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As a whole tho I think the warband is really good. The henchies are not great (but which is?) but Zealots make decent MM/fighters and flaggellants are just plain cool. That said, the warriorpriest and Imperial Knights are very good heroes imo. The WH is also very good as compared to other YB type heroes I think his stat max thresholds are much better. In effect he's on par with 'regular' heroes imo. And the captain is solid.
So maybe not the best skills but a very good hero roster with vulnarable henchmen.
Trial by Pain is good. Burn the Witch is good (now that it cost 2OP + 1 SP) and paired along with Jaw Strike can neutrilize an enemy spellcaster. Fanatical Zeal is somewhat mediocre but at least it's cheap SP wise and hit chance is always welcome.
The passives are too situational. Witchfinder's Ward (should have a better bonus) is meh.. Ardent Cleansing is nice for a scout but requires more input into using it. Sigmars Sigil is actually cool only if you get targeted by damaging spells. If you get something like Chains of Chaos well... you'll think you'd be better with high magic resist instead :D
They're a very decent warband with lots of options in the Leader/Hero department. Henchies are... very straightforward and don't have much flexability in my opinion (think of skaven, they can have light dodge warpguards, parry heavy armour warpguards, ranged warpguards etc and don't get me started on merc henchies).
I like them. But I'd change their henchies to Novices as soon as I can. Or to a DLC henchie if we ever get one of them :D
I like the actives a bunch more than I thought I would tho now that I've messed with them a while. Trial is awsome. I use it on both hero and hench archers rather than crippling or vital, tho I could see an argument for either of the other with the high defence build I'm using trial just seems so good.
Fanatical is ok ish. I really only find room for it on a couple of henchmen. But it's nice for my archer hench who has more acc than ws for switching to melee. It could be prity nice if built for a crit build probly, saving you hit % when keeping the weapon skill low.
Burn the witch I thought was prity meh. But got it on a hench as well. Now I struggle not to take it, especially on 2 hander/duel hench's. Sure it's kind of situational, but since it stacks and dosn't cost you an attack it's prity handy to keep casters locked down. I could see not taking it with some builds for sure, but it's far handier than I originally thought. Probly not something I'd master exept maybe pvp tho.
The henchmen I think are really strong. Flagellants can make some real dodgy tanks, or hard hitting charge guys. The zelots make good archers, even if vengeance gets waisted. Im not to impressed with zelots in melee, but they can do ok'ish if doing a shoot and switch type of band. I feel like the flagellants are up there with the best hench's in the game...if you can keep them alive thru the first few lvls.
I should add that I think sigil of sig(the passive) would be prity ok too on the right build. I havn't used it tho.
Best henchies? With int 6? With only 2 variations of stat allocation: either high strength or toughness? They can't even go both since they can't even wield a sword to get parry limiting them to high agility all the time.
Best henchies with nearly everything limited in terms of customizing them? No armour, only amulet as a headslot (pendant is useless on them), very limited in weapon choice, not able to wear a shield.
They're the worst henchman in my book.
Take a look at a Darksoul:
Darksoul ---------------- Flagellant
Physical: 17 ---------------- Physical: 21
Strength: 6 / 15 ---------------- Strength: 3 / 12
Toughness: 3 / 12---------------- Toughness: 4 / 16
Agility: 3 / 12---------------- Agility: 3 / 15
Mental: 16 ---------------- Mental: 14
Leadership: 3 / 12 ---------------- Leadership: 5 / 15
Intelligence: 3 / 9 ---------------- Intelligence: 1 / 6
Alertness: 3 / 10 ---------------- Alertness: 3 / 12
Martial: 12 ---------------- Martial: 10
Weapon Skill: 3 / 12 ---------------- Weapon Skill: 3 / 12
Ballistic Skill: 3 / 3 ---------------- Ballistic Skill: 3 / 3
Accuracy: 3 / 15 ---------------- Accuracy: 5 / 14
The darksoul has absolutely the same passive. He has more starting points in Physical but gets less points. Although if we make both dodge tanks the darksoul only lacks 3 points in Agility but has 2 more points in strength. So basically the same.
The darksoul is smarter and can at least learn Knowledge: Mordheim. The flagellant can't even remember were his camp is.
Martial is basically the same. The 2 points that the Flagellant is lacking are already in Accuracy anyway.
But now lets look on the options that the darksoul has. He can be a 1h+shield parry heavy armour tank, he can be a 1h + shield cloth dodge tank, he can be a damage dealer with 14 strength + enough agility to dodge, he can be a dual wielding damage dealer with parry, etc.
The only drawback is that he cannot disengage from combat. So no Retreat from your leader. Hardly a big drawback anyway.
Seriously the flagellant is the most narrow henchman that is ever available to any warband as of now.
Does nothing to the fact that what he does do he does very well. Being immune to all Leadership tests while being able to Disengage is a huge bonus. Dark Souls just tend to get stuck in a combat that they can't hope to win, and can't reposition themselves after the fact. For a (non-Skaven) Henchman, Flagellant makes a very good Dodge Tank. And once the enemy has got them to low health, just disengage.
