Dedicated warpstone hauler

[kappahun]

I was considering to build a dedicated character for warpstone collection for my WH warband. My idea was to have high mobility and carrying capacity, but have some combat value as well.

Could this be made better?

Warpstone hauler [www.pyrospace.co.uk]

[Kittenpaw]

Oh, I agree. And I also believe there are normal passive skills one can grab as well as runes (of Health?). It would be nice to incorporate those things into the build if possible.

[Darth Cannabis]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Kittenpaw:

Oh, I agree. And I also believe there are normal passive skills one can grab as well as runes (of Health?). It would be nice to incorporate those things into the build if possible.

Ah yes definately, you can also add witch finder ward as another faction passive, which is poison and wrydstone resistance, or put intelligence higher for resist corruption.

Let's use LGT flagglenent, buffed by the a warpriest for example. 9 toughness (req for skills) and the rest agility (at least 15) with a little strength. Prowl, Sidestep, then your wrydstone skills (anything left user choice).

Imaculate Flesh from the War Priest, for 30%, then Witchfinders Ward for another 20% before pickup. Then on pick up, the extra 20% (for 2 turns) from Ardent Cleansing, will give you 70% wrydstone resistance total, before runes are factored in. Then keep in mind that since we used a flag as example, it a fear, terror and all alone immune unit. That is a solid, stone specific gatherer.

[Paranoia]

I wonder if we scared kappahun away already. :b

[Crowley]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Paranoia:

I wonder if we scared kappahun away already. :b

Looks like he got a lot to think about. 😀

For pve, in my opinion, is better to make a runner.
The only thing you have to take care is if someone can reach you. So only the -movement to care about when gathering the green gold.
Better make a runner/shooter, as he can help on the move, or even a runner/hitter, because maybe one day he needs to do... Real gang work.

And as someone said already, better hero than hench for the SP and mastered skills.
Knowledge Mordheim and Exhaustion mastered. And OC, the bigger the strength, the better (on 3 groups). Meditation is good as well.

From your build, wall runner may be not so good as the stones use to be on the ground, and acrobatic and combat movement are too many points for a bad move case. If someone reach him he deserves a punch or two.

[Kittenpaw]

Problem is Flagellants cannot get LGT, from what I remember.

[Darth Cannabis]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Kittenpaw:

Problem is Flagellants cannot get LGT, from what I remember.

Oops nvm then, a bit of an oversight. Hench ones still work pretty well with same idea (so 30 from priest, 10 from each buff for the 50, then the rune on top to get it all the way), but yeah for the master version of doing so would have to go zealot not flag. Guilty of using a bad example, for using the master version of those witch hunter specific skills to make extreme wyrdstone resist unit.

[Wendersnaven]

I've found that the AI just knows if someone is alone, the same way it knows who are the lowbies even if they can't see them.

The only character I've managed as a runner is a Skaven leader, with Knowledge Mordheim x 2 and a few other tricks. Shield of health is a good idea for the extra warstone resistance. I had a toon's movement reduced to 1 after picking up four stones in one round ... he got surrounded and died since I had the rest on my guys on dodge instead of prowl, heh.

<Edit: I have to use a tome to increase his intelligence to 15 for KnowMord2 btw. I was going to post a screenshot but he's not very exciting. Just Prowl and the three handy Dodge enhancements.>

[Crowley]

Once the AI spot one of your guys, it can see all of them for the rest of the match. So you need a runner who starts his job when almost all the AI warband are bussy.

[Paranoia]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Crowley:

Once the AI spot one of your guys, it can see all of them for the rest of the match. So you need a runner who starts his job when almost all the AI warband are bussy.

Well, mine was simply too fast for the AI Warbands to catch. :b

[Ishan451]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Wendersnaven:

I've found that the AI just knows if someone is alone, the same way it knows who are the lowbies even if they can't see them.

The AI doesn't see your troops, unless it has line of sight. It moves either towards the nearest warpstone clusters or towards your cart.

How do i know that? Because i have used it to ambush the AI in the past. When it spots you, and loses sight of your, it will move to your last known location, not towards your units.

I have watched the AI, on numerous occasions turn left on a corner, despite my unit standing in ambush on the right. (used a building to disappear and went back out through another building, and then was able to attack them from behind.

