How strong are the Chosen in LWOTC?

[Hayaji]

My first run with LWOTC. I am playing on normal difficulty and it seems like the chosen got an insane buff. I mean, the Hunter is usually able to kidnap at least one soldier no matter what I do. The Hunter. I mean... what? I'm kinda afraid of the other two since they, unlike the Hunter, gave me some trouble in vanilla WOTC. How strong are the other two?

[Hayaji]

Originally posted by 99Random:

Originally posted by Hayaji:

@99Random
Could you perhaps give me a good timeline on when to do things in LwotC? It's currently late september and I only just skulljacked an officer, haven't killed any chosen (doing hunt part two on the hunter). Have full mag weapons and can research elerium which would unlock coil guns. Liberated one region. How long does a LWotC campaign last? Should I hurry up a bit?

Funny enough I am experimenting in my current play with not doing liberation until way late. This made things pretty easy since the timer was (apparently) not ticking. Joke was on me. The first two months I hire every single recruit to form 4 teams. Numbers matter in the early stages in order to level up all those soldiers using ballistic weapons since later you have to buy better weapons for each new recruit. Painful.

Liberated the first region in October and what do you know, the Avatar clock was 2 past the maximum! I had to do 2 story line and 1 facility in 30 days get it comfortably below the time level.

The funny thing with LWOTC is that the Chosen stronghold missions are dead easy in all but legendary because the number of enemies in the final area is lower and your firepower is so much higher in LWOTC. So kill the local Chosen ASAP, take your time with liberating a region mission (but be well prepared for the result when you do).

At that point you usually have a Sharpshooter with at least Coil weapon+dead eye and the chosen are one-shot elerium pinatas.

Note that this is a take your time run I am doing and could have easily finished months earlier but the game is too darn fun.

The thing with the timer is weird... Does it only show once you have liberated a region? (can't remember when it shoved up for me). It's kinda sneaky if it progresses and you can't see it.

[99Random]

Yup, only shows once you have liberated a region. Not a big issue though because you do have 30 days to reduce below the maximum and in 20 days I had taken the meter from 2 over the max back to zero since the game now has so many ways to reduce it.

I actually enjoyed the scramble as it was a nice panic break.

[Hayaji]

Originally posted by 99Random:

Yup, only shows once you have liberated a region. Not a big issue though because you do have 30 days to reduce below the maximum and in 20 days I had taken the meter from 2 over the max back to zero since the game now has so many ways to reduce it.

I actually enjoyed the scramble as it was a nice panic break.

Yeah that is sneaky. At least the 30 day countdown is on hold until you liberate the region, though I wouldn't have been surprised (especially if it's this game) if it just started and then you would suddenly lose out of nowhere.
I had no idea though how you could have reduced the meter to zero. Were some other means of reducing it added? AFAIK the only way to lower it is to do story missions, blacksites and covert ops.

[99Random]

Originally posted by Hayaji:

Originally posted by 99Random:

Yup, only shows once you have liberated a region. Not a big issue though because you do have 30 days to reduce below the maximum and in 20 days I had taken the meter from 2 over the max back to zero since the game now has so many ways to reduce it.

I actually enjoyed the scramble as it was a nice panic break.

Yeah that is sneaky. At least the 30 day countdown is on hold until you liberate the region, though I wouldn't have been surprised (especially if it's this game) if it just started and then you would suddenly lose out of nowhere.
I had no idea though how you could have reduced the meter to zero. Were some other means of reducing it added? AFAIK the only way to lower it is to do story missions, blacksites and covert ops.

2 story missions (Blacksite & Gate), 3 blacksite facility missions and 1 covert ops. Waiting so long meant I had 13+ resistance in all regions. Set them all to Intel and the Facility lead missions pour in. Use Intel boost on all missions for quicker infiltration and it all happened in about 20 days. Now of course I had numerous soldiers out with fatigue afterwards (that is 8 mission across 4 teams in a short timeframe), but oh well.

Not recommending doing this, just amusing.

[Hayaji]

Originally posted by 99Random:

Originally posted by Hayaji:

Yeah that is sneaky. At least the 30 day countdown is on hold until you liberate the region, though I wouldn't have been surprised (especially if it's this game) if it just started and then you would suddenly lose out of nowhere.
I had no idea though how you could have reduced the meter to zero. Were some other means of reducing it added? AFAIK the only way to lower it is to do story missions, blacksites and covert ops.

2 story missions (Blacksite & Gate), 3 blacksite facility missions and 1 covert ops. Waiting so long meant I had 13+ resistance in all regions. Set them all to Intel and the Facility lead missions pour in. Use Intel boost on all missions for quicker infiltration and it all happened in about 20 days. Now of course I had numerous soldiers out with fatigue afterwards (that is 8 mission across 4 teams in a short timeframe), but oh well.

