XCOM 2
ljuba82 Feb 17, 2019 @ 7:53am
Legendary ironman, is it time for restart?
Hi, I'm experienced xcom player, since original game, I managed to beat xcom 1 on impossible ironman 3 times (https://steamcommunity.com/app/200510/discussions/0/2656452469265098508/), but L/I on xcom 2 is giving me lot of trouble.

I tried it several times, failed few times and few times intentionally restarted cause I had lots of casualties and I think i really need almost perfect start for L/I, just like in I/I on xcom 1. But on my 7th or 8th try, I had pretty decent start and managed to survive almost until november, when I had complete squad wipeout because of that VIP extraction mission.

Comparing with xcom 1, where you just have to survive first 2 or 3 months and the rest is piece of cake, here I think we have challenge for whole game, especially on those timed missions with 5 pods. Also I know that fighting sectopods and other high level aliens in xcom 1 with squadies was wasting of time and that sooner or later I will loose, but don't have so much experience in Xcom 2. Do you think I can somehow recover from squad wipeout or is it better to restart? I don't want to loose few playing days, struggling, just to see loosing region by region and having to do it from start once again.

Maybe it was better for me to rush PSI labs (i still don't have it in late october) and start buying good soldiers from HQ, but I'm afraid it's too late now. On the other hand I won so many close encounters, it would be pity to quit now.

This are my soldiers right now and general situation...

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1657868251

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1657866944



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Showing 1-15 of 44 comments
Eyal Feb 18, 2019 @ 9:04am 
You're in a rather rough spot. How far are you on technology? Are you full Tier 2 already? If you are, then it might be still recoverable, but you will have to start ranking up your roster. Maybe buy 1-2 higher ranking soldiers so you can have about 4 higher ranks and 2 lower ranks on missions. Of course, if you suffer more heavy losses then I suggest you just abandon the campaign.

Once you get the Psi out and train them a bit then it should help you out since they bring some decent utility. Use Phantom Rangers to explore ahead so you could move faster to beat the timers. Do what you can to avoid more injuries/deaths - use the Psi abilities, mimic beacons, whatever.
Abrakadabra (Banned) Feb 18, 2019 @ 9:36am 
Your roster is too tiny. Youre pretty deep into the camaign but even after a complete squad wipe and even if you took some other casaulties your roster shouldnt be that tiny.

How many of each class to you aim for?

I go for 6 initial grenadiers and 4 for the other regular classes at a bare minimum. Sometimes I go up to 8+ grenadiers and 6 of each. But even with a deep, solid roster....loosing your alpha squad and especially all the equipment...is just nasty.

Those extraction missions can be tough. There might be reinforcements dropping in. Bring your best soldiers to missions that you cant just abandon e.g. cause you have to reach an extraction point. Bring your best troops with all the toys and scout ahead.

Looking at all the facilities you already have....you prolly into plasma weapons already?

But,yeah....I would definittely end that campaign and start again.

You have literally no soldiers left.

And all the tools and pcs and gun mods gone....so you have to send in squaddies with super weak aim and not modded/upgradded weapons.

Thats just bad.


ljuba82 Feb 18, 2019 @ 1:14pm 
Hi, just to inform I bravely failed :(

Survived till December, even had some magnificent victories (in one mission defeated Sectopod and Gatekeeper with few rookies), but mission after mission, squad was thinner and thinner, had less and less regions and resources, sell everything on black market, bought 2 high ranked soldiers, scanned at HQ for faster healing but still failed. At the end 27 wins, 11 lost missions (lot of them managed to fulfill targets, but had to extract), 397 killed aliens and 28 lost.

I had full tear 2 weapons, even plasma snipers, but wasn't enough. Turning point was VIP extraction mission, where I had opportunity to save my high level grenadier, but failed to do that in 12 turns, so had complete squad wipeout. I even think it's better not to bring best squad on those missions, cause those are the only one where you can't extract where you want and risk is so high.

Maybe next time I should rush psi labs, cause this time I had only one basic level soldier in November, only with basic, inspire ability.

