Anyone else think Civ 6 is going to flop as bad as Tropico 5 did?

[SafeSpaceDestroyer]

I just finished watching the behind the scenes commentary with the developer team and I was blown away by some of the things they said.

One part in particular essentially boiled down to him saying "We don't want new players to be afraid of how complicated it is" Are you kidding me? This series is being severely dumbed down for console users so they can reach a wider market base and diversify their player base. Which would be great, if THINKING, and STRATEGY, and LEARNING CURVES, and MANAGEMENT weren't the HALLMARKS of the series. They want to reach an audience of children who don't like thinking too hard so they can boost sales. Which is strange because this series 6th installment was made possible by loyal fans, not kids who are currently playing CoD as I type this. It's such a big spit in the face. I'm glad I received my pre-order for free because I'll be devastated if this turns into another failed attempt at dumbing down a series to get into the pockets of parents who will buy their kids cartoony looking games.


What I've seen so far isn't Civ 6, it's Sid Meiers Civilization: Reimagined.

*****Reposted here so SamBC won't lock the thread again for discussing possible negative aspects of this game*****

[Darkwing]

"We don't want new players to be afraid of how complicated it is"
You know, the obvious implication here is that the game IS complicated, and the dev team doesn't want new players to be afraid of that.
You literally took a statement that directly says the game is complicated and interpreted that as the game is not complicated.
Please, speak no more of your intellectual prowess and maturity level.
We've seen enough.

*****Reposted here so SamBC won't lock the thread again for discussing possible negative aspects of this game*****

aaand there goes the hardest facepalm of my life. Holy hell.

🍆👈👉🌽
👆👌✌☝

[SamBC]

Apart from the postscript, this thread is absolutely appropriate in this forum.

(Okay, it's kinda redundant, but we're still being a bit relaxed about that)

[SamBC]

On to the substance:

SgtGenderBender님이 먼저 게시:

One part in particular essentially boiled down to him saying "We don't want new players to be afraid of how complicated it is" Are you kidding me? This series is being severely dumbed down for console users so they can reach a wider market base and diversify their player base. Which would be great, if THINKING, and STRATEGY, and LEARNING CURVES, and MANAGEMENT weren't the HALLMARKS of the series. They want to reach an audience of children who don't like thinking too hard so they can boost sales. Which is strange because this series 6th installment was made possible by loyal fans, not kids who are currently playing CoD as I type this. It's such a big spit in the face. I'm glad I received my pre-order for free because I'll be devastated if this turns into another failed attempt at dumbing down a series to get into the pockets of parents who will buy their kids cartoony looking games.

Are you complaining about the graphics, or the gameplay? Everything we know about the gameplay is more complex than Civ5. Not only does it have all the key gameplay features of Civ5+G&K+BNW (except the World Congress), it has a load of new gameplay elements that all add to the complexity.

[Darkwing]

How does one stumble across that dev team interview and somehow not encounter all the other information available about the game?

[Waeress]

In my opinion Civ was never a complex strategy game, compared to real complex strategy games. Played since Civ 1 and 8 years of age.
I also agree with Thunder here. If they say that it probably means that the game is more complicated and that they are working hard to convey the concepts and rules. (which by the way is not something that have been done so well in all previous civ games)

Explaining the rules in a pedagogical way is in no way an indication that the rules will be simple.

[Darkwing]

"I don't want you guys to be intimidated by how lethal this gun is, so I'm going carefully demonstrate the proper way to handle and discharge a firearm. Ok?"

"Hey, you hear that?
I guess that gun's not dangerous...amirite?"

[TheKumuCortwade]

I... uh... I have Tropico 5, and I quite enjoy sending my military to kill everyone in a riot...

[SamBC]

It could also mean they've worked on making the rules make more intuitive sense.

[CrazyVulcan]

Well, confirmed changes to Civ6 that make the game more complex would be.

Unstacked Citys + Adjacency Bonus
Split Tech Tree between Culture and Technology
Government Edic cards that tailor your government to your playstyle.
Builders vs Workers
Ai agendas and random secret agenda

And those were the largest that came to mind off the top of my head.

[therealjohnconnor]

Just lock the thread again, Sam. So bored with this yatter yatter.

[BDK]

Nah. Hopefully you can combine troops again in Civ 6, I had a really hard time moving 50 units around in 5. Ugh!

[Darkwing]

BDK님이 먼저 게시:

Nah. Hopefully you can combine troops again in Civ 6, I had a really hard time moving 50 units around in 5. Ugh!

They've already discussed this. Unit merging is a thing in Civ VI.

[leandrombraz]

What they mean by that, as they made clear in previous interviews, is that the UI will be more informative and easier to read, not that the systems or the game will be simplified, which clearly isn't considering what you saw so far. Making a game more acessible doesn't necessarily means it will be dumbed down, it just mean they won't overcomplicate just for the sake of making it look complex.

One simple example is that the UI tell you how much adjacent bonus you get when you're placing a district, instead of letting the player do the math. The system is just as complex, it merely make information more acessible and easier to read.

[DarthHammer]

My favorite part is how the OP seems to think that a 'learning curve' means the exact oppostie of what it really means.

That or he thinks a bad learning curve is a good thing.

[Bouncer]

DarthHammer님이 먼저 게시:

My favorite part is how the OP seems to think that a 'learning curve' means the exact oppostie of what it really means.

That or he thinks a bad learning curve is a good thing.

You'd be surprised how many gamers believe that. There's entire genres where 'bad learning curves' are a big feature and people would be furious if those ever saw quality of life improvements. Fighters and Mobas especially.

Wouldn't be surprised if this goes for some folks here too.