Ambient Occlusion Not Functioning

[HooksGURU]

HBAO, HDAO, or standard AO are currently ineffective. I attempted to publish this before, but the thread was removed...not quite sure why as it is an obvious bug with the engine. Please Rockstar Dev Team address this as soon as possible if you are reading the Steam threads it greatly reduces image fidelity for those running the maximum settings available. I have tried various compatability bits via NVIDIA Inspector to no avail. If possible HBAO with GI (Global Illumination) would be appriciated.

Regards.

[HooksGURU]

Publicado originalmente por Manwith Noname:

So, here's my two pennies...

Ambient Occlusion was disabled or not functioning until the patch on the 21st. This would also explain why some people suddenly lost FPS with that patch but could not understand why.

Although Rockstar managed to impliment some form of AO in the patch, they have not polished it completely because it should force the scene to redraw like changing other settings do.

Hopefully this will be addressed in a forthcoming patch and perhaps, if possible, implimentation of other forms of AO with the option to choose your preference for performance and quality.

Publicado originalmente por themaxmeister:

Publicado originalmente por Manwith Noname:

So, here's my two pennies...

Ambient Occlusion was disabled or not functioning until the patch on the 21st. This would also explain why some people suddenly lost FPS with that patch but could not understand why.

Although Rockstar managed to impliment some form of AO in the patch, they have not polished it completely because it should force the scene to redraw like changing other settings do.

Hopefully this will be addressed in a forthcoming patch and perhaps, if possible, implimentation of other forms of AO with the option to choose your preference for performance and quality.

I have posited the same about the patch in the past, and I agree with the rest. Fixing the settings themselves will prevent morons from further spreading misinformation.

Just going by the statement "I have posted the same about the patch in the past."

Also the thread you created regarding Post Processing tied to Ambient Occlusion is not correct, the two have nothing to do with eachother via Rockstar's configuration. The Post Process effect settings adjust the accuracy of lighting, bloom resolution, light refraction in water etc. Ambient Occlusion is 100% seperated by the aforementioned.

[Manwith Noname]

To clarify my statement. I didn't pre order but bought the game on release. I spent my first 10 hours or so fiddling with the game, just messing around, running benchmarks, changing settings.

I never once noticed the signs of Ambient Occlusion but left it on high because I kinda felt the fact I didn't notice it, did not mean it wasn't doing subtle things.

Once I'm all set, I no longer run a FPS counter and use vsync.

Around the 21st, the patch came and the nVidia guide was released. Suddenly, I start to notice the effect when I am stood near things, further investigation shows shading on inside corners of walls and objects near them.

The guide also said it was not currently working and so they could not measure it's performance impact, though they would update the guide when Rockstar released the patch that would fix it (implying they knew about the problem and had a fix in mind).

Coupled with this, people start complaining about loss of performance with that same patch.

I just put 2+2 together and hopefully came up with 4. Maybe it was working before and I didn't notice because when I was testing for it, nothing was actually changing as the scene needs to be redrawn. In that case I came up with 5.

[HooksGURU]

Publicado originalmente por Manwith Noname:

To clarify my statement. I didn't pre order but bought the game on release. I spent my first 10 hours or so fiddling with the game, just messing around, running benchmarks, changing settings.

I never once noticed the signs of Ambient Occlusion but left it on high because I kinda felt the fact I didn't notice it, did not mean it wasn't doing subtle things.

Once I'm all set, I no longer run a FPS counter and use vsync.

Around the 21st, the patch came and the nVidia guide was released. Suddenly, I start to notice the effect when I am stood near things, further investigation shows shading on inside corners of walls and objects near them.

The guide also said it was not currently working and so they could not measure it's performance impact, though they would update the guide when Rockstar released the patch that would fix it (implying they knew about the problem and had a fix in mind).

Coupled with this, people start complaining about loss of performance with that same patch.

I just put 2+2 together and hopefully came up with 4. Maybe it was working before and I didn't notice because when I was testing for it, nothing was actually changing as the scene needs to be redrawn. In that case I came up with 5.

Sounds like a placebo effect. There were no graphical fixes related to the function of ambient occlusion in the patch notes. I know you guys are trying really hard to convince eachother that Ambient Occlusion is in fact working, or by some stretch of the imagination was fixed when Rockstar themselves haven't addressed it yet. I understand you are seeing shading & shadow highlights, but that is in fact...NOT the ambient occlusion, that is the shading process used by the shadow system in the RAGE engine. Ambient occlusion, especially HBAO as max stated, effects the entire scene; meaning buildings, asstes, foliage, overhangs etc. are all effected by the technology, almost equally in coverage. Anyone who is familiar with how it works can tell you right away it is not working correctly.

