]

Haunts are quite rediculous. I always pray I don't start with them in my territory. They can be quite vicious.

[mark_19182001]

I have played about 50 hours of the game trying different stratagies , different races , etc and still find the samething for all the AI armies .. They always, no matter how improved my army is ,they are 3 to 4 times better in everything , armies , influence , science , production and diplomacy.. I am starting to think when they programed the AI in this game they did it old style and gave the AI races a very large advantage like programers did in the past .

[Gentleman]

What difficulty are you playing, Mark? On Normal AI and the player are on the same level, and I usually steamroll AI in wars because I can expand and research more effeciently. On Hard and higher, yes, AI gets extra benefits, because that's what higher difficulties are about (AI still isn't that hard on Hard, I'd say. Serious is where things start getting really ugly.)

As about Drakens, I personally found them average opponent. They have no specific military bonuses, and wyverns are outshined by minor factions like Demons or Ended. The Ancient are nice, but they are hardly overpowered.

[Horoai]

Drakkens are easy to beat. All of their dangerous units are Flyers so grab some longbows yielding Flyerslayer attribute. Done.

[Jeff]

Honestly i think its all about the early lv on your heroes and units on higher diffuclties . As wild walkers your intial untis and hero are so op you can gain fast lv by raising every non-faction village.
Secondly try to provoke AI by atacking their new built cities and waiting for them to send their massive army to fight you back at the city : that +100 hit points are so good early and +1-3 millitian do the job for blocking the intial charge units , you should never rush with your archer and stand the ground , due to 6 turn limit most of your force tend to survive and you damage Ai force greatly . A couple more fights like that give you extra level and weakeness Ai force makes you unstoppable machine that traples every region. (i think movement artifcat on range unit are godlike, it allows you to kite enemy force if they get close until 6 turns expire

[Drahcir0]

Originally posted by Yggdrasil:

Drakkens are easy to beat. All of their dangerous units are Flyers so grab some longbows yielding Flyerslayer attribute. Done.

actually, they got onyl 1 flying unit, and those aren´t really the problem, they are just fast as hell

[Horoai]

Originally posted by ιllιlı.♥►Drahcir◄♥.ι:

Originally posted by Yggdrasil:

Drakkens are easy to beat. All of their dangerous units are Flyers so grab some longbows yielding Flyerslayer attribute. Done.

actually, they got onyl 1 flying unit, and those aren´t really the problem, they are just fast as hell

Well Wyvern have always been my problem. High damage, relatively high HP = they always outtrade your units, even worse if you trigger sweep strike back.

Drakklings don't deal any damage and you can just ignore them for 6 turns.

Their mages aren't anything special compared to other faction's units.

[Drahcir0]

Originally posted by Yggdrasil:

Originally posted by ιllιlı.♥►Drahcir◄♥.ι:

actually, they got onyl 1 flying unit, and those aren´t really the problem, they are just fast as hell

Well Wyvern have always been my problem. High damage, relatively high HP = they always outtrade your units, even worse if you trigger sweep strike back.

Drakklings don't deal any damage and you can just ignore them for 6 turns.

Their mages aren't anything special compared to other faction's units.

I agree with the high damage, but they got "moderate" Initiative and sure as hell they got no high HP, maybe their extra exp trait pays off for this, but I know for sure, that they are almost 2 hits on lvl 1-5

[Horoai]

Originally posted by ιllιlı.♥►Drahcir◄♥.ι:

Originally posted by Yggdrasil:

Well Wyvern have always been my problem. High damage, relatively high HP = they always outtrade your units, even worse if you trigger sweep strike back.

Drakklings don't deal any damage and you can just ignore them for 6 turns.

Their mages aren't anything special compared to other faction's units.

I agree with the high damage, but they got "moderate" Initiative and sure as hell they got no high HP, maybe their extra exp trait pays off for this, but I know for sure, that they are almost 2 hits on lvl 1-5

Just checked it and you're right. Damn first impressions.