What triggers the codex to spawn?

[Anime-Profile-Picture]

I've been getting destroyed in this game. Might start again on rookie. I got most of my promoted squad back after they were all injured for a long time. I got the skull jack, equipped it, went on this one mission about destroying some thing or whatever, saw an officer and decided I'd try the skull jacking thing. I do that and then suddenly this codex creature appears and WIPES my team. I probably could have taken it if not for the other forces in the mission. My question is, was it using the skulljack on the officer that caused it to spawn? Or does it show up randomly? Or was it this specific mission? Cuz if its the jack then I can just not do that. I tried reloading a save but its really really old. I've been trying not to save scum but that feels pretty impossible...

[red255]

yes, you hacking into the officer triggered the defense mechanicsm of the codex.

I try to avoid triggering them before bluescreen rounds.

[Stinker]

Flashbangs stop the Codex from splitting upon taking damage. It also takes extra damage from Bluescreen rounds and EMP grenades.

[Anime-Profile-Picture]

Okay good to know. The thing seemed so incredibly powerful I thought it must be a meant to lose scenario. Clearly I need to "level up" more before I can use it. I have to say in the last xcom I felt like there was no reason not to do every objective as soon as I got it, but this game actively punishes you for doing that.

[Karasukan]

Originally posted by Silenthero:

Okay good to know. The thing seemed so incredibly powerful I thought it must be a meant to lose scenario. Clearly I need to "level up" more before I can use it. I have to say in the last xcom I felt like there was no reason not to do every objective as soon as I got it, but this game actively punishes you for doing that.

can you tell the classes of your squad?

[Anime-Profile-Picture]

Originally posted by Menace 1-5 💕:

Originally posted by Silenthero:

Okay good to know. The thing seemed so incredibly powerful I thought it must be a meant to lose scenario. Clearly I need to "level up" more before I can use it. I have to say in the last xcom I felt like there was no reason not to do every objective as soon as I got it, but this game actively punishes you for doing that.

can you tell the classes of your squad?

I think at the time I had a ranger, a grenadier, a specialist and a rookie. I don't remember all the details other than the ranger getting knocked unconcious at the start of the encounter (she was the one that did the jack) then the rest was a blur. Whole team got destroyed by this thing and the remaining forces.

[HazardHawk]

Suggestion, before you use the skulljack, focus on getting rid of the other troops first. You know the Codex is coming, so set up a perimeter around the Captain before you skulljack and put everyone on overwatch, THEN go back to the unit with the skulljack and use it.

[red255]

a codex uses its disable weapons attack first turn so you can kinda ignore it the first turn (unless you split it)

it starts with like 12 HP, it takes damage if it has more than 2 HP after taking damage it splits and each has half the HP of the original, each clone are easily killed with stocks. but that takes actions.

[Karasukan]

Originally posted by Silenthero:

Originally posted by Menace 1-5 💕:

can you tell the classes of your squad?

I think at the time I had a ranger, a grenadier, a specialist and a rookie. I don't remember all the details other than the ranger getting knocked unconcious at the start of the encounter (she was the one that did the jack) then the rest was a blur. Whole team got destroyed by this thing and the remaining forces.

yes your soldier who performs the skulljack will end its turn. I suggest at least use your specialist Gremlin to give him some cover. For that reason if you are still concealed dont skulljack the officer right away. Let him run to some cover first otherwise your soldier will be standing in the wide open.

dont be too afraid of the codex. Just remember she will split each time you do her damage. One will keep standing were she is. The clone will teleport somewhere.

You need the ranger for this. Dont skulljack with the ranger, because you will end his turn and you might need him for dps. Also dont skulljack with the specialist, you might want to use your Gremlin and also be able to take a shot if you want.

So i suggest skulljack with the rookie.

When codex spawns dont attack her if you are unsure you can take her down in this turn. You already lost your turn with the soldier who did the skulljack. Instead spread out a bit. Codex will ALWAYS teleport and do a storm as first attack. A storm is annoying but does no damage, you need to move out the storm. The storm disables your main weapon, but good a ranger can still slash (and walk pretty far) so hope she targets him.

Dont use the ranger to open the first attack on her. Let some other class do it. Move in with 2 soldiers at her. Because if you dont 1 shot her she will split and you need your other soldier to attack the codex who will stay there.

Use your ranger (slash because might have to run far and codex teleports always in ranger/templar melee range) to attack the clone.

