Loyalty + Amenties; bad combination

[Pim]

I have a city that I conquered, but there's -5 amenities. This results in an impossible to break out loop of that city becoming a free city, being loyal, breaking free, etc. Because I keep attacking the city, or someone else does, the population keeps decreasing. But the amenities are so low, that even with a govenor and military unit in the city with the policy that garrisoned units provide extra loyalty, it's just impossible to keep the city loyal. Because there's fewer people everytime, it's impossible to build an entertainment district. I mean, population is now 6 and I need 13 or greater. It'll be impossible for anyone to keep this city.

[gimmethegepgun]

Make peace and the loyalty penalty will drop and the warmonger amenity penalty will evaporate quickly.
Or just give them what they so obviously want and burn it to the ground.

[Celebane]

The -5 amenities is probably due to war weariness. Make peace, garrison a unit, and assign a govenor and things should settle down some for both loyalty and amenities.

[Pim]

Originally posted by Celebane:

The -5 amenities is probably due to war weariness. Make peace, garrison a unit, and assign a govenor and things should settle down some for both loyalty and amenities.

Yeah, eventually I figured that out, but war weariness degrades way too slow in this case. I just gave up on the city.

[leandrombraz]

Originally posted by PimN:

Originally posted by Celebane:

The -5 amenities is probably due to war weariness. Make peace, garrison a unit, and assign a govenor and things should settle down some for both loyalty and amenities.

Yeah, eventually I figured that out, but war weariness degrades way too slow in this case. I just gave up on the city.

Making peace give a huge one time reduction in war weariness and it will fade 4X faster. You probably will be clean of war weariness by the time you can declare war again. While it fade, you can build entertainment complex in other cities. Because amenities from sources like luxuries are spread to the city that need it the most, any city that increase amenities will help the city you conquer, you don't need to build an EC on the conquered city to increase its amenities.

[Celebane]

Originally posted by leandrombraz:

While it fade, you can build entertainment complex in other cities. Because amenities from sources like luxuries are spread to the city that need it the most, any city that increase amenities will help the city you conquer, you don't need to build an EC on the conquered city to increase its amenities.

^
+1

[Pim]

Originally posted by leandrombraz:

Originally posted by PimN:

Yeah, eventually I figured that out, but war weariness degrades way too slow in this case. I just gave up on the city.

Making peace give a huge one time reduction in war weariness and it will fade 4X faster. You probably will be clean of war weariness by the time you can declare war again. While it fade, you can build entertainment complex in other cities. Because amenities from sources like luxuries are spread to the city that need it the most, any city that increase amenities will help the city you conquer, you don't need to build an EC on the conquered city to increase its amenities.

Thanks for the explanation. However, I had peace for about 150 turns, with the exception of one protectorate war, but my capital still had -8 amenities, all from war weariness.

[Sugam]

-8 amenities, thats crazy. This is just my thoughts but I think there is more in play here then just war weariness. Currently, I am at war with 14 out of 19 civs for the past 190 turns and despite the large amount of high pop cities I have, im still in the positive in amenities.

In your case it could be canceled deals due to war or simply expired, lost city states, ect that slipped by without being noticed. It can get tricky trying to keep control of a new city far from your own and deep in other civs backyard if you plan for it it should be possible. Its for sure not required to build a entertainment complex but if you need to, target cities with 3 wood tiles so you can harvest them down for fast wood with gov. magnus assigned to it to double it. If you harvest some tiles like deer, you get a crazy amount of production from it.

[leandrombraz]

Originally posted by PimN:

Originally posted by leandrombraz:

Making peace give a huge one time reduction in war weariness and it will fade 4X faster. You probably will be clean of war weariness by the time you can declare war again. While it fade, you can build entertainment complex in other cities. Because amenities from sources like luxuries are spread to the city that need it the most, any city that increase amenities will help the city you conquer, you don't need to build an EC on the conquered city to increase its amenities.

Thanks for the explanation. However, I had peace for about 150 turns, with the exception of one protectorate war, but my capital still had -8 amenities, all from war weariness.

Here is a detailed explanation of how it works:
https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/how-war-weariness-works-wip.623207/

Just to clarify, you need to be at peace with everyone for it to fade faster. If you made peace with one Civ, that would reduce 2000 from your WW on the turn you made peace (-5 amenities), another 2000 for each CS that Civ was suzerain. At peace, it fade 200 WW per turn, so -1 amenity every two turns. In 150 turns you would lose 30000 WW or -75 amenities. That's an ungodly amount of WW, you would need to fight 800+ combats to get that much WW, in other words you wouldn't get that much WW, ever. If you still have -8 amenities from WW after 150 turns of peace, your WW isn't fading properly, something is wrong (AKA bug). Either that our the protectorate war you mentioned was recent and you got that -8 from it.

[Pim]

Originally posted by leandrombraz:

Originally posted by PimN:

Thanks for the explanation. However, I had peace for about 150 turns, with the exception of one protectorate war, but my capital still had -8 amenities, all from war weariness.

Here is a detailed explanation of how it works:
https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/how-war-weariness-works-wip.623207/

Just to clarify, you need to be at peace with everyone for it to fade faster. If you made peace with one Civ, that would reduce 2000 from your WW on the turn you made peace (-5 amenities), another 2000 for each CS that Civ was suzerain. At peace, it fade 200 WW per turn, so -1 amenity every two turns. In 150 turns you would lose 30000 WW or -75 amenities. That's an ungodly amount of WW, you would need to fight 800+ combats to get that much WW, in other words you wouldn't get that much WW, ever. If you still have -8 amenities from WW after 150 turns of peace, your WW isn't fading properly, something is wrong (AKA bug). Either that our the protectorate war you mentioned was recent and you got that -8 from it.

I'm starting to think that it's a bug, because some cities have been gaining amenities again, but the capital is still stuck at -8. Anyways, I've already finished that game.

Thanks again for all your help!

[#######]

Scorched Earth. Rebuild on the ruins.