This Game Has Some Serious Issues.

[Vorelisk]

EDIT: Do not bother posting just to explain how everything is a skill issue, unless you really want to; someone has already done that. Helpful players have replied to give tips on what to do and what no to do, so this is just here as feedback to the developers at this point.



I can't wait for 50 people to tell me how trash and stupid I am instead of engaging with anything I'm about to say. I want to love this game, but I'm having a really, really ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ hard time, because this game is an endless loop of death with no progress.

1. I can only engage two to three enemies at a time without being instantly killed, and shooting any gun at any time draws 10-20 enemies who hear the gunfire.

2. I can barely carry 10 lbs. of loot at a time, the only loot worth any real amount of money is large loot that I can only carry one of at a time, and 9 times out of 10 stopping to loot anything is a death sentence.

3. The beginner quest I am on requires me to gather drone parts from drones that patrol over groups of enemies I cannot fight.

4. I leveled the AK enough to have the dust cover with an attachment rail, and immediately after attaching a scope it became painfully obvious that the scope is useless, my gun fires at ludicrous levels of inaccuracy, and I'm lucky to hit my target at all while aiming center mass.

5. Sometimes when a cyborg zombie hits me I am launched 100 feet into the air and then die from fall damage.

6. The movement system makes it impossible to disengage from a losing encounter and retreat. Why does my character handle like an obese tank? Why do I get stuck on every piece of geometry that isn't a completely flat surface? Why does jumping completely stop all momentum and make me jump straight up?

I am so very happy for all the people in discussion threads who have maxed their water and deemed the game "too easy." Congratulations, you are elite gamers, and everyone wants to be you.

However, if this developer wants more than a couple hundred people playing their game, they're going to need to make the game a bit more appealing to all the people who believe that the main point of a game is to be fun.

[Chibbity]

I mean this in the nicest way, but most of your issues are with the fundamental idea of the game and what it's trying to be; I don't think it's a good game for you.

The few other things, are simply Early Access issues, with bugs and lack of polish; but that's to be expected.

[dustin1280]

1. This is entirely a skill issue. But the biggest tip I can offer here is buy all the suppressors and suppress every weapon you can.
See this topic for a ton of beginner tips:
https://steamcommunity.com/app/2828860/discussions/0/4839771250826658495/#c4839771250826703732

2. Again, entirely a skill issue... But as you progress the game you get access to better rigs when can hold more then 1 large loot. Also you can upgrade you rig with "high quality" storage containers to double your weight limit.

3. Honestly almost everything you are complaining about comes down to the fact that you are not very skilled at this game...
If you stalk the drone in question and let the enemies kill it, you can then usually run in and loot it.

4, If you uses a magnifying scope, you need better gun parts to make that useful, better off using a red dot sight like the "spook sight"

5. I have never seen this happen in my 50+ hours of playing this game. So extremely rare bug I guess.

6. While this game does have SOME movement issues, you can usually disengage fairly easily as long as you hide behind terrain objects on you way out... The idea is to get out of sight asap. --This also comes down to a skill issue I am afraid...

The bottom line is this, I don't think you have the mindset or the skillset to play this game and you should probably move on. I am not trying to be an ass but it's just very apparent you are not equipped for a game like this...

[Diarmuhnd]

Originally posted by Vorelisk:

I can't wait for 50 people to tell me how trash and stupid I am ...
...
...
However, if this developer wants more than a couple hundred people playing their game, they're going to need to make the game a bit more appealing to all the people who believe that the main point of a game is to be fun.

Your not "trash and stupid". Not at all.
But your feedback will be important to the devs and the rest of us players if its helpful and not just angry ranting.

So thanks for the feedback from me, just an old man with a cat who's a player. Nothing mroe important than that.

I like FW, and I don't seem to have your issues/bugs , but I hope yours get addressed.

It is early access, crossing my fingers it doesn't take as long as Kenshi, Rimworld, Project Zomboid and many others to get better and better.

