M10 thoughts. (COOP)

[Peppr]

EDIT; M10 has now been nerfed and he's much, MUCH more enjoyable to fight. Big thank you to all the developers and community moderators for listening to the community!

[risbolla]

i dont know hell bot isnt that bad i think the big hen is probably harder

[Juno Brier]

Originally posted by risbolla:

i dont know hell bot isnt that bad i think the big hen is probably harder

I don't recall the chicken being nearly impossible to do more than 1 damage at a time on.

[Ayzl]

Casual needs to be Casual.

[Peppr]

Originally posted by risbolla:

i dont know hell bot isnt that bad i think the big hen is probably harder

M10 definitely is much, much harder. Haruo on hyper is a struggle, but it's it's still a fun fight and you can make some real progress with luck and smart play.

M10 on hyper is like smashing your head against a brick wall for 60+ turns, since you can only deal 1 damage to him unless you break his 5 stacks of protect (which come back in 5 turns btw) also you take any damage you deal to him.

Also he can heal, roll 7s, nerf your stats while buffing his own, and straight up Solid Witch so he takes 0 damage (so frustrating when he uses Solid Witch into the next stack of protect)

[Drizzle]

Originally posted by Peppr:

M10 definitely is much, much harder. Haruo on hyper is a struggle, but it's it's still a fun fight and you can make some real progress with luck and smart play.

M10 on hyper is like smashing your head against a brick wall for 60+ turns, since you can only deal 1 damage to him unless you break his 5 stacks of protect (which come back in 5 turns btw) also you take any damage you deal to him.

Also he can heal, roll 7s, nerf your stats while buffing his own, and straight up Solid Witch so he takes 0 damage (so frustrating when he uses Solid Witch into the next stack of protect)

There are ways to deal more than 1 damage when robo has protect on

[SomeGuy712x]

I hate how EMP is a 2-turn Out of Ammo, even for players who didn't take damage due to already being KO'd. And, I've seen it use EMP rapidly enough to prevent us from using any cards at all for several turns. Also, I don't like how the Attack Down, Defense Down, and Evasion Down debuffs last for 2 turns as well, and it feels like they last longer than they should for the players too. In addition, if the boss uses the same Down card consecutively, the buffs the boss receives stack, and you can end up with stuff like this:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1747567588
Oh, and if it uses Engage afterwards:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1747568264
RIP Suguri.

So, I think it would be better if all of those effects lasted only 1 turn instead, and if the boss couldn't stack buffs like that.

[Drizzle]

Seems normal

[Peppr]

Originally posted by Yuuri:

My idea to beat him is to have 2 attackers: Kae and Peat w/ Fury (to attack twice with Blue Crow after he loses his shields)
Other 2 can be a Defense and Support Fernet (since fernet can chew M10 armor even with -1 ATK)

I don't want to start an argument but with that lineup, it can work if you think about it.

Hm. Please try that and let us know how it goes on Hyper.

[RedSage]

Went to turn 58 against it on Extreme and WON...wasn't great obviously, but hey, it was one HELL of a ride. But yeah, he's super annoying. Not sure how I beat it twice in my first two games on the first day M10 was out, and now can barely beat it.

[risbolla]

Originally posted by Peppr:

Originally posted by risbolla:

i dont know hell bot isnt that bad i think the big hen is probably harder

M10 definitely is much, much harder. Haruo on hyper is a struggle, but it's it's still a fun fight and you can make some real progress with luck and smart play.

M10 on hyper is like smashing your head against a brick wall for 60+ turns, since you can only deal 1 damage to him unless you break his 5 stacks of protect (which come back in 5 turns btw) also you take any damage you deal to him.

Also he can heal, roll 7s, nerf your stats while buffing his own, and straight up Solid Witch so he takes 0 damage (so frustrating when he uses Solid Witch into the next stack of protect)

ok but have you tried using shifu robot though

[Peppr]

Originally posted by risbolla:

ok but have you tried using shifu robot though

I have. Mil Sora too, but she gets screwed by Currents and Robo Laser.

[Shade]

Thoughts after having played some more games against M10 (some on Extreme, some on Hyper difficulty):

• Imaginary Numbers is by far the most ridiculously overpowered ability in M10's arsenal. It's bad enough that it effectively makes him invincible while also virtually guaranteeing that every player running into him (or a boss panel) dies - so who thought it was a good idea to make it last two full turns on top of that?
  