Not recommending doing this, just amusing.

Poor soldiers. Glad I liberated the region early (barely had any laser weapons, if any) though it's been an awful mission (save scum...). I think I enabled the double length of the avatar project cause I didn't know what to expect from lwotc, so I figured better safe than sorry. I have only contacted 4 regions so far, 1 is liberated, two are supplies/recruit and one is being actively fought for (can't get the damn lib 2 mission with enough time ) But yeah, cheers for completing those 8 missions in 20 days :DD I wouldn't even be able to do it because my soldiers would get wounded.

[Icedfate]

the fact that people think the chosens are too easy, so they needed to make a mod to boost defense, hp, attacks, ai and gave them ruler reactions. . ?

yeah, when they appear on the map, they are nuisance.hunter makes you move. warlock makes you waste actions killing more mobs.
i believe they are "supposed" to be just a nuisance. they interfere with the regular gameplay and mess with you while you are fighting the regular enemies.

and then when you reach the chosen for the actual fight, they could totaly kill a character in 1 hit. . except the warlock, i'm guessing . he mostly just tries to mind control you and strong bonds , mindshields or a psi operator solves that.

i agree, they aren't much threat, but giving them more,deadly attacks and the ai to use them in addition to ruler reactions and a damage scaling down mechanics to ensure you take multiple turns of combat to kill them does seem a bit much

[Hayaji]

Originally posted by Icedfate:

the fact that people think the chosens are too easy, so they needed to make a mod to boost defense, hp, attacks, ai and gave them ruler reactions. . ?

yeah, when they appear on the map, they are nuisance.hunter makes you move. warlock makes you waste actions killing more mobs.
i believe they are "supposed" to be just a nuisance. they interfere with the regular gameplay and mess with you while you are fighting the regular enemies.

and then when you reach the chosen for the actual fight, they could totaly kill a character in 1 hit. . except the warlock, i'm guessing . he mostly just tries to mind control you and strong bonds , mindshields or a psi operator solves that.

i agree, they aren't much threat, but giving them more,deadly attacks and the ai to use them in addition to ruler reactions and a damage scaling down mechanics to ensure you take multiple turns of combat to kill them does seem a bit much

The thing that annoys me the most are those reactions. It's not as powerful as with the rulers who react to anything you do, they only move when you shoot them from a flank. Then they usually move back from you, you can't reach them that turn, then the hunter grapples somewhere, crits your guy in half cover across the entire map with a 77% hit chance. Haven't really fought the other chosen but If they made them stronger like the hunter it's gonna be a pain. Oh, and I don't know if it's for every chosen, but the hunter is immune to crits for good measure. And has low profile.

[99Random]

Originally posted by Icedfate:

the fact that people think the chosens are too easy, so they needed to make a mod to boost defense, hp, attacks, ai and gave them ruler reactions. . ?

yeah, when they appear on the map, they are nuisance.hunter makes you move. warlock makes you waste actions killing more mobs.
i believe they are "supposed" to be just a nuisance. they interfere with the regular gameplay and mess with you while you are fighting the regular enemies.

and then when you reach the chosen for the actual fight, they could totaly kill a character in 1 hit. . except the warlock, i'm guessing . he mostly just tries to mind control you and strong bonds , mindshields or a psi operator solves that.

i agree, they aren't much threat, but giving them more,deadly attacks and the ai to use them in addition to ruler reactions and a damage scaling down mechanics to ensure you take multiple turns of combat to kill them does seem a bit much

As I said earlier in the thread, your new abilities more than compensate. The fun here is that all the new options on both sides make the Chosen and Ruler fights more enjoyable because there are more ways to approach these fights. Do not freak by looking at the topline of their scary new abilities, look at he big picture that the mod puts these in balance.

- Ability to bring 8 soldiers on almost all missions right from the start.

- New classes of soldiers and powerful new abilities (just about every soldier can get a multi-attack ability) for every class

- Chosen no longer show up randomly and will only predictably appear on certain mission types. The easiest being a Retaliation where Advent does not show up for 4 turns so it is just you against the Chosen until then. From the UFOPedia: Due to their increased strength and increased focus on having tough engagements, their appearance decreases the amount of enemies present and is limited to the following missions:

Seriously cannot remember the last time a Chosen survived more than two rounds

[Hayaji]

Originally posted by 99Random:

Seriously cannot remember the last time a Chosen survived more than two rounds

The retaliation is quite easy, the real problem (at least for me) is the defend datatap mission. There are usually at least 10 ADVENT units, and the chosen appears on the other side of the map from where I start. Since it's the hunter he can just shoot me anytime.

