Real billboard ads.

[NORCAL JOE]

I have always been a advocate for real ads and real billboards for any of the driving games/sims. I feel this increases the immersion of the games visually and does not create any kind of problems for the sim or the player. I do not want alcohol, smoking, or Prescription ads, which I understand will not be appropriate for younger players. I would trust the game community to watch for indiscretions and problem areas.
I am interested in what others think about this.
I am an older gamer that plays a lot of racing and driving games, as well as flight sims.

I want to Thank All of you who commented on my post. AyMazing thank you for the link to the older post. That was eye opening for me. EVERYONE HAS VERY GOOD AND VERY THOUGHTFUL COMMENTS. I was not looking to solve the issue, if even possible, but I wanted to gather information and get an idea of the thoughts, pros and cons of the possibility of using real advertising. I am going to leave the Discsussion open for a bit more as lonmg as everyone remains polite as they have so far.
SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR INPUT AND THOUGHTS.

OLD MAN

[AyMazingATS]

https://steamcommunity.com/app/270880/discussions/0/3809529155526754381/

Already talked about and the thread was locked.

[Fearagen]

I would love this too but yeah; the previous discussion didn't go great so expect this one you made to be locked down if a fight breaks out. I think it would improve immersion, instead of seeing the current faked/basic ads like it is some type of alternate universe you could see real ads from the real world, like maybe mcdonalds ads, etc. It would definitely add a level of immersion and benefit SCS with money from the ads. Having as a option would greatly suit both sides as well.

[TwinShadow]

I'm not in huge favor of real ads in a game normally in an official capacity. Sure, it is in a few games, namely sports games or probably in Need For Speed (I don't know on this, haven't played in years), then there's Forza I guess...

But for ATS/ETS2, it's treading a thin line with ads. Right now, there's only one real one that I'm aware of and that's Schneider for driver recruitment. I can let trucking-related ads slide for now because this is a truck driving game, but the very second non-related ads like fast food, shoe products, or something that has nothing to do with trucking is the second they go off permanently in my game. I don't play games to be shown ads for the real world, I play games to escape the crap that is reality.

[Fearagen]

Originally posted by luZk:

Originally posted by TwinShadow:

I'm not in huge favor of real ads in a game normally in an official capacity. Sure, it is in a few games, namely sports games or probably in Need For Speed (I don't know on this, haven't played in years), then there's Forza I guess...

But for ATS/ETS2, it's treading a thin line with ads. Right now, there's only one real one that I'm aware of and that's Schneider for driver recruitment. I can let trucking-related ads slide for now because this is a truck driving game, but the very second non-related ads like fast food, shoe products, or something that has nothing to do with trucking is the second they go off permanently in my game. I don't play games to be shown ads for the real world, I play games to escape the crap that is reality.

If you could simply choose not to see them what harm does it do that others can if they choose to?

This, if it is an option that is perhaps defaulted to "off" as in show the made-up ads. What is the harm? For the player playing it'd be purely cosmetic preference to have either real ads or the default made up stuff. Only downside is what happens if your network goes down? billboards black out or does it fallback to the game's fake ads, that is the only concern I would have.

[Qrazy]

"Hey Google, find me an ad blocker for American Truck sim"

[_KC76_]

Originally posted by luZk:

Originally posted by TwinShadow:

I'm not in huge favor of real ads in a game normally in an official capacity. Sure, it is in a few games, namely sports games or probably in Need For Speed (I don't know on this, haven't played in years), then there's Forza I guess...

But for ATS/ETS2, it's treading a thin line with ads. Right now, there's only one real one that I'm aware of and that's Schneider for driver recruitment. I can let trucking-related ads slide for now because this is a truck driving game, but the very second non-related ads like fast food, shoe products, or something that has nothing to do with trucking is the second they go off permanently in my game. I don't play games to be shown ads for the real world, I play games to escape the crap that is reality.

If you could simply choose not to see them what harm does it do that others can if they choose to?

The "harm" is in the fact that the Default state of Ads is set to ON, and many people are not even aware that "real ads" are a thing in the game .. A busy parent that gets their young kid a "safe" truck driving game would never even think to consider they need to worry about their child seeing ads for products, as if they where watching cartoons on a Thursday afternoon.