Good luck, have fun.

edit: I'm no 'elite gamer' but i've managed to get more than enough water and loot to make money with with a little fast farming. I sort of learned the route by accident after a few tries and exploring the maps. There's a few youTube tutorials/guides if you need the info.

[Not Quite Dead]

All i have to complain about was walking 50 feet out of spawn, jumping on a 1 foot high rock the width of a shed, getting permanently stuck on it(which was wild this was a very tame boring flat rock) and dying 30 seconds later to a mech.

That was 1 in maybe 8 games I've done so far.

[dustin1280]

Originally posted by Not Quite Dead:

All i have to complain about was walking 50 feet out of spawn, jumping on a 1 foot high rock the width of a shed, getting permanently stuck on it(which was wild this was a very tame boring flat rock) and dying 30 seconds later to a mech.

That was 1 in maybe 8 games I've done so far.

Valid complaint... my biggest two complaints about this game are:
1. get stuck on janky terrain
2. enemies spawning on top of me

[Vorelisk]

Originally posted by dustin1280:

1. This is entirely a skill issue. But the biggest tip I can offer here is buy all the suppressors and suppress every weapon you can.
See this topic for a ton of beginner tips:
https://steamcommunity.com/app/2828860/discussions/0/4839771250826658495/#c4839771250826703732

2. Again, entirely a skill issue... But as you progress the game you get access to better rigs when can hold more then 1 large loot. Also you can upgrade you rig with "high quality" storage containers to double your weight limit.

3. Honestly almost everything you are complaining about comes down to the fact that you are not very skilled at this game...
If you stalk the drone in question and let the enemies kill it, you can then usually run in and loot it.

4, If you uses a magnifying scope, you need better gun parts to make that useful, better off using a red dot sight like the "spook sight"

5. I have never seen this happen in my 50+ hours of playing this game. So extremely rare bug I guess.

6. While this game does have SOME movement issues, you can usually disengage fairly easily as long as you hide behind terrain objects on you way out... The idea is to get out of sight asap. --This also comes down to a skill issue I am afraid...

The bottom line is this, I don't think you have the mindset or the skillset to play this game and you should probably move on. I am not trying to be an ass but it's just very apparent you are not equipped for a game like this...

I refuse to accept that not being able to engage and kill groups of 10+ gun-wielding enemies with the starting gun and ammo is a "skill issue." Make a new character and post a video of you doing this. However, I have not been using a suppressor, so this I will definitely test.

What kind of counter-point is "you are not very skilled at the game" when the entire point I'm here making is that I've just started and can't progress at the very beginning of the game? Yes, I'm not good at all: an incredible deduction. But I need a few millimeters of breathing room to make progress and get there.

With regards to the gun inaccuracy, I understand the idea of having the guns become more accurate with progress, but having the starting accuracy of assault rifle weapons be that of a blunderbuss makes no sense.

Your attitude that everything is a skill issue at the very beginning of a game before a player has had any ability to make meaningful progress is brain rot. If you think it's fun for a game to be mechanically incompetent as part of the difficulty, then that's your valid opinion, but I vehemently disagree.

[RiccTheThicc]

As some people have said before, I think you might not be interested in the fundamental idea of this game. There's nothing wrong with that at all, sometimes a game just doesn't vibe with your play-style, but changing your perspective might lead you to enjoy the game a lot more. At it's core TFW is a stealth game, not a shooter.

You can only engage with a few enemies at a time by design; you're meant to try and avoid conflict as much as possible in a world where everything can and will kill you. Your guns are more of a last resort to use when you have no other viable options.

For something like the drone parts quest, I think this quest was given early to teach the player that they need to engage with the game on these terms. You can't kill that drone on your own, it's just not feasible. Instead you're forced to wait around the outskirts of a battle, doing your best not to be killed and trying to make your way in to grab the scraps left behind when the opportunity presents itself.


All that being said, there are still quite a few things in the game that need improvement, and it's good to discuss those things in an early access title.

I've not experienced the bug with being flung into the air, and that sounds extremely frustrating.

The terrain collision definitely needs work. You get stuck on the smallest of things to the point where it feels like you've just hit an invisible wall, and I've found in a few situations I quite literally have.