[99Random]

Originally posted by Hayaji:

Originally posted by 99Random:

Seriously cannot remember the last time a Chosen survived more than two rounds

The retaliation is quite easy, the real problem (at least for me) is the defend datatap mission. There are usually at least 10 ADVENT units, and the chosen appears on the other side of the map from where I start. Since it's the hunter he can just shoot me anytime.

For the Datatap, do not move the resistance fighters. They are 1 notch above useless and moving them will trigger nearby pods. This gives you 1-2 extra turns to get there with your squad, especially with use of Oscar Mike.

If my squad activates a pod on the way to the datatap I will try and keep my shinobi in stealth to race ahead so the sharpshooter and shinobi can slice and snipe for a quick kill. With only 10-12 enemies on the map, once the Chosen is down it is all over.

[Hayaji]

Originally posted by 99Random:

Originally posted by Hayaji:

The retaliation is quite easy, the real problem (at least for me) is the defend datatap mission. There are usually at least 10 ADVENT units, and the chosen appears on the other side of the map from where I start. Since it's the hunter he can just shoot me anytime.

For the Datatap, do not move the resistance fighters. They are 1 notch above useless and moving them will trigger nearby pods. This gives you 1-2 extra turns to get there with your squad, especially with use of Oscar Mike.

If my squad activates a pod on the way to the datatap I will try and keep my shinobi in stealth to race ahead so the sharpshooter and shinobi can slice and snipe for a quick kill. With only 10-12 enemies on the map, once the Chosen is down it is all over.

Heh, I do keep them right by the datatap. The hunter usually oneshots everyone but at least he isn't shooting at my soldiers (usually). What I don't understand though, is how you can one/two shot a chosen with two ppl. I mean, they usually have at least 30 HP, so this would only be possible with plasma weaponry right? Not to mention that when you have plasma they have more than 50 health.

[99Random]

Originally posted by Hayaji:

Originally posted by 99Random:

For the Datatap, do not move the resistance fighters. They are 1 notch above useless and moving them will trigger nearby pods. This gives you 1-2 extra turns to get there with your squad, especially with use of Oscar Mike.

If my squad activates a pod on the way to the datatap I will try and keep my shinobi in stealth to race ahead so the sharpshooter and shinobi can slice and snipe for a quick kill. With only 10-12 enemies on the map, once the Chosen is down it is all over.

Heh, I do keep them right by the datatap. The hunter usually oneshots everyone but at least he isn't shooting at my soldiers (usually). What I don't understand though, is how you can one/two shot a chosen with two ppl. I mean, they usually have at least 30 HP, so this would only be possible with plasma weaponry right? Not to mention that when you have plasma they have more than 50 health.

I keep the resistance fights where they start unless there is cover right nearby. I DO NOT move them to windows so to not trigger nearby pods. Sure 1-2 resistance fighters die (sometimes none). If my fighters can see the Chosen I lob some grenades.

I regularly see the ranger both barrels do 30+ points of damage (38 is highest I recall seeing) with plasma shorty. Chain Shot will easily do 15-20 or more. There is the other ability that has your soldier fire three times. More than enough damage. The trick is to use their behavior against them with the Assassin being the easiest example. He moves toward the nearest unit of yours as a reaction and attacks as a reaction if next to a unit of yours. Simply place your ranger to be the one he moves toward and then unleash both barrels at point blank once he has conveniently cuddled up to you. Dead.

Warlock will always move if flanked. Herd him toward your heavy hitters using this mechanic by using Run & Gun or grapples to get into position. I consider him the most dangerous because he is least predictable. Nothing like him summoning 3 Andromedon and than making 1 his champion. Jerk

Hunter is counter snipe meat and has lowest HP. I always bring Sharpshooter x2 or Sharp + Reaper. One Deadeye hit will usually 1 shot as long as your tech has kept pace with their upgrades..

[Hayaji]

Originally posted by 99Random:

Hunter is counter snipe meat and has lowest HP. I always bring Sharpshooter x2 or Sharp + Reaper. One Deadeye hit will usually 1 shot as long as your tech has kept pace with their upgrades..

Currently on mag/coil weapons, researching basic plasma. The hunter has 47 hp, 2 armor, low profile, damage control (+2 armor on damage) and is immune to crits. My best sniper with AMF and a coil sniper rifle does about 23 max or so with deadeye. Plasma would make maybe 28 damage. Am I just really unlucky what concerns his passives?