• If M10 decides to stick two or more Health Downs in his deck you pretty much just lose, period. There's just no realistic way to withstand the constant onslaught of inevitable damage M10 dishes out when all players have a mere 2 max HP. It doesn't help that having 2 max HP completely prevents low level Guardians from distributing shields.
  
• M10's Solid Witch lasts longer than it should.
  What I mean by this is that, if M10 uses Solid Witch on one turn and then, say, Engage on the next, M10 will still be invincible during that battle even though a full turn has passed by that point. Miusaki can't use Solid Witch and then Gentleman's Battle or Ambush next turn while still being invincible, so why can M10?
  
• Attack Down / Defense Down / Evasion Down also buffing M10's own stats is just excessive, especially since they all last two turns and M10 can also combine or even stack them. Attack Down and Defense Down is a particularly nasty combination.
  I feel that if the boss also getting a buff in the same stat is to stay, both the buffs and debuffs should only last a single turn rather than two.
  
• Effects like Health Down or EMP probably shouldn't affect KO'd players.
  Haruo has a couple of really nasty cards of her own, like Hen Peck or Beak of the Godbird, but almost all of them can be avoided by simply not being withhin range. M10's abilities, however, are not only far more devastating to begin with, they almost all just flat-out affect the entire board. There's no counter-play to them. If M10 picks an unfortunate set of cards, literally the only thing you can do about it is to have a Sweet Breaker or Manager in your team who has their hyper ready at all times - and even that doesn't work if they have the audacity to get KO'd or M10 EMPs you beforehand (unless you draw enough hypers to also block all EMPs).
  
• Recovery Mode (aside from being broken with regard to Warp Panels) probably shouldn't heal M10 in the same turn that he uses it in. Again, there's just no counter-play. If M10 decides to stick two or more Recovery Modes in his deck, it becomes virtually impossible to outpace his healing given that there's almost no way to deal more than 1 damage at a time, especially on Hyper difficulty where you basically spend half the game inevitably KOing yourself with Reflect damage.

So yeah. As far as I'm concerned, M10 needs some serious toning down. He's beatable, yeah - sometimes. If he picks unfortunate combinations of abilities there's currently very little you can do about it.

[MrFailology]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1747723452

Really friggin insane run, we got a very calm early game and lots of more fair card plays from M10 in the late game. Can't believe it, honestly.

Thoughts: Personally I think the Hyper map makes this boss play best because it's small enough and laid out in a way that allows for a lot more strategy and counterplay of M10's abilities on the player's end but, outside of the Hyper map, countering and playing around a lot of M10's abilities is just too much luck. Card effects last too long(stat debuffs and EMP especially) is my party's biggest complaint, it feels like M10 does so much at once it feels impossible to keep up with what's going on, let alone keeping track of it all and trying to play around it. Just not enough room to fight back against him. I really would say though that, on the Hyper map specifically, if you reduce most/all of the card effects to last 1 chapter instead of 2 then this boss would be near perfect.

Some stuff for Hyper I want to share:

• You can still deplete stacks of Protect while M10 is Solid Witch'd while not taking Reflective shield damage(since M10 doesn't take damage when you attack him) so, if given the opportunity, go after him while he has Protect and Solid Witch up. It changed our game a lot.
  
• Yuki's Gamble pierces M10's Protect stack and hits for his HP directly but you will take Reflective damage as a result(it also pierces Yuki through, meaning Yuki(or the user) will die if Gamble hits M10. You can avoid dying to this if you Gamble successfully after M10 uses Health Down and Yuki's current HP is higher than her Max HP.
  
• Know when you can or can't go after M10's Protect stacks. It's pointless to attack him and take damage if he has 4 Protect stacks left and he is going to regen them next turn, go after Stars or Cards instead to work on norma or setting up your attackers. Stay coordinated with your team and count out how many stacks you can take out and in what order!
  
  

[22050hz amen break sample]

hyper m10 is insane
it's like, really hard

[Asmis]

Originally posted by risbolla:

ok but have you tried using shifu robot though

but what if I want to play a fair and balanced character, unlike OP Shifu Robot