These kinds of comments and bug reports are a necessary part of early access, but it seems like their presence is ruining the experience of the game for you. There's nothing wrong with not wanting to deal with frustrating bugs that take away from game-play, nobody does really, but if it takes away from your experience enough that you don't enjoy the game, early access probably just isn't your cup of tea.

If that is the case, I would say don't give up on the game just yet, especially if you feel like you could really enjoy it in a more polished state.
As the saying goes, if it's not fun, why bother? I think you should give the game another go after it's been fully released and see if you have a better experience.

[Vorelisk]

Originally posted by Chibbity:

I mean this in the nicest way, but most of your issues are with the fundamental idea of the game and what it's trying to be; I don't think it's a good game for you.

The few other things, are simply Early Access issues, with bugs and lack of polish; but that's to be expected.

I don't think that's entirely true.

I understand that the player is supposed to be vulnerable, exposed, and weak compared to most enemies on the battlefield, at least at the beginning. I understand that this is not a power fantasy game, and the player character is not meant to feel agile and strong.

But I am taking issue with the struggle to just turn around and run away, or not get stuck on floor terrain, or loot a single item and extract, or engage a few weak enemies with the tools provided at the beginning of the game.

I think it's important to refer back to my original closing point as well, that every game needs an audience, and a game so janky and difficult that it isn't fun for 99% of people is going to have problems.

[Draescan]

Originally posted by Vorelisk:

I refuse to accept that not being able to engage and kill groups of 10+ gun-wielding enemies with the starting gun and ammo is a "skill issue." Make a new character and post a video of you doing this. However, I have not been using a suppressor, so this I will definitely test.

Before this gets out of hand, please let me clarify, the skill issue ( Hate that wording it's too hostile and makes people get defensive ) isn't that you're not able to handle 10+ enemies, it's that you're trying to fight 10+ enemies at all. Be an opportunist. You're not a rat, you're a trap door spider. Don't just sit still cause that's not good for you, but read the fights going on around you, when you notice everyone is distracted, that's the time to start looting, just don't get too close.

If you need drone parts, watch the drones, see where they fall, the SECOND you notice people aren't near them and you have an opening, hit it and run. Don't even look what's inside just hit " loot all " and dip, you'll either get the part or not regardless and you don't have time to wait and see what's in it.

If you need to shoot, try to do so while leaning out from cover, it doesn't help much, but it does help. However, especially early game don't shoot anything that isn't already fighting something else unless you absolutely 100% must. It's not worth it. So to conclude, not being able to fight all those enemies isn't the problem, it's thinking you're supposed to in the first place.

[Vorelisk]

Originally posted by RiccTheThicc:

As some people have said before, I think you might not be interested in the fundamental idea of this game. There's nothing wrong with that at all, sometimes a game just doesn't vibe with your play-style, but changing your perspective might lead you to enjoy the game a lot more. At it's core TFW is a stealth game, not a shooter.

You can only engage with a few enemies at a time by design; you're meant to try and avoid conflict as much as possible in a world where everything can and will kill you.

For something like the drone parts quest, I think this quest was given early to teach the player that they need to engage with the game on these terms. You can't kill that drone on your own, it's just not feasible. Instead you're forced to wait around the outskirts of a battle, doing your best not to be killed and trying to make your way in to grab the scraps left behind when the opportunity presents itself.


All that being said, there are still quite a few things in the game that need improvement, and it's good to discuss those things in an early access title.

I've not experienced the bug with being flung into the air, and that sounds extremely frustrating.

The terrain collision definitely needs work. You get stuck on the smallest of things to the point where it feels like you've just hit an invisible wall, and I've found in a few situations I quite literally have.

These kinds of comments and bug reports are a necessary part of early access, but it seems like their presence is ruining the experience of the game for you. There's nothing wrong with not wanting to deal with frustrating bugs that take away from game-play, nobody does really, but if it takes away from your experience enough that you don't enjoy the game, early access probably just isn't your cup of tea.