Less of a "harm" but still a bad move, is charging a fee to use the game, and then also generating revenue from selling ads. Ad revenue will out-pace game sales revenue, and eventually be the driving-factor in Development. This is the cold hard facts of financially driven companies. When the Game you Develop becomes secondary to the products you are advertising, your game is ded. More time spent developing billboards for McDonalds means less time making new Maps or Trucks.

[MagnusA]

Originally posted by Qrazy:

"Hey Google, find me an ad blocker for American Truck sim"

The same way as SCS's own billboard ads for upcoming stuff.

Options -> Online -> Dynamic Billboards.

[Lantea]

I agree with the OP. In addition to real world ads that add immersion to the game I would also love to see SCS reach out to real world businesses and shops to have them represented in the game with real names and logos.

For those that don't like it and want to continue to see made-up ads, there could be a simple toggle in the menu and you won't get real immersion with real world companies. Simple, why complain when others want a more realistic simulation.

[Supernovae]

Personally I'm alright with real world ads that make sense within the game world. However I also take issue with using a 3rd party advertising company like Dovetail has done in TSW2/3.

[_KC76_]

Originally posted by Lantea:

I agree with the OP. In addition to real world ads that add immersion to the game I would also love to see SCS reach out to real world businesses and shops to have them represented in the game with real names and logos.

For those that don't like it and want to continue to see made-up ads, there could be a simple toggle in the menu and you won't get real immersion with real world companies. Simple, why complain when others want a more realistic simulation.

And how long do you think SCS will continue making 2 sets of skins for every item that has an advert? Billboards, park benches, wall murals, the sides of buses .. They will see the increase in revenue from adverts and say to themselves, "hey, we can afford to lose 10,000 sales with this advert revenue.. lets just FORCE the adverts, and increase the pricing, since now no one can opt out" .. Adverts guaranteed to be seen cost more than adverts with an Opt-out feature .. Just ask YouTube how that is going. YT used to let you "skip" the short 15 second adverts, now, if they are less than 30 seconds, you can not skip. You used to be able to use an ad blocker, now, you get 3 videos, then you are blocked until you disable ad-block,
Okay, but back to SCS .. Adverts make enough revenue to make up for lost future sales of DLC by those that leave (they still have our previous money), until the Advertisers see the lower play stats, and start to pull their adverts because SCS charges too much for fewer views, now SCS is out Sales revenue because they turned their backs on people who didn't want to see adverts in a PAID game, AND the Advert revenue dried up because "views" of the ads were down .. now SCS has NO money to continue Development, and SCS goes bye-bye .. Putting Advertising in a PAID game is a death sentence for any developer. Heck, even Paradox/Colossal Order has not tried that crap with Cities Skylines, and they are all about revenue before product quality.

[Lantea]

Originally posted by KingConrail:

And how long do you think SCS will continue making 2 sets of skins for every item that has an advert? Billboards, park benches, wall murals, the sides of buses .. They will see the increase in revenue from adverts and say to themselves, "hey, we can afford to lose 10,000 sales with this advert revenue.. lets just FORCE the adverts, and increase the pricing, since now no one can opt out" .. Adverts guaranteed to be seen cost more than adverts with an Opt-out feature .. ............

Personally I am not worried SCS would ever go down this road and act against the community they have built around their games. I trust the current leadership and their judgement and ethics when it comes to this sort of stuff and have no reason to believe they would ever decide to sell out for higher advertising revenue.

The real world ad toggle in options is the ideal way to do it to both satisfy the part of the community that wants more real world immersion while at the same time keeping happy those that prefer made-up ads. The added revenue from those that like seeing real ads or real company/shop names would more than cover the extra art and assets that would need to be made.

[Ryu]

Originally posted by KingConrail:

Originally posted by Lantea:

I agree with the OP. In addition to real world ads that add immersion to the game I would also love to see SCS reach out to real world businesses and shops to have them represented in the game with real names and logos.

For those that don't like it and want to continue to see made-up ads, there could be a simple toggle in the menu and you won't get real immersion with real world companies. Simple, why complain when others want a more realistic simulation.