Example: HBAO in Battlefield 4, HBAO in Dragon Age: Inquisition...I hate to use Electronic Art's Published titles as examples, but both DICE and Bioware made excellent use of HBAO. Whereas, GTA V...not in the slightest.

I will bet you in the upcoming days there will ACTUALLY be a patch that addresses ambient occlusion's effect on the game..at which time, you will be greatly sorry for the grief and insults that were hurled at me.

[Manwith Noname]

Publicado originalmente por HooksGURU:

I know you guys are trying really hard to convince eachother that Ambient Occlusion is in fact working

Heh, dude, I've posted 2 pics in this thread, one with AO on, one with it off. Look at them, tell me it's not working.

Edit:

Publicado originalmente por HooksGURU:

...you will be greatly sorry for the grief and insults that were hurled at me.

Erm, I never insulted you.

[HooksGURU]

Publicado originalmente por Manwith Noname:

Publicado originalmente por HooksGURU:

I know you guys are trying really hard to convince eachother that Ambient Occlusion is in fact working

Heh, dude, I've posted 2 pics in this thread, one with AO on, one with it off. Look at them, tell me it's not working.

In your examples one screen Franklin is making contact with the wall...the other isn't. I am quite aware of your screen captures, that is a proximity shadow. I am telling you, that if you look at the cityscape, or even a single building, you can clearly see that ambient occlusion is not working correctly.

[Manwith Noname]

Did you happen to look at the panelling on the door?

[HooksGURU]

Publicado originalmente por Manwith Noname:

Did you happen to look at the panelling on the door?

Sorry for directing you to this page, but it has the best "whole-scene" Ambient Occlusion examples, that aren't copywrite by the developers. http://www.geforce.com/whats-new/articles/daylight-nvidia-geforce-gtx-technology

Compare the useage, you will see where I am coming from.

[HooksGURU]

I mean if you look at the character models you will see 100% right away that ambient occlusion is bugged. There is absolutley no scene in the game where a single character is under the effect of ambient occlusion.

EDIT: I am just going to wait on Rockstar, so you can hear it directly. I am doing a terrible job of relaying my point.

[Manwith Noname]

Ambient Occlusion is currently working, it's just not working how you want it to.

You know a thing or two so you should know there are many ways to skin a cat, as there are ways to impliment AO.

Edit:

I'll also quote myself from this thread...

Publicado originalmente por Manwith Noname:

Hopefully this will be addressed in a forthcoming patch and perhaps, if possible, implimentation of other forms of AO with the option to choose your preference for performance and quality.

[null_subject]

Publicado originalmente por HooksGURU:

Publicado originalmente por themaxmeister:

I have posited the same about the patch in the past, and I agree with the rest. Fixing the settings themselves will prevent morons from further spreading misinformation.

Just going by the statement "I have posted the same about the patch in the past."

Posited != posted. Those are 2 different words, and you don't seem to know their meanings. The fact that you quote me incorrectly, immediately following a direct quote goes to show just how skewed your perception is.

I've never said anything about Rockstar's patch notes. I've simply said that AO could have been completely broken before the patch released on the 21st, because I did all my testing after installing said patch.

I don't like to make false statements, something you and I clearly don't have in common.

Publicado originalmente por HooksGURU:

Also the thread you created regarding Post Processing tied to Ambient Occlusion is not correct, the two have nothing to do with eachother via Rockstar's configuration. The Post Process effect settings adjust the accuracy of lighting, bloom resolution, light refraction in water etc. Ambient Occlusion is 100% seperated by the aforementioned.

Truly, you need to work on your reading comprehension. My post was edited yesterday to reflect the new information we've uncovered. Changing any settings (like PostFx) is necessary to redraw the shaders, as the AO option doesn't do so automatically at this time (so trying to turn it on or off requires a restart, or the user to change another setting temporarily).

Also, you're clearly not in the field of game development if all you do is regurgitate information you've found elsewhere. If you were in the same business as I am, you would know that patch notes are never entirely complete. Hundreds of bugs get fixed, but only 10-15 major ones get mentioned. Not only that, but bug-fixing/patching has a cascading effect. You fix one thing here, and it breaks 2-3 things there. The same happens in reverse, sometimes you fix something, and it also repairs something else that didn't seem related.

You sound incredibly naive, and downright ignorant.

Publicado originalmente por HooksGURU:

I mean if you look at the character models you will see 100% right away that ambient occlusion is bugged. There is absolutley no scene in the game where a single character is under the effect of ambient occlusion.