Początkowo opublikowane przez Wendersnaven:

The only character I've managed as a runner is a Skaven leader

Night runner is preferable for a Skaven runner, because it increases its movement range after every jump down or leap. No other unit can reach its range of movement.

[Wendersnaven]

Man, I think I'm around 500 hours into this game and I'm still learning stuff. I might just be retarded <slow> in the most latin of senses.

[4spryt]

For a Witchhunter WB your two best choices are Smuggler or Warrior Priest.

Warrior Priest because of Mastered Ardent Cleansing (50% chance of SP) and Mastered Immaculate Flesh (null Wyrdstone debuffs). Smuggler because higher base movement* and Mastered In and Out (+2 base move / + 10 Initiative). Which ever you choose should also have Mastered Exhaustion for the +3 SP**. Everything else on a dedicated runner is up to personal choice.

My personal suggestion is Smuggler over Priest. Smuggler (as Paranoia pointed out) can also act as a sniper while it is running around and has the guaranteed movement boost from In and Out. Priest has the potential for much higher movement, but its only potential, no guarantee; and I prefer to have my Priests healing instead of running around looting.

With your Zealot build, I would swap Basic Resist Corruption for Basic Ardent Cleansing. Meditation is defintiely the better choice here since henchman can only get Basics. Combat movement and Acrobatics probably won't have much effectiveness since the AI tends to taunt a lot and that 15% MR is going to be of minimal benefit to a non MR build.

I would either use those slots to boost your Sidestep dodge with Avoid and Knowledge Tactics, or (since you equipped a shortbow***) adjust your WS and Ballistic points to get 9 Accuracy for Headshot and either Eagle Eyes or Trick Shooter. Since Headshot is 4op there is no need for quick reload. Basically you would just be hoping for Headshot to stun any pursuing enemies or snipe one while running around looting.

*Priest can Master Knowledge of Mord, while Smuggler can't so that balances out base movement to 8 for both.

**Meditation is also an option but since it is Intelligence based that leaves the Smuggler with Basic. The Mastered version only provides +2 SP rather than +3 SP from Exhaustion.

***I would swap the shortbow for a bow. The bow has +hit which will help those headshots land.

EDIT: I would also add that having a dedicated runner is a good thing for when you decide to do the secondary objective of stealing the enemy idol.

[4spryt]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Wendersnaven:

I've found that the AI just knows if someone is alone, the same way it knows who are the lowbies even if they can't see them.

I don't know if Ishan or Crowley is correct on the visibility issue, but personally I always think of it in terms of proximity; meaning that the AI attacks the closest weakest known target.

I use runners a lot, but I always run them at a distance from where I am engaging the enemy AI. I've never had the AI send off units to attack my solo runner after they have sighted or engaged my main force.

[kappahun]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Paranoia:

I wonder if we scared kappahun away already. :b

Not at all. I give smuggler a shot. Not very keen on DLC heroes, as they seem pay-to-win for me, but hey.

A hero selection will also make me rethink the whole WB. Was running 2* templar knight for tanking and 1 warrior priest for complete overkill. The fourth hero slot was reserved for LGT marksman, once I hit rep4. Now using smuggler, I have to train a new warrior priest to bump it up as leader, but then I miss out again on ranged damage.

So basically, this whole conversation leads to rethink whole my WB setup.

[Paranoia]

Początkowo opublikowane przez kappahun:

Początkowo opublikowane przez Paranoia:

I wonder if we scared kappahun away already. :b

Not at all. I give smuggler a shot. Not very keen on DLC heroes, as they seem pay-to-win for me, but hey.
...

So basically, this whole conversation leads to rethink whole my WB setup.

The DLC Heroes are quite well balanced, they just allow for more variation (like any shooting for early Sisters before they learn to throw rocks so that a an enemy out of reach is not an auto-loss).
So I would reject the notion of Pay to Win for these as unnecessary. Well, mayhaps early Globadier, but he is at most mediocre in the late game, so it balances out.
...
Happens a lot early. Hell, even I occasionally rethink my composition to such extent that I may well just start a new Warband while I am at it, like I did about a month ago. :b