My target was to have 6 grenadiers and 3 of all others and I had that, till wipeout. How do you rotate guys? I found it very difficult not to bring my very best available soldiers because of so many injuries. Also what is your squad composition before psi soldiers? I tend to use 3 grenadiers and 1 sniper, ranger and specialist. My best period where I had some flawless victories was when I was bringing 3 grenadiers and 2 rangers (5 man squad).
Eyal Feb 18, 2019 @ 8:51pm 
If we're talking vanilla, my final squad was usually 1 psi, 1 ranger (phantom), 2 sharpshooters and 2 grenadiers (It's vastly different in WoTC though). I only bring specialists (and later switched to Sparks) when I need to hack something from a distance since it can save me a turn or two, but otherwise I'd take raw damage over them.

My main approach was to put my snipers on high ground and use the grenadiers to destroy covers and shred armor, and the snipers to mop up everything. The ranger explored forward so I could advance more quickly, and joined the fight if necessary. The psi provided utility, either finishing someone off with guaranteed damage or putting a remaining enemy in stasis.

Tactics vary wildly between players though. I had a glass cannon approach - high damage but low survivability. I always researched weapons before armor, and the point of every engagement was to completely destroy a pod in one turn. Other players prefer to go for armor and bonus health first, so that their soldiers can survive more hits, but for me having a soldier wounded for 35 days is just as bad as having him killed.
ljuba82 Feb 19, 2019 @ 12:21am 
Yes, I'm playing vanilla. I will try with more sharpshooters, they were overpowered in xcom 1, but in xcom 2 I usually bring only one cause I found them less usable on timed missions and I'm always lacking grenades.
Eyal Feb 19, 2019 @ 8:36am 
I recommend you get one sharpshooter with more focus on sniping, and another with more focus on gunslinging. Gunslingers are great for finishing off several low hp units (lightning hands + quick draw = 3 different shots), or just taking out one big enemy (lightning hands + quick draw + fan fire = 5 shots).

With bluescreen rounds on, a single gunslinger and a single grenadier can take out sectopods and gatekeepers (In WoTC gunslingers can in fact completely solo sectopods and gatekeeper). As a general rule I recommend giving blue screen rounds for sharpshooters. A good chunk of enemies take damage from it (like codex for example), and the most beefy enemies are robotic.
Last edited by Eyal; Feb 19, 2019 @ 8:36am
happy Feb 19, 2019 @ 3:20pm 
the squad wipe is not that big of an issue, It'll rain sellswords before you realise it and losing a region or two because you skip missions is not by any means a game over in xcom2 L/I.

Your real problem is your roster, it's way too small.

I consider my roster healthy when it's around 23, and sometimes it hits the 30s when I don't play butcher simulator, I quit a campaign when my roster gets to 12 or so.
before the wipe you were at 15 soldiers and it's surprising you did not run into wound/fatigue spiral before.
EDIT, late to the party, build your roster in your new run.
Last edited by happy; Feb 19, 2019 @ 3:22pm
Včelí medvídek Feb 19, 2019 @ 4:46pm 
As other noted, you need big roster. In WoTC you are forced to it naturaly by fatigue system. Soldier bonds also helps make stable teams.

I would also add:

- learn recognize losing situation - eg. timer running out on critical mission, triggered multiple pods at same time or some terribly messy situation for any reason - better call Skyrenger, call off your soldiers, live and fight other day (particualrly in L/I experienced soldiers overvalue any reward mission can offer and as already mentioned - unless chain of loses, lose mission/territory there and there is not big deal on long run. Lose your A-team with it´s equipment is.

- You should not take so much damage. Sure, there is always situation where that alien you can not reach critical one shot you in high cover - that just happens and you need live with that. But in general you can control it a lot. The key is never trigger more pods/enemies than you can safely handle in same turn - that is most important of all (so scouts are as well).