If that is the case, I would say don't give up on the game just yet, especially if you feel like you could really enjoy it in a more polished state.
As the saying goes, if it's not fun, why bother? I think you should give the game another go after it's been fully released and see if you have a better experience.

I appreciate your thoughtful and respectful reply.

I hesitate to accept that the game fundamentally isn't for me. I am fine with sneaking around. I am fine with being very judicious in picking manageable firefights. I am fine with retreating rather than fighting.

However, I have died multiple times trying to get a single drone part, because even when I let enemies kill the drone for me and then try to loot it after they've moved on, enemies will spawn right next to me or a group I don't know has come behind me (because the game has no audio design to have you be aware of enemy movement) will kill me.

I'm not going to give up on the game, but I hope the developer re-evaluates what the game's sources of difficulty currently are and what they would like those sources to be.

[ᛈᚢᛒᚲᚱᚨᛚᚱ13]

Originally posted by Draescan:

Originally posted by Vorelisk:

I refuse to accept that not being able to engage and kill groups of 10+ gun-wielding enemies with the starting gun and ammo is a "skill issue." Make a new character and post a video of you doing this. However, I have not been using a suppressor, so this I will definitely test.

Before this gets out of hand, please let me clarify, the skill issue ( Hate that wording it's too hostile and makes people get defensive ) isn't that you're not able to handle 10+ enemies, it's that you're trying to fight 10+ enemies at all. Be an opportunist. You're not a rat, you're a trap door spider. Don't just sit still cause that's not good for you, but read the fights going on around you, when you notice everyone is distracted, that's the time to start looting, just don't get too close.

If you need drone parts, watch the drones, see where they fall, the SECOND you notice people aren't near them and you have an opening, hit it and run. Don't even look what's inside just hit " loot all " and dip, you'll either get the part or not regardless and you don't have time to wait and see what's in it.

If you need to shoot, try to do so while leaning out from cover, it doesn't help much, but it does help. However, especially early game don't shoot anything that isn't already fighting something else unless you absolutely 100% must. It's not worth it. So to conclude, not being able to fight all those enemies isn't the problem, it's thinking you're supposed to in the first place.

Exactly this. You're not MEANT to be taking on 10+ enemies at the beginning of the game. In fact, it's best to avoid them entirely, and yes, it is very possible to do so. Yeah, you're going to get busted from time to time, but that's the nature of the game - how fun would it be if there was no danger of this happening?

I can tell you with 100% certainty, mainly because I recently crossed this threshold myself, that once you get certain weapons and loadouts, and learn techniques like corner pulling, you will EASILY be taking on groups of enemies, even if you suck at FPS like I do. Until then, yes - make use of suppressors, stick to the shadows, pull one group then switch to shotgun, hide around a corner, plug 'em as they come around. You'll be surprised how effective this is.

Movement is a valid complaint. I appreciate what they're going for - I know and accept that we're not supposed to be trained soldiers, and are carrying around ridiculously oversized backpacks, so I enjoy the fact that you can't sprint around, turn on a dime, strafe at lightning speed, etc - that's exactly what it's supposed to be. That said, however, the tendency to get snagged on insignificant bits of terrain is something that most definitely needs to be addressed, hopefully sooner rather than later.

As has been said a million times, that's all part of the EA experience. We buy into it knowing full well that these issues will exist, and because we've made that agreement, it's up to us to provide feedback in a measured, appropriate way.

[Vorelisk]

Originally posted by Draescan:

Originally posted by Vorelisk:

I refuse to accept that not being able to engage and kill groups of 10+ gun-wielding enemies with the starting gun and ammo is a "skill issue." Make a new character and post a video of you doing this. However, I have not been using a suppressor, so this I will definitely test.

Before this gets out of hand, please let me clarify, the skill issue ( Hate that wording it's too hostile and makes people get defensive ) isn't that you're not able to handle 10+ enemies, it's that you're trying to fight 10+ enemies at all. Be an opportunist. You're not a rat, you're a trap door spider. Don't just sit still cause that's not good for you, but read the fights going on around you, when you notice everyone is distracted, that's the time to start looting, just don't get too close.

