Are unique units really worth much?

[Soloquendi]

It seems like mid game units are only relevant for about 10 turns then are obsolete. Like the Mongolian horse archers. By the time you get several built, gunpowder comes along. Or the Zulu Impi as well. Are they in the game more for flavor than actual advantage?

[OrangeManBad]

Due to the eureka boost system and too fast research times (need nerf), it often means unique units have very limited life span. They are worth but ... you are right, very soon outdated. Design flaw

[Stormwinds]

It depends entirely on the unit and civ. The Pitati Archer is crazy good not only because it's good in a vacuum, but also because Nubia can make them cheaper. Another great unique is the Voi Chien, which is all around better than the unit it replaces and gets additional combat strength and movement thanks to Ba Trieu's ability.
There's also the Domrey, which may be a pretty decent unit on it's own or in the hands of a civ like the Ottomans, but since the Khmer have no incentive to go to war, the unit goes to waste.
The Keshig used to be much better back when cavalry could use siege towers and battering rams because you could get them to the front lines faster. Now they are crossbowman with extra move. Good, but kinda underwhelming.

[OrangeManBad]

So you have a very limited short window to take advantage of the more powerful units.

It is a serious design flaw

Some people play on Epic or Marathon because of this

[jonnin]

The earlier the unit the more impact it has in a slow game. Giglamesh is an absolute terror on marathon.

[ingosupercute]

Originally posted by OrangeManBad:

Some people play on Epic or Marathon because of this

The issue still prevails on marathon. Even there your units get outdated way too soon. The only difference is that it takes much longer to produce them so you have less.

[OrangeManBad]

It should not be the case on Marathon but with the implementation of boosts eurekas it became a very serious problem, they broke even the game speed.

Boost: build 6 farms. What ? So it became a race to oblige developer's wishes rather than the player's own wishes and initiative. Garbage design

[alangriffith]

Originally posted by ingosupercute:

Originally posted by OrangeManBad:

Some people play on Epic or Marathon because of this

The issue still prevails on marathon. Even there your units get outdated way too soon. The only difference is that it takes much longer to produce them so you have less.

That's why I used the Historic Speed mod. Gives marathon tech times and building construction, but standard speed unit construction (also increased unit upkeep to prevent mega armies). Means I get a decent amount of time with each unit (and a decent number of them).

Unfortunately I don;t know if it still works. No sign of recent updates, and only recent comments are about problems. I've not played Civ VI since the last free patch (too busy with Stellaris and real life, in that order).

[OrangeManBad]

The classical Civ-games problem. "My units got outdated by the time I reached my enemy"

Yesterday I played with Alexander, I was certain I win the battle. Oh wait he suddenly made crossbowman. Totally decimated my units. I had nothing to do. Cant upgrade because not in my territory.

Maybe the solution to this problem is exactly this. IF YOU HIT THE TECH ALL UNITS SHOULD AUTO-UPGRADE, regardless in which territory they are positioned.

[OrangeManBad]

Imagine you are in a far land takes eternity distance, but times go on and your civilization is advanced.

So how come and how unrealistic this is that your army has no idea that your own CIV got so much advanced ? BS

[OrangeManBad]

As soon as you hit the new tech your army must upgrade (still costs money) but not restricted to this stupid "homeland only upgrade BS"

[OrangeManBad]

This artificial dumbass implementation that army can upgrade in homeland is the dumbest thing Firaxis ever came with. It is nonsense inside the game and nonsense outside the game.

[Soloquendi]

I wonder if making the unique units retain their bonuses when upgraded would help. Like the Keshig would still have extra movement and a ranged attack after upgrading to cavalry, etc.

[OrangeManBad]

Don't get me wrong. I amnot saying that as soon as you hit the new Tech your units auto-upgrade. Not at all. It still will cost tons of money to upgrade them, and you better have that money. But what I am saying is that this dumbass rule of "upgrade only if in homeland territory" is awful

[Loviatar]

Why should you be able to upgrade in a far off land? That would be even more broken than your "Alexander suddenly has crossbowmen" scenario. Flip it around - Alexander is attacking you with warriors and archers ... you're holding them off fairly well, then Alex discovers crossbows. Bam, suddenly those Archers plinking uselessly at your ancient walls are now smashing your cities down. That's why you have to upgrade in friendly territory. it's also to force you to plan your wars

In any case, with the April Update, most of the unique units, if they weren't already in the upgrade tree, now are. So it's not really a matter of whether they are worth it, you'll upgrade into them naturally as you progress. Unique units are stronger than the common unit they replace/are comparable to.

As I suggested in another thread, if you are finding research is going too fast to really make use of unique units, consider the Take Your Time mod. It allows you to adjust the costs of research, as well as the % gained from eurekas. This could help pace things out better for you to more fully enjoy things:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2176927489

I'm currently trying out an Epic game with Warfare Expanded as well, to see if I can get a more fully immersive domination game going. Still in the early game, but looking to be fun.

[pirate135246]

This is a design flaw in regards to units that cannot be prebuilt or upgraded, but even on online speed, unique units are far from obsolete if you understand prebuilds