You should always end your turn with (by possible priorities) 1) All enemies dead. 2) Onyl enemies that tend not attack/not priority are alive (eg. Sectoid will likely resurect some body or try jut panick you, archons has good chance go for blazing pinions, shieldbearer and Officer usualy take fulll cover - if not already - and rise shield/mark your soldier their first turn - compare it to ordianry soldier who is alwas going to shot on you, berserkers and faceless need make their way so learn esitmate if you are far enough to let them live).
3) All living enemies stuned, frozed.. 4) All living enemies flashbanged/desoriented or somehow penalized and/or have decoy target like mimic beacon for living enemies 5) All your soldiers in high cover and not in possition where they can be flanked.

- The game is and should be easier and easier as you passed first weeks/months. If the difficulty curve is opposite, something is wrong.

- get WoTC - it make game much better overall and things like Avatar project more managable (could say it amke it easier at the end of day)

- I know PSI are superuseful but as everything take so long in Legendary idk. I did perfectly well without and get it at time I did not need neither utilized them.

- would add my vote for bluescreen ammo. Make it, take it, use it, love it. Most enemies you need kill badly and fast is vurneable to it. Usualy taking it for all except specialist as I like have healing and hacking bonus at same time.

- sharpshooter gunslinger rocks in damage output, sniper get more in team work (utilize serial skill for example). If you go sniper way it is betetr have 2 so they can supplement each other on disatnt target. I would say most useful class in base x com2 for is grenadier

- For the team composition - if you dont want watch your soldiers dying on status effects (or turn them to chrysalids:-) than specialist with healing is almsot a must. Very improtnatn is phantom ranger for scouting too. So for last 4 positions you want those killing - I would skip psi and took 2-3 grenadiers and 1-2 sharpshooters. So actually something you already had. Worked for me.
Last edited by Včelí medvídek; Feb 19, 2019 @ 5:05pm
xXx PATMANN xXx Feb 20, 2019 @ 2:43pm 
restart..

I used a fair amount of mimic beacons to save my butt. I outfitted at least two or three soldiers to ensure i didnt take any damage at all in a OH SH**T scenario. It will happen on occasion and its not like you can reload a save. I really focused on getting better technology and to do that you need more money since everything is insane expensive on legendary and to get more money you need more contacts... TAKE YOUR TIME.. do not rush this and you wont have any oopsie moments.

as for a team composition

2 rangers focusing on stealth and the shotty

1 sniper with long shot capabilities

2 grenadiers focusing on explosives w. suppression

1 specialist focusing on hacking and attacking bots

then taking out one grenadier with a psi later could even get one more taking out specialist and get A.P rounds or blue screen instead. focus on damage output and you wont have to worry about getting shot at as they are all dead anyways and if you can't possibly kill the rest of them.. or there are some left.. that's where the mimic beacons come into play


Last edited by xXx PATMANN xXx; Feb 20, 2019 @ 2:56pm
ljuba82 Feb 21, 2019 @ 12:07am 
Wow guys, thanks a lot, some really good advice.

I started a new game, mid November now, things are going good, more than 30 missions, only 3 dead soldier (unlucky high cover crit or when I missed 2 90+ % shots in a row), lost only few missions, 2 retaliation missions (won, but didn't save enough civilians), 1 supply raid where I had to bail out cause at the start I encountered 3 pods a time flanking me from all sides despite not moving to new space (the 1st time it happened I think) and one mission where I didn't protect device (5 pods near, shooting at it from back).

Nice advice for snipers, I will try once, but now I have 2 for pure sniping (all left abilities) with spider armor, I prefer that more cause of positioning, more space for good cover for front 4.

As I said, I'm very experienced player in xcom, most of my missions are "flawless", but I can feel things are getting tricky now when sectopods and gatekeepers are in all missions. Maybe it's a time for shifting tactics? That midgame was easy, but now I'm lacking explosives for 5 pods + I have to bring few EMP bombs and bluescreen rounds and enemies have more and more hp. All my grenadiers are base for carpet bombing (salvo, double grenades...), but now i think it's maybe better to retrain them to gunners? I have plasma rifles and plasma weapons for snipers and grenadiers. I still don't have tier 3 armor, but I prefer predator armor cause I have that extra utility item (bringing 3 or even 4 mimic beacons).

