Smoke grenades don't work?

[Cheese Wheel of Time]

I read somewhere that they're bugged and actually don't increase soldier defense. Is this true?

[Mistfox]

Well, you can test it out easily. Toss one at an ADVENT, then try to target him. The "Hit" section of the fire command should show you the effects.

[Cheese Wheel of Time]

Originally posted by Mistfox:

Well, you can test it out easily. Toss one at an ADVENT, then try to target him. The "Hit" section of the fire command should show you the effects.

I'm playing on Iron Man and I really don't want to waste a inventory slot to test it out. I was just wondering if it was true or not.

I guess I could always start a new game and go through the first mission in order to get to the part where I can build a smoke bomb and then test it out...

[Mistfox]

Ok, I can confirm, there is a "bonus" indicator but no real change to hit in the "to Hit" % list. The targets have a green "up" bonus arrow and the sidebar says target is in thick smoke, but no + to defence.

[Spartan]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=628989195&searchtext=smoke

[imminence]

This happened in my current game:

1) Fired smoke grenade at enemy officer.

2) Tried to hit him with a "shuriken bomb" (a mod) which hits ALWAYS, but this time it missed.
So, the defense advantage of the smoke was working well for the ENEMY

3) When the enemy-turn started, he simply ran some steps to leave the smoke. Then he shot through a full cover and killed one of my soldiers.

Perhaps the smoke is meant to be used on self?

[Eggy]

Originally posted by imminence:

This happened in my current game:

1) Fired smoke grenade at enemy officer.

2) Tried to hit him with a "shuriken bomb" (a mod) which hits ALWAYS, but this time it missed.
So, the defense advantage of the smoke was working well for the ENEMY

3) When the enemy-turn started, he simply ran some steps to leave the smoke. Then he shot through a full cover and killed one of my soldiers.

Perhaps the smoke is meant to be used on self?

This is generaly how smoke is used in real life. "popping" smoke to provied allies cover. It was how smoke worked in XCOM EU. Im pretty sure (although not 100%) that the description ingame implies this as well. "provides a defensive bonus for everyone in the smoke".

Idealy visibility should be reduced if there is smoke between you and your target even if neither of you are "in" the smoke, but Id be suprised if thats implemented.

Early game I think a flash nade is a better use of an inventory slot. Late game, any damaging grenade trumps it.

[Quvano]

Smoke grenades improve the defense of any unit inside the smoke. It does not affect aim if the smoke is between two units that are not themselves in smoke. The correct way to use them is to cover your own units with smoke.

Note that smoke grenades previously didn't affect aim due to a bug but that was fixed in the last patch.

Flash grenades are typically better than smoke:
- Have a much wider range
- Reduce enemy movement
- Prevent and break enemy special abilities like sectoid mind controls

One advantage to smoke is that flash grenades don't affect robotic enemies while you gain the effect of smoke regardless of who is shooting you. Even so, IMO smoke grenades and bombs should have a better aim reducing effect to make them a viable alternative to flash bangs. I only ever equip smoke grenades in the early game on snipers because they are usually too far from the enemies to toss flash or frag grenades but can be close enough to reach your own squad with the smoke.

[azmountaintroll]

Smokes might have some utility on Ironman for those occasions where you've accidentally let someone get flanked, at least until Mimic Beacons become availible.

[marshmallow justice]

Mims die in two shots. Smoke does not.

[gimmethegepgun]

Originally posted by AlexF:

One advantage to smoke is that flash grenades don't affect robotic enemies while you gain the effect of smoke regardless of who is shooting you.

Yeah but robotic enemies have explosives, which they'll happily use on you if you're bunched up enough for smoke to work.
That's the real problem with smoke grenades. Their aoe is TINY.

[.O.]

Originally posted by marshmallow justice:

Mims die in two shots. Smoke does not.

why not put a mimic beacon in full cover, then give him some smoke? :p

[gimmethegepgun]

Originally posted by .O.:

Originally posted by marshmallow justice:

Mims die in two shots. Smoke does not.

why not put a mimic beacon in full cover, then give him some smoke? :p

Because they can't take cover any more.
Also SUPPOSEDLY enemies can't miss them any more, but they can. I think it sets base aim to 100 when attacking them, but penalties to aim can cause them to miss anyway.

[AUTOMATED GAY SPACE COMMUNISM]

Originally posted by .O.:

Originally posted by marshmallow justice:

Mims die in two shots. Smoke does not.

why not put a mimic beacon in full cover, then give him some smoke? :p

Mimic beacons can no longer be placed in cover, but I'm certain that smoke can work on them.

[AUTOMATED GAY SPACE COMMUNISM]

Originally posted by gimmethegepgun:

Originally posted by .O.:

why not put a mimic beacon in full cover, then give him some smoke? :p

Because they can't take cover any more.
Also SUPPOSEDLY enemies can't miss them any more, but they can. I think it sets base aim to 100 when attacking them, but penalties to aim can cause them to miss anyway.

According to the Perfect Information mod, the enemy gets over 1000% chance to hit.

Of course, since XCOM 2 doesn't really deal with excess percentages too well, that can still lead to the enemy missing.

[AUTOMATED GAY SPACE COMMUNISM]

The regular smoke indicator lies as well - it either doesn't confer a defensive bonus to troops on the edge of the smoke's radius, or it can't confer defensive bonuses through cover (similar to a flashbang).

And in regards to the "improved" smoke bomb, the indicator straight up deceives you - the actual smoke effect radius doesn't change in the vanilla game.

Currently, there aren't any mods to fix this. I just mod smoke to confer a greater defensive boost, but the bigger radius from a smoke bomb would be reeeeeaaaaaaaally nice.