Should they have higher Intelligence and/or have access to Helmets (because their stun resist is abyssmal without Skills), I'd argue them to be perhaps the best Henchman there is. I'm seriously pondering whether I should start training a new crew with Books of Intelligence for K:Mordheim or not.
EDIT: My problem with Darksouls is that they do anything but shooting decently, but nothing well, which together with their tendency to die when engaged to wrong enemies an absolute pain to train.
Witchfinder's Ward isn't something I'd probably ever bother taking. Ardent Cleansing offers the same Wyrdstone resistance from the 2nd pick onwards with the added benefit of regaining SP.
Sigil of Sigmar is pretty good though, but somewhat undercut by the fact that WH hero and the Captain both have bonus to magic resistance and the TK is usually a parry/melee resist tank with a 1H weapon where any damage boost is somewhat wasted.
However, putting Sigil on Warrior Priests wielding 2H weapons is a decent idea, despite the likely 15% magic resist they'll have from Int. Melee Zealots are also a brilliant choice to give basic Sigil to. I like to RP my Flagellants in that they stay at 1 Int, but they can get the required minimum Int by sacrificing Leadership that they don't need, and can become real damage dealers if anyone is dumb enough to cast spells at them.
The Active skills OTOH are much better. Burn the Witch has already been praised sufficiently.
Trial by Pain can deal a lot of extra damage especially to 1H heroes and Impressives, or the mastered version can be used to prevent ranged heroes from switching weapons, combo that with sandwiching them so that they can't disengage and you've got yourself one super dead enemy. I think it's best used on the Captain, whom I use with Crossbow pistols dealing special shots at enemies.
Fanatical Zeal is also great for any henchman, especially now that the SP cost is 2, as that allows you to use Sidestep as well if you start in combat or charge in without spending SP. If you build the WH hero as a switch-hitter, which IMO is heavily suggested you should do, it can make up for quite a few points of Weapon Skill, and you can go from ranged crit dealing to melee crit dealing easily.
I max out agility on the Flags and build them as ambusher/dodge tank and it works well with skills like prowl and sidestep.
Zealots can get WS and BS of 12 so I use them as hybrids with bow and halberd. maxed out agility again and sidestep and avoid to make them into dodge tanks when they get into the fray, with the WP's prayer of resolution to boost dodge.
I use mastered trial by pain on my WHC and WH, both are built as hybrids. A good tactic is trial-by-pain, normal shot, switch weapons and go in hand to hand.
Best use for the DLC so far is to add two warrior priests to my mercs.
You are trying to use the Exe like an ogre or rat ogre and you wonder why it fails?
I build my Executioner as a crit-seeking dodger. Great sword with havoc hitting three times with Vital strike is fun :)
Then with sidestep he just dances when the other guy tries to hit him.
I find the WH's to be the most fun of any of the warbands. Allot is personal opinion I admit.
Just so. The name of the unit should be a hint as to how you should use him, to go around executing people.
I use mine with dual swords of havoc (4 Vital Strikes or 3 regular + 2 Vital with mastered Adrenaline Rush, a greatsword would deal pitiful damage toward the end) for more than 60% crit chance on Vital Strike once Fatality procs.
Throw in some Misfortune assistance from your Zealot bowmen and you'll be critting even against large Impressives, while the Maiden doesn't stand a chance against you to begin with.
That being said, Fire Purge is indeed quite weak, but it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things, since the Executioner is so boss even without it.
As I pointed out Dark Souls have only 3 less points in agility so they can be a good dodging character as well. I cannot possibly call a flagellant a tank with his 32% MR top (with awareness).
At least dark souls can switch to a shield and get +27% (shield of shielding) instantly.
I just compare them to any other of my henchman and how they can perform against my heavy hitters. I can steamroll all of my WH henchman with my Spawn alone but I will cry if I will have to face my own warpguards from the same warband. 125% dodge and 70%(80 with serenity) MR is what I call a decent tanky henchman.
PS: I used attracting lure on my dark souls to "disengage". Not reliable but at least that's something :) Switched to warpguards as soon as I hit the rep.
How do you get 4 vital strikes? Executioner has 9 red pills and vital strike costs 3. That's 3 strikes max.
You have a tad too much bias methinks.
You like the Possessed playstyle and it works for you. WH have a very different playstyle.
I have few problems against even a spawn. Sure, the Flags do not get the melee resist but they get two very reliable dodges and a WP standing behidn them to keep them up and they ignore fear and terror.
I pick up a Spawn with a flag, keep him up with my WP and shoot the thing to death with my WHC (trial by pain is very nasty against impressives) and my Smuggler sniper.
While this is going on my Zealots bodyguard the shooters while the Executioner works his way through the other bad guys.
Mastered Adrenaline Rush.
You could also use mastered Introspection to return 2 OP at the cost of 3 SP, for 1 more regular hit, but you can't use that while engaged, so you'd need 2 enemies close to one another and you kill the 1st. Though they don't really need to be that close, unless you also want to use Sidestep that turn.
Order also could grant an extra hit, and that's best when used for Impressives who deal the most damage, though there certainly are situations where you'd want to deal a finishing blow with someone else before the enemy gets to move.
Most people suggest using dual-wield on Impressives because they also suggest one or several methods of dealing extra hits, though even at 4 hits it's basically smarter to use dual-wield than a 2-hander.