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It is the neuonce of how the story is told that matters.
Nickles: I'd say Permutation City is about what constitutes humanity and the things you mention are subplots, although I don't recall those issues about economics and classes since nearly all permutants where very wealthy people when "alive". Here is why I think it's the main plot: most permutants change their "neuronal structure" by having things they thought was limitating removed and other things added, thus questioning what it is to be human and if they still are despite being million years old permutant. And there is the question of solipsism too (although it exists for humans too on a different level): since they are in a virtual world, should they reach the "real" world, or go on living their immoratl lives without contact.
To be more precise about my stance of plagiarism, here are the points I find very similar. In both stories:
-People get numerised in order to survive.
-It then ask what it takes to be human.
-People kill themselves when numerised, in order to only have one version of them existing. (if you recall permutation city, the inventor of the numerisation process kills himself by openning wide his stomac, like he was giving a birth).
-Numerised peope are then send to space in order to survive longer (I mean... This precise point is a very similar plotwist I think)
-There is a wonderfull city in the numerised world.
Story point that differs:
-It's underwater (which is not so bad as an idea: it feels lonely, alien and isolate, so feets in the theme)
-There is this "gel" that give organisms mutation (not so interesting idea since it's déja vu 10 000 times in games and B horror movies and lack the novelty of the other themes and ideas)
My embarrassement comes from the lack of credit they give to Greg Egan since they own him big time in my opinion.
-People are continually asking themselves what it takes/means to be human. As demonstrated by philosophical musings that go back to the beginnings of and probably stretch well past the beginnings of recorded histroy.
-Would not be a surprising outcome for two reasons. The first being the psychological tole from suddenly realizing there are simply two of you and for the original the thought of living in a desolate hellscape for the rest of their lives while their copy lives it up in virtual paradise, probably not the best incentive to go on living.
-Also hardly a new concept in scifi, the first thing that comes to mind are two eppisodes of Startrek:TNG where they encounter probes containing the digitized conciousnesses/memoires of an alien civilisation that had been somehow doomed to extinction. To which I am willing to bet if I bothered looking, I would find many more examples that predate those. It also makes some level of sense both from a technological standpoint and as a plot macguffin. Geologcially speaking planets are pretty volitile, they also make pretty big targets.
-What would you expect in the digital utopia, a second tormented hellscape?
I mean maybe Greg Egan should be thanking the writers of Startrek for the whole digitising the remains of a civilisation and launching them into space schtick. Or, maybe we can realize that everything that can be done, has been done and enjoy the story/ride without trying to play a the "X did it first" game becuse we are to a point where there will always be a W.
I am no lawyer but in my mind the difference between being inspired by something and copying it resides in the amount of similarities.
As you said, since no idea might ever be new, it's the way those ideas are assembled that make a piece of art unique and here they are assembled in a very similar fashion.
What's so surprising about players having LITERALLY NO CLUE about the authors because the majority of those players never read any books?
It's not just Egan as they said, I'm clearly seeing Peter Watts influence with his Starfish and Rifters trilogy.
As well as China Mieville with his Embassytown (far less though, but still I can understand why they've mentioned it).
Anyway the game utilizes a very tiny amount of the ideas they could borrow from all those authors. It's actually pretty disappointing to me. I mean the plot is decent but nothing that remarkable after all.
Heck, sections of Ken Macleod's "Stone Canal", Stross's "Glasshouse", or the famous "I have no mouth and I must scream" and of course any of Philip K ♥♥♥♥'s. stories tread over the same ground, and with far more sense of horror. It's an old trope going back to the 60's.
Frankly, I don't find SOMA very Egan'y at all, it's got far too much closeness to the characters, while Egan likes his detachment.
What's so surprising about players having LITERALLY NO CLUE about the authors because the majority of those players never read any books?
Sorry, it was poorly written, what I meant is that Frictionnal Games DOES have clue and since the majority of their players might not, it felt only fair to source their work more loudly since they own those sources for the quality I found in the game and it's story.
I've never red Peter Watts, but you got me curious ! What "ideas" would you say they take from him ?
About the deception, it felt like they were doing "light" Egan stuff in some regards.
erekose_handy:
Yes, Diaspora, might be ! Not yet available in french, so I'm a bit scared to try it in english, but The Wang's Carpet defeinitly had this idea of space capsule with digitalised people in it !
Thanks for all those "sources", will definitly check. As for the trope going back to the 60's, I beleive one of the first novel about it is The Invention Of Morel, which I definitly recommend, and well, about the idea of solipsism, I guess it goes back all the way down to Gorgias and maybe before.
About the closeness to character, I didn't find them more close than Egan's one, I'm even tempted to say the contrary since it's pleasanter to identify with smart detached Egan's character than Simon The Mongrel ; )
"YOUUUU LIEEEEDDDD TO MEEEEE GNNNN..."
Yeap, glad I'm not the only one who got Rifter vibes while playing. Starfish is one of my favorite novels, I reread it every couple of years.
Underwater stuff is an illustration to Watts' Starfish. It's a trilogy - Starfish, Maelstrom, Behemoth. Starts with a crew of genetically modified rifters so they could live underwater and maintain their geothermal station. Starfish is probably one of the most depressing books I've read and it has thick dark and claustrophobic atmosphere around mentally unstable crew of rifters. It develops into a catastrophic turn of events including "malfunctioning" AI smart gels (WAU looks pretty similar honestly), pandemic, etc.
It's pretty clear that Starfish is #1 source of visuals in SOMA.
Blindsight is completely different, it's the best first contact (alien ship called Rorschach) story I've ever seen full of details about self-awareness, consciousness, neurology, etc. It's so complex it makes something like Prometheus movie look like a pile of ♥♥♥♥ for ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ (which is probably actually true).
https://twitter.com/frictionalgames/status/638302799596548097
They've also mentioned China Mieville and I'm pretty sure it's about Embassytown book. It's more about linguistics and developing relationships between aliens and humans. It's not connected to SOMA in any way but Mieville's stuff is unique and I can see why they would mention him together with Egan and Watts since it's all hard sci-fi about self awareness more or less. China Mieville is using specific humans as a part of alien language, amazing stuff.
It looks like they've tried to recreate Lenie Clarke as Catherine Chun in Soma. Some part about her being an ideal victim and being autistic and distant from the other crew was ringing the bell for me. Sadly that part wasn't developed in the game and it just ends without following Lenie's path of revenge or something like that.
Great, thank you very much Solomon, I guess I will begin with Blindsight, in order not to be too depressed !
About the way Soma digest it's inspirations, it indeed felt like they throw those great ideas without milking them. I think that the Wau and gel part was really weak and/or underdeveloped. At list for the digitalising stuff I could rely on my reading of Egan to complete the gap.
And again, it feels more and more like Frictional copy/paste 50% Egan, 50% Watts, and the only new thing they bring to the table is the fact that it's a video game.
At this point I think they should hire a writer to bring original stuff or hire Egan/watts since it really ask the question of the copyright. That could be a solution.