EDIT: I am just going to wait on Rockstar, so you can hear it directly. I am doing a terrible job of relaying my point.

Actually, we understand your point, you just refuse to realize that you are wrong. Characters are all properly affected by AO in my game—in cutscenes, and during gameplay. It's very obvious under their arms, or when they're holding guns up to their chest.

I'm starting to think that you're the kind of person who never evolves, but I'll mention this again: Stating that something "absolutley" (you could also learn to spell) doesn't work, even when confronted with proof that it does, doesn't change the reality of things. It just makes you wrong.

I thought we were past this delusion of yours that AO doesn't work for anyone, but I guess not.

[null_subject]

Publicado originalmente por HooksGURU:

Sounds like a placebo effect. There were no graphical fixes related to the function of ambient occlusion in the patch notes. I know you guys are trying really hard to convince eachother that Ambient Occlusion is in fact working, or by some stretch of the imagination was fixed when Rockstar themselves haven't addressed it yet. I understand you are seeing shading & shadow highlights, but that is in fact...NOT the ambient occlusion, that is the shading process used by the shadow system in the RAGE engine. Ambient occlusion, especially HBAO as max stated, effects the entire scene; meaning buildings, asstes, foliage, overhangs etc. are all effected by the technology, almost equally in coverage. Anyone who is familiar with how it works can tell you right away it is not working correctly.

I know you take your job as poster child for the Dunning–Kruger effect very seriously, but it's really laughable just how disconnected from reality you are.

1. You know next to nothing about graphics. You repeat a bunch of buzzwords that you've read here and there, but there's no substance to what you're saying.
2. The only person who's trying convince people of an untruth here is you.
3. While what you've read about HBAO (that it effects the entire scene) is correct, you keep missing the undeniable fact that it is working in the entire scene in my game, and in Noname's game as well. It applies to everything, like it should. You're just butthurt that it's not working for you.
4. Anyone who is familiar with any shader work can easily tell that you know literally nothing of which you speak. You were wrong about AO not being post-processing, and you are wrong in your assessment of screenshots depicting a very obvious application of AO.
5. If somehow, somewhere, someone hired you to do 3d work of any kind, they are imbeciles, and must be regretting their decision by now. You are completely useless to this discussion, only offering background static noise composed of nonsense, and misunderstood quotes.

[Manwith Noname]

Publicado originalmente por themaxmeister:

4. Anyone who is familiar with any shader work can easily tell that you know literally nothing of which you speak. You were wrong about AO not being post-processing, and you are wrong in your assessment of screenshots depicting a very obvious application of AO.

Despite the fact he got all butthurt with me earlier, accusing me of griefing and insulting him when I have done nothing of the sort...I shall in some way defend him over this.

I think this is a classic case of Steam forum miscommunication. Sometimes we type to get a specific thought down without going into the finer details. So, my feeling is, they know that AO is a PP effect, they are just saying it is not tied to the overall PP setting ingame.

[null_subject]

Publicado originalmente por Manwith Noname:

Despite the fact he got all butthurt with me earlier, accusing me of griefing and insulting him when I have done nothing of the sort...I shall in some way defend him over this.

I think this is a classic case of Steam forum miscommunication. Sometimes we type to get a specific thought down without going into the finer details. So, my feeling is, they know that AO is a PP effect, they are just saying it is not tied to the overall PP setting ingame.

Publicado originalmente por HooksGURU:

also, Ambient Occlusion has nothing to do with Post Processing, as it is an ACTIVE less expensive version of Global Illumination, thus not tied to post processing.

No; he's just a very ignorant person whose self-delusions preclude him from realizing his limitations. I don't know how well versed you are in graphics, but please don't let him fool you into thinking he knows even the most basic of stuff, simply because he can memorize a few keywords.

[HooksGURU]

With all your rude and malicious attempts to make me look bad, I am still staying on point that it is a broken feature.

Look an updated look at Ambient Occlusion in GTA V: http://www.geforce.com/whats-new/guides/grand-theft-auto-v-pc-graphics-and-performance-guide#grand-theft-auto-v-ambient-occlusion

Keyword used by NVIDIA : "Somewhat Functional."

EDIT: You can hurl insults all you want, does not make you right, or me wrong. You changed your original stance on your own thead, you bend words to make you look like a prisitine flower, when you are nothing more than a bitter, incorrect, egocentric fool.

You can say you are sorry at any time...but you probably won't

[Hugal]

What happens if you try forcing AO? Will it look better?