And how long do you think SCS will continue making 2 sets of skins for every item that has an advert? Billboards, park benches, wall murals, the sides of buses .. They will see the increase in revenue from adverts and say to themselves, "hey, we can afford to lose 10,000 sales with this advert revenue.. lets just FORCE the adverts, and increase the pricing, since now no one can opt out" .. Adverts guaranteed to be seen cost more than adverts with an Opt-out feature .. Just ask YouTube how that is going. YT used to let you "skip" the short 15 second adverts, now, if they are less than 30 seconds, you can not skip. You used to be able to use an ad blocker, now, you get 3 videos, then you are blocked until you disable ad-block,
Okay, but back to SCS .. Adverts make enough revenue to make up for lost future sales of DLC by those that leave (they still have our previous money), until the Advertisers see the lower play stats, and start to pull their adverts because SCS charges too much for fewer views, now SCS is out Sales revenue because they turned their backs on people who didn't want to see adverts in a PAID game, AND the Advert revenue dried up because "views" of the ads were down .. now SCS has NO money to continue Development, and SCS goes bye-bye .. Putting Advertising in a PAID game is a death sentence for any developer. Heck, even Paradox/Colossal Order has not tried that crap with Cities Skylines, and they are all about revenue before product quality.

Not to invalidate your point, but you speak as though they're adding video commercials that players are being forced to watch. What's actually been added are billboards. Static images. And they can't be "valued" like a real-world billboard where they can measure how much traffic is passing a location. How is SCS going to tell an advertiser how often a player is going to pass one of these in their random gameplay?

I get the whole "slippery slope" argument. But this is quite hyperbolic, IMO.

[Humpfester]

I remember back in the Battlefield 2142 days there a strong anti ad movement in games, people didn't want to see ads for any given product in their game. Personally I don't like it, but it does add realism to the game.
SCS could be simply going after revenue or they could be trying to bolster their overall reputation with the trucking manufacturers worldwide which is a plus for us seeing SCS is bombarded with new truck request from this community constantly. SCS has to keep chasing the dollar and I really don't understand their method on how they're going to do that, because an in game ad here or there isn't going to keep the lights on.
Just my two cents.

[_KC76_]

Originally posted by ~{DCMT}~ Ryu:

Not to invalidate your point, but you speak as though they're adding video commercials that players are being forced to watch. What's actually been added are billboards. Static images. And they can't be "valued" like a real-world billboard where they can measure how much traffic is passing a location. How is SCS going to tell an advertiser how often a player is going to pass one of these in their random gameplay?

I get the whole "slippery slope" argument. But this is quite hyperbolic, IMO.

I respect your diplomatic approach, and I agree, my example was on the extreme side .. I did that because many people, no offence intended towards any one, at all, but many people are "short-sighted".

And to help clear up my current position .. I can see what MAY happen, and I dislike it, but I AM okay with using "real ads" for things that are relevant, and content neutral, like billboards for the Truck brands, or Trailer brands, or Goodyear tires/Michelin tires in ETS as these things are a part of the Game and DLC .. I don't want to see an all-ages game start putting fast-food adverts aimed at kids, or as the OP mentioned, Pharmaceuticals, or even add for Clothing or non-relevant electronics .. PC/hardware ads could be relevant, but not Refrigerators or Microwave ovens.

Now, if an Iconic brand were to endorse the Sim, and grant a license to use the Brand, like an actual T/A truckstop, or Pilot, then I can see having that brand on billboards .. You could see the billboard, and then go find a T/A truckstop to rest for the night .. If you saw a Burgerking advert, you can not go to BK in-game, and use the BK to eat or "rest" .. makes no "sense" in the game.

[🦊 Hermit]

Originally posted by Lantea:

Personally I am not worried SCS would ever go down this road and act against the community they have built around their games. I trust the current leadership and their judgement and ethics when it comes to this sort of stuff and have no reason to believe they would ever decide to sell out for higher advertising revenue.

And yet, they didn't announce in advance that they were going to put these billboards in. They did it quietly, without telling anyone, and only spoke up about it a few months after the fact when some people began to notice...

Originally posted by ~{DCMT}~ Ryu:

I get the whole "slippery slope" argument. But this is quite hyperbolic, IMO.

Hyperbolic perhaps, but not without precedent, both in the world of business and the world of gaming. Take microtransactions, for example - when they were introduced there was some considerable uproar, but dev studios continued to see what they could get away with, and people continued to buy such games even despite the discontent. And so we're now in a gaming landscape where such microtransactions are pretty commonplace, and often not just for simple cosmetics but for actual gameplay elements which give an advantage in multiplayer, or may be required in order to fully complete the game.