About squad rotating, hmmm I don't know guys how you manage to have 20 + soldiers, I know you told me that I had tiny roster, but even now I'm having 15 soldiers, using around 10. Game simply pressure you to rank up soldiers for squad upgrades and later it's hard. Will buy some good soldiers from HQ, but I needed money for weapon upgrades.

Biggest dilemma for me now is squad composition. Ranger is a must for scouting and risk is too high if I don't bring specialist (healing and hacking) although I'm lacking firepower with him. Now I have psi soldier with only 2 skills, but one of them is domination :) so I'm considering bringing him, but as I said, I'm lacking grenades at the end. Also 2 snipers with bluescreen round are very handy...

Also, what is best tactics for avatar project? What I used to do is to intentionally start the timer and wait until only few days before end because timer is restarting again for 25+ days. Is there any negative sides of this tactic?
ljuba82 Feb 21, 2019 @ 12:13am 
Also about those VIP missions, I'm really near decision to skip them. You can't just bail out if something gets wrong. Risk is just to high. Once I tried to sneak past 1st pod I encountered to be faster and to avoid andromedon, but when I was near target extraction they somehow show there, like they know where you are.
ljuba82 Feb 21, 2019 @ 4:47am 
Like I invited bad luck...

1st mission after previous post, VIP mission, reinforcements near extraction and fight with 4 pods, result...3 important soldiers killed, including collonel sniper with "serial", mission successful cause vip extracted grrrrrrrrr

Next mission, retaliation strike, similar situation, mission aborted and another important grenadier gone. Like teleporting bug in xcom 1, I spawn gatekeeper but some of escort had immediate action, like shieldbearer moved and immediately created shields for others.

So, same situation like previous game, december is fatal and I didn't learn from my mistakes, now I have only 4 good soldiers, 1 ranger and sniper and 2 specialists. Also have Psi soldier with domination and psi lance, but he is not as effective yet because of his low psi offense. Others squadies...
Včelí medvídek Feb 21, 2019 @ 7:26am 
its good to learn form own errors:-)

Just would answer the Avatar project question - yep, imho thats best. So as long as you have some facility or story mission that lower progress at hand, you can pretty much ignore it and go to timer where you stop it at last moment possible (first doom timer is few weeks but any other is reseted to 7 days - it never go lower so it is fine do it at alst day/hours possible..). That should give you all time in the world for complete game.

Otherwise for me is hard "go back" to base game to give you much advises - as in WotC you can train additional skills and you are not limited just to selection on each level. But in general I dont overuse explosives though (also for chance of loot) - particularly the enemies you talked about (Sectopod, Gatekeeper..) for me is standard opener for them grenadier with shreding, holo targeting, blue screen and chain shot - that is best because they have huge armor values and with top weapons you can do about 30 dmg this way and delete their armor. Works very good with Repeater addon on weapon as you sometime one hit those big guys. Blue screen also lower their protection to hacking. Having salvo is good (and chain shot is tricky with hit chance) but still I see strategy "grenade them down" as inferior.

Hands down multiple grenadiers is simple best in all (most?:) situations, I personally value spot for grenadier over psi soldiers.
Last edited by Včelí medvídek; Feb 21, 2019 @ 7:38am
Stardustfire Feb 21, 2019 @ 7:58am 
doom counter can restart way lower than 7 days, no idea where you get this info from, onetimes it restarted with 2 days left at commander difficulty for me
Abrakadabra (Banned) Feb 21, 2019 @ 8:09am 
Its not the missions. If you fight 4 pods at a time then youre doing a number of campaing ending mistakes. And even if you trigger 4 unmodded pods, a serial colonel sniper alone can easily take out half or even all 12 enemies if they were hit with aoe dmg before.

By himself.

And thata just one or two soldiers' actions.


You have 6 soldiers though.

Triggering 4 pods means you run right into the middle of multiple pods. Thats what keeps massacring your soldiers.

Its not the mission but a lack of scouting and knowledge how to fight one pod at a time.

thats what keeps killing you. You keep fighting vs many instead of a small number you can handle way easier.

Basically, you get wiped cause you dont know how to use scouts. In xcom 2 scouts are op. Legal and official hack.
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Date Posted: Feb 17, 2019 @ 7:53am
Posts: 44