Hard and Brutal and Deadly

[Nepocrates]

As someone new to the game but not new to war hammer mechanics when (what level ect..) is a good time to try my first Hard, Brutal or Deadly mission? Is there a way to play exhibition against the AI to see what those difficulties are like?

[Quixsos]

The Difficulties is: How much better is the AI as your "Team". (rating)

[Kindler]

You can do Hard missions right out the gate without much trouble, though I'd recommend waiting until your units are level 2 (to reduce some of their squishiness) if you aren't used to the game. As I'm sure you've noticed, there are a LOT of differences between the video game and the tabletop.

Brutal and Deadly missions I'd hold off on until you have a solid core of characters you're comfortable with, and you have a good grasp of the mechanics. When you start breezing through Hard missions, give a Brutal one a shot.

DISCLAIMER: Read the deployment details. The easiest missions to survive are the ones that read: "Both warbands deploy tightly around their wagon." If you get a Brutal mission that, for example, reads "Both warbands are scattered around the area, frightened by something," you're likely not going to survive. Remember you can jump to the next day if you don't have any that appeal to you.

Anyway, the superficial differences in the difficulty aren't all that important. On Hard, Brutal, and Deadly, the enemy gets bonuses to their HP pool and the amount of damage they do, escalating with each level. That can be difficult to deal with at times, but nothing you can't surmount with clever tactics and caution.

The REAL difference is:

1. There is a chance you'll get ambushed, or you'll ambush the enemy on Brutal and Deadly. This cancels the previous deployment method, and one of you will be surrounded by the other. If you're ambushed, you don't get to deploy your units; it's randomized. Obviously, that's not a good thing.
2. Brutal and Deadly missions have a chance for a demon to spawn. These are very, very tough enemies that pop up around big collections of wyrdstone. If you go on a Brutal mission and get a map with all the wyrdstone piled into one area, that's where they'll be; scout it out carefully. Demons are neutral; they'll attack the most vulnerable enemy they can reach, either you or the other warband. Stay out of range of them, and they can usually chew up the enemy pretty nicely, giving you a chance to pick up a bunch of extra wyrdstone while they're distracted.

Personally, I never take a Brutal or Deadly mission unless both the wyrdstone and loot is at least rated "Good." It's really not worth the risk otherwise, and I'm a coward at heart.

[Paranoia]

Apart from Story Missions, where the Difficulty tells the Rating difference, one can do Deadlies starting Mission 2, if one is experienced enough. So, technically, any time you want.

Realistically, though, Hard is barely more than Normal, so you can do that whenever you do not get slaughtered at Normal Missions.

Brutal and Deadly have more noticeable Buffs, chance of Ambush (10%ish chance, no two Missions in a row) and Daemons (Warband Rank 6+ and at least one Character on one of the sides at Rank 6, 20%ish chance I believe).

Those you can do when you feel like Hard is not named correctly.

[kriscardiac]

Like Para said - Deadly at the start is possible, (as you're going to get your hench one-shotted anyways), but as you progress a bit I find Deadly gets harder and harder, as you can't keep up with training costs on all your units, while the AI uses all their skill points.

When you get ahead of the training curve it's back to just more difficult.

(I should add that I didn't actually attempt a Deadly until I'd completed all of Act 1 on at least two of the warbands, but I'm risk averse)

[Paranoia]

Originally posted by kriscardiac:

(I should add that I didn't actually attempt a Deadly until I'd completed all of Act 1 on at least two of the warbands, but I'm risk averse)

Myself, when I joined in Beta once upon a time, mostly focused on Brutal from the start.
...I miss Rank 0 Normal first Mission Daemons. People feedbacked that they were too hard, for some reason. : (

[kriscardiac]

I got an Ambush on my 2nd and 3rd ever mission (once for, once against) and they were on normal.
Still don't like seeing Nurgle daemons either.
But, on point, while it's good to go up the learning curve slowly, those crit-build rngesus AI units appear on any difficulty.

[Bloodscape]

In case you don't know the basics of deployment/difficulty/scenario check out this page:

https://mordheim-city-of-the-damned.wikia.com/wiki/Scenarios_and_Deployment

The page got its birth from a forum on here. I believe the forum stated that ambushes were more common on easier deployments you pick (such as Rivals in the Ruins, both warbands at their wagon). I didn't include that data in the page because it cant be substantiated.

What kindler says about large collections on the map is interesting. I have only had a daemon spawn once when there was a large collection of wyrdstone on the map and he was indeed on top of it. All the rest of the times, the wyrdstone was in smaller groups or scattered.

Brutal and Deadly definately have the added possibilities of an ambush or daemon or both as well as enemy added wounds and damage. Hard is more like extra xp if your good on normal (as para says).

[crlski1]

I have to disagree with kinder's statement about demon spawning, I thought the same way until my last Deadly mission, there was a group of 3 stones near my cart and a Demonette hiding around the corner from them, so no they can spawn anywhere near the wrydstones no matter the size of the grouping.

[Bloodscape]

Originally posted by crlski1:

I have to disagree with kinder's statement about demon spawning, I thought the same way until my last Deadly mission, there was a group of 3 stones near my cart and a Demonette hiding around the corner from them, so no they can spawn anywhere near the wrydstones no matter the size of the grouping.

I think he was only talking about a single large grouping, as in when all the wyrdstone on the map is in one place. I could be wrong though.

[kriscardiac]

I usually find Deamon's near the highest value wyrdstone grouping on the map (unless they've already moved to engage), but that's an observation.

EDIT except the Choas Ogre, he seems to be on top of the enemy cart whenever I see him.

[crlski1]

I always thought the same way, one large group of stones, good chance for a demon or the scattered by "something" and not the town cryer, but I was proven wrong the last game, it had neither of those, not scattered or one large grouping of stones

[Reaver79]

If your a sucker for punishment you can really roll with deadly from the get go.. If your a sour loser then you should propperly wait with anything above hard till you feel like you got it all under control.

[Nepocrates]

Thanks for the tips and advice

[Bloodscape]

Originally posted by Reaver79:

If your a sucker for punishment you can really roll with deadly from the get go.. If your a sour loser then you should propperly wait with anything above hard till you feel like you got it all under control.

LoL

When you feel like you have it under control, go with some Brutal... It is the same as Deadly except the enemy will have a chunk less wounds and damage. Everything that can go wrong in Deadly can go wrong in Brutal but with a bit more recovery chance.

[Jhonny G]

When you feel like you have it under control... That's usually when Mordheim turns around and kick you square in the nuts to show you who's the boss.

Wanted to relax with a hard mission that had some good loot last night because I was low on money, but what I got instead was the most brutal slaughter ever that reduced my warband to a bloody pulp. Never in my life have I seen/had so many failed 80-90% rolls in one game while the opponent just passed every ridiculous check.

Bottom line.. Take the mission difficulty with a grain of salt as it is entirely possibly to ace 5 brutal/deadly mission in a row, only to get your ass kicked in something that is supposed to be 'easier'.