If you need drone parts, watch the drones, see where they fall, the SECOND you notice people aren't near them and you have an opening, hit it and run. Don't even look what's inside just hit " loot all " and dip, you'll either get the part or not regardless and you don't have time to wait and see what's in it.

If you need to shoot, try to do so while leaning out from cover, it doesn't help much, but it does help. However, especially early game don't shoot anything that isn't already fighting something else unless you absolutely 100% must. It's not worth it. So to conclude, not being able to fight all those enemies isn't the problem, it's thinking you're supposed to in the first place.

I appreciate the sincere and helpful reply.

I am not trying to fight 10 enemies at once, ever, but I have ended up in that situation many times from enemies spawning on top of me or walking up behind me with no audio.

But I will definitely follow all this advice as I continue to play. Thank you!

[Draescan]

Originally posted by Vorelisk:

enemies will spawn right next to me or a group I don't know has come behind me (because the game has no audio design to have you be aware of enemy movement) will kill me.

Just so you know it's not just you, I adore the game and this is my biggest bugbear with it. I'm hoping audio in general will get a much needed touch up as soon as they're able, but I understand they have a lot of game to finish here and it's going to take time. Priorities and all that.

[Vorelisk]

Originally posted by ᛈᚢᛒᚲᚱᚨᛚᚱ13:

Originally posted by Draescan:

Before this gets out of hand, please let me clarify, the skill issue ( Hate that wording it's too hostile and makes people get defensive ) isn't that you're not able to handle 10+ enemies, it's that you're trying to fight 10+ enemies at all. Be an opportunist. You're not a rat, you're a trap door spider. Don't just sit still cause that's not good for you, but read the fights going on around you, when you notice everyone is distracted, that's the time to start looting, just don't get too close.

If you need drone parts, watch the drones, see where they fall, the SECOND you notice people aren't near them and you have an opening, hit it and run. Don't even look what's inside just hit " loot all " and dip, you'll either get the part or not regardless and you don't have time to wait and see what's in it.

If you need to shoot, try to do so while leaning out from cover, it doesn't help much, but it does help. However, especially early game don't shoot anything that isn't already fighting something else unless you absolutely 100% must. It's not worth it. So to conclude, not being able to fight all those enemies isn't the problem, it's thinking you're supposed to in the first place.

Exactly this. You're not MEANT to be taking on 10+ enemies at the beginning of the game. In fact, it's best to avoid them entirely, and yes, it is very possible to do so. Yeah, you're going to get busted from time to time, but that's the nature of the game - how fun would it be if there was no danger of this happening?

I can tell you with 100% certainty, mainly because I recently crossed this threshold myself, that once you get certain weapons and loadouts, and learn techniques like corner pulling, you will EASILY be taking on groups of enemies, even if you suck at FPS like I do. Until then, yes - make use of suppressors, stick to the shadows, pull one group then switch to shotgun, hide around a corner, plug 'em as they come around. You'll be surprised how effective this is.

Movement is a valid complaint. I appreciate what they're going for - I know and accept that we're not supposed to be trained soldiers, and are carrying around ridiculously oversized backpacks, so I enjoy the fact that you can't sprint around, turn on a dime, strafe at lightning speed, etc - that's exactly what it's supposed to be. That said, however, the tendency to get snagged on insignificant bits of terrain is something that most definitely needs to be addressed, hopefully sooner rather than later.

As has been said a million times, that's all part of the EA experience. We buy into it knowing full well that these issues will exist, and because we've made that agreement, it's up to us to provide feedback in a measured, appropriate way.

Thank you for the sincere reply. As stated above, I have never attempted to take on 10+ enemies, but that has happened often from enemies spawning or walking up behind me without audio.

It sounds like not using a suppressor (I didn't know I had access to them yet) may be a huge make or break, so I will definitely be doing that.

I will try to play like even more of a rat than I have been. Thanks for your advice.

[Draescan]

Originally posted by Vorelisk:

Thank you!

No problem! Good luck!