Megastructures!

[Eggothy]

By the time I usually build one, I already own at least 1/4 of the galaxy and maxed out my tech, and at that point the Sensor Array is the only one that provides something that I can't get with more territory. I think there should be a few other Megastructurs that provide a similiar level of utility, and here are a few I think would do that.

1: A super weapon of some sort.

2: A giant fortress that has an FTL net that expands across several solar systems, pulling in any enemy fleets that jump into a system within its radius. This suits the playstyle of someone looking to build megastructures, and fixes the problem of military stations losing value in the late game.

3: A giant space port. It just builds ships really fast, maybe gives a discound, and greatly reduces the upkeep costs of fleets in orbit (or maybe you can have them docked like armies)


What are people's thoughts/suggestions on Megastructures? If this hasn't been done already, I'd be down to collaborate on a mod.

[Briggs]

Look into the gigastructures mod. There are things that also add 40\% to armor, and 12\% to shield and armor. Stacking. Also, don't underestimate the power of a ringworld. 25 tile worlds are great since they are the most efficient. Unless you're playing with mods, there aren't a lot of those in a galaxy.

Also, even if you have tech at max, you can still get repeat tech that can make your fleets truly OP without increasing the maintenance cost or fleet size.

[NixBoxDone]

Megastructures allow you to be the biggest dog in the pound without having to conquer a quarter of the galaxy.

In my latest game my empire is positively tiny, but as all 15 core sector systems are either filled with habitats or 4 section ringworlds, I'm still able to field a fleet of about 700 to 800 k by the time the end game crisis comes knocking.

They're the alternative to expanding aggressively. ^^

Edith: Just in case: I'd absolutely love more mega structures. Just saying they aren't really meant for the situation you are in - they're mostly for landlocked empires with very restrictive war protocols, so they can build up without having to hope that a devouring swarm just happens to live nearby in systems they'd want.

[Cebertus]

yeah like someone said megastructures arent meant for a situation like yours, i recently played a MP Game with a friend where i was a small little empire, i had like 9 Core Systems when the end game crisis hit, but could support a similar fleet like my friend who had conquered a quarter of the galaxy.

The earlier you get your mega structures the better. Spamming tons of habitats can make you very strong in science, and depending how early you get them they can make you OP. A science nexus can double your science output. If you play only one planet he can quadruple it.

But yeah more megastructures would be great and im sure they will bring them. Opening up the ascension perks in the next big update indicates they want to add more ascension perks in the feature. A new set of galactic wonders is possible, something like a superweaon set. Maybe a giant laser mounted on top of a star like a dyson sphere, which when charged up could destroy a planet anywhere in the galaxy, it would bring some tension into the game like atomic weapons in a Civilization game.


About your point 3.:

In the Dev Diary Paradox speaks about upcomming changes, where spaceports on planets are only for civilian ships, like science and construction ships. Military Ships are build in Starbases which can support up to 6 Shipyards(or many other modules) which would allow you to build 6 ships in parallell.


https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/dev-diary-91-starbases.1052064/

[Salami Tsunami]

I think that megastructures should be available to the player sooner. (Maybe third perk instead of fourth?). Because even with rushing unity and abusing the assist research boost, I still have most of the galaxy paying tribute to me by the time I can built megastructures. The megastructures themselves aren't even terribly useful.

The Dyson Sphere is wildly cost prohibitive, and by the time you get access to it, there's no point having it. The only concievable benefit to it is that you can replace your planetary power plants with mines or research labs, but if you have the minerals to build a Dyson Sphere, you probably don't need more minerals. Every time I need energy, I find it easier to just make a few tributaries instead of spending the next twenty years building a big ball around a star.

The Science Nexus is nice, but again, it comes too late. By the time I have the perk and get it built, I'm already maxed out on all the tech that's useful to me.

And the Sentry Array. Probably the most practical of them. But by the time I can build it, I'm so powerful that the presence of enemy fleets is no longer relevant to my plans. So it's an expensive convenience at best.

The Ring World is pretty classy, but again, by the time you unlock it... Not to mention that if I want a ring world, I'll just steal one from a Fallen Empire instead.

In summary, these things would all be game changers if they could be accessed in the mid-game instead of the end-game, seeing as how they're of no use in the end game. Also, instead of requiring a full payment up front, I think it should consist of a (-x to minerals -x to influence, -x to energy) over the time that it's being built.

[NixBoxDone]

Yeah. I still think they should give access to some unique tech, a new ship type or a new building type - something that isn't just more resources.

At the moment it's much more flexible and cost effective to build a ringworld or dozens of habitats, especially since those give naval capacity on top of flexible resources. One might argue that those also penalize your research and unity, but by the time you can get enough habitats and ringworlds to meaningfully sabotage those, you'll likely hit repeatable tech / trash tradition territory anyways, so that drawback really isn't a huge issue.

They should offer you some type of unique reward outside of just a bunch of resources so it's always beneficial to take them first or over just more habitats.

I wouldn't say they're useless per se, just not the unique game changers we originally envisioned them as. So all that's necessary would be to start a timer similar to the dragons hoard that will let your scientists make a breakthrough previously thought impossible due to the unique advantage of having a functional dyson sphere/fully upgraded science nexus: maybe FE buildings, maybe a new ship type, upgraded mineral and research stations, 'I'd really be open to a lot here.

[Briggs]

I suggest the following:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1121692237
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1130165551
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=902204150
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=959094804

In that order.

[Cebertus]

Originally posted by Meat Baton:

The Science Nexus is nice, but again, it comes too late. By the time I have the perk and get it built, I'm already maxed out on all the tech that's useful to me.

Depending on your strategy, i started building my science nexus about 80 or 90 years after the start of the game, it basicly doubled my science output on the first stage alone. At that point i was close to starting the repeateble techs, and they were very important for that playthrough.

Rebalancing the Megastructures in the way you suggest it is a difficult topic. If they are a little bit easier to get they are instant must haves for all empires. At the moment they are the most worth for an empire that build tall, like they are suppused to be.

[Salami Tsunami]

Originally posted by Cebertus:

Originally posted by Meat Baton:

The Science Nexus is nice, but again, it comes too late. By the time I have the perk and get it built, I'm already maxed out on all the tech that's useful to me.

Depending on your strategy, i started building my science nexus about 80 or 90 years after the start of the game, it basicly doubled my science output on the first stage alone. At that point i was close to starting the repeateble techs, and they were very important for that playthrough.

Rebalancing the Megastructures in the way you suggest it is a difficult topic. If they are a little bit easier to get they are instant must haves for all empires. At the moment they are the most worth for an empire that build tall, like they are suppused to be.

So make them harder to get, but allow them to be accessed earlier. 80 to 90 years into the game, I have more minerals than I know what to do with. Right now it's not building the megastructures that's hard, it's just waiting for them to be unlocked.

Make megastructures cost more. A lot more. But make that cost a monthly bill instead of a one time payment. A -30 minerals per month for five years, for example.

[Cebertus]

Originally posted by Meat Baton:

Originally posted by Cebertus:

Depending on your strategy, i started building my science nexus about 80 or 90 years after the start of the game, it basicly doubled my science output on the first stage alone. At that point i was close to starting the repeateble techs, and they were very important for that playthrough.

Rebalancing the Megastructures in the way you suggest it is a difficult topic. If they are a little bit easier to get they are instant must haves for all empires. At the moment they are the most worth for an empire that build tall, like they are suppused to be.

So make them harder to get, but allow them to be accessed earlier. 80 to 90 years into the game, I have more minerals than I know what to do with. Right now it's not building the megastructures that's hard, it's just waiting for them to be unlocked.

Make megastructures cost more. A lot more. But make that cost a monthly bill instead of a one time payment. A -30 minerals per month for five years, for example.

Earlier then 80-90 years? That seems a little bit very early. I know terms like early mid and lategame arent always that precise, but i dont think megastructures should be an early game thing.

[Botji]

Originally posted by Cebertus:

Originally posted by Meat Baton:

The Science Nexus is nice, but again, it comes too late. By the time I have the perk and get it built, I'm already maxed out on all the tech that's useful to me.

Depending on your strategy, i started building my science nexus about 80 or 90 years after the start of the game, it basicly doubled my science output on the first stage alone. At that point i was close to starting the repeateble techs, and they were very important for that playthrough.

Rebalancing the Megastructures in the way you suggest it is a difficult topic. If they are a little bit easier to get they are instant must haves for all empires. At the moment they are the most worth for an empire that build tall, like they are suppused to be.

But the issue is still the same, 80-90 years is like 2/3 of the game, unless things go badly early on you are able to at least start to dominate the galaxy in 80-90 years and when 110-120 years have passed usually not many or no one is able to match you, kinda why most of my games dont go for much longer.

Even with Master builder perk a ringworld apparently takes 29 years to build, if you start to build one 80-90 years in it will be done when you are already out stomping on the galaxy completely unstoppable.

I havent played a new round in a bit now and the next one im going to try a harder difficulty but I just have a hard time to get motivated doing that, playing AI that simply gets advantages/cheats doesnt sound interesting but I guess it could make the game drag on for a bit longer.

[Salami Tsunami]

Originally posted by Cebertus:

Originally posted by Meat Baton:

So make them harder to get, but allow them to be accessed earlier. 80 to 90 years into the game, I have more minerals than I know what to do with. Right now it's not building the megastructures that's hard, it's just waiting for them to be unlocked.

Make megastructures cost more. A lot more. But make that cost a monthly bill instead of a one time payment. A -30 minerals per month for five years, for example.

Earlier then 80-90 years? That seems a little bit very early. I know terms like early mid and lategame arent always that precise, but i dont think megastructures should be an early game thing.

Megastructures should be available when they're useful to the player, not when they player has already established galactic dominance and needs something to spend resources on.

So by all means, if somebody wants to start building a ringworld 20 years into game, let them. Make it more expensive if you're concerned about balance. I'd rather pay double and have a science nexus in the mid game where it will actually benefit me in some way.

Come to think of it, the mid-end game could use some work. After you have the strongest fleet of any non-fallen empire, there's not much to do.

[Briggs]

Originally posted by Meat Baton:

Originally posted by Cebertus:

Earlier then 80-90 years? That seems a little bit very early. I know terms like early mid and lategame arent always that precise, but i dont think megastructures should be an early game thing.

Megastructures should be available when they're useful to the player, not when they player has already established galactic dominance and needs something to spend resources on.

So by all means, if somebody wants to start building a ringworld 20 years into game, let them. Make it more expensive if you're concerned about balance. I'd rather pay double and have a science nexus in the mid game where it will actually benefit me in some way.

Come to think of it, the mid-end game could use some work. After you have the strongest fleet of any non-fallen empire, there's not much to do.

There is lots to do...every ten years at least >_>