Dont use grenades on a codex with many health left. She will take minimal damage and splits, leaving you with another clone.

her second attack will be teleport and a shoot in your back. After that she will do her storm again. And so on.


also if you happend to have the Templar monthly bonus 'Feedback' the Codex will cast herself to death. Watch my video at 11:04 and see Codex cast herself to death https://youtu.be/GaDMdQTNiu0?t=664 . It happens so fast i didnt even realise it.

[mosspit]

Originally posted by Silenthero:

Okay good to know. The thing seemed so incredibly powerful I thought it must be a meant to lose scenario. Clearly I need to "level up" more before I can use it. I have to say in the last xcom I felt like there was no reason not to do every objective as soon as I got it, but this game actively punishes you for doing that.

Exactly, the objectives where the story progresses forward are Golden Path objectives. And Golden Path objectives are taken primarily when

• you are strong enough to move to the next phase and/or want to end the campaign
  
• you want to reduce avatar progress

I am going to assume that you have neither WotC activated nor Alien Hunters activate.

Like what one of the previous posters said, trigger their spawning in regular missions when you have Bluescreen Rounds. It involves MEC autopsy and then completing a Proving Grounds project. After which you can purchase it from the Engineering Bay using supplies. Bluescreen Rounds adds +5 dmg to your weapon attacks against robotic enemies (and reduce Hack Defence but I dont really care for that).

On Veteran/Commander Difficulty a Codex has 12 HP. With typical magnetic/gauss (tier 2) weapons (Gauss Rifle, Gauss Cannon, Shard Gun) and Bluescreen Rounds you can deal 11-13 non-crit dmg that can 1-shot a Codex (which counts as a robotic enemy). Even if you do minimum dmg, it will only have 1 hp and when that happens it can't split. I prefer to use a Sniper as my Codex killer.

[HazardHawk]

I am not sure where the last two commenters are getting their information.

The psionic attack which disables weapons is NOT always the first attack and is not even always used. It is commonly the first attack if you have three units or more bunched together in a way which can be disarmed all at once. Granted, I am only roughly at about 500 hours playtime, but I cannot count the battles where the psionic attack to unload weapons was never used and there were multiple codex present.

Codex requirement to clone is ONLY restricted to taking damage and it doesnt matter how much damage they take as long as still functional. Not 20 minutes past I had one clone with only one HP remaining.

[mosspit]

Originally posted by HazardHawk:

Codex requirement to clone is ONLY restricted to taking damage and it doesnt matter how much damage they take as long as still functional. Not 20 minutes past I had one clone with only one HP remaining.

If this was directed to me, I was referring to the setup of having typical magnetic/gauss (tier 2) weapons (Gauss Rifle, Gauss Cannon, Shard Gun) + Bluescreen Rounds which will deal 11-13 dmg. Minimum non-crit/non-dodged dmg will deal 11 dmg which will leave the Codex with 1 HP on Veteran/Commander difficulty. A 1 HP remaining Codex behaves a little differently. There will be a teleport animation but the Codex will not split into 2.

[Karasukan]

Originally posted by HazardHawk:

I am not sure where the last two commenters are getting their information.

The psionic attack which disables weapons is NOT always the first attack and is not even always used. It is commonly the first attack if you have three units or more bunched together in a way which can be disarmed all at once. Granted, I am only roughly at about 500 hours playtime, but I cannot count the battles where the psionic attack to unload weapons was never used and there were multiple codex present.

Codex requirement to clone is ONLY restricted to taking damage and it doesnt matter how much damage they take as long as still functional. Not 20 minutes past I had one clone with only one HP remaining.

you should get an achievement for codex not using psi attack in countless battles. They do it 100% for me.

[HazardHawk]

Leave 8 tiles between your units and the Codecs will take shots rather than use psionics. They will reserve psionic use for when they catch units grouped closer together.

Also to note, I added the "Not So Fast" mod two weeks ago and am dealing with MANY more Codecs than most people as when you kill a captain or a general they can spawn a Codec. The mod is based in accessing a captain and when you are done a Codec spawns to protect the data. This mod goes one step farther spawning a Codec any time a captain or general is killed by a roll of the dice if it will happen and also an Avatar when a Codex goes down.

Most people will only see up to about 20 Codecs in a game and three avatars. I get hundreds of codecs and dozens of avatars. The only difference in me and you is I have had to learn how to deal with them as there are multiples in every mission for me.

I can also tell you Codecs do not always spawn a clone. They do almost all the time but maybe 1 to 3 in a hundred do not. I am sure there is a reason for it, a set of conditions which influence, but it is rare enough I dont have enough examples. I do know they will spawn with one HP though as I have seen it too many times. But I have noticed using this mod the more HP a unit has when it is killed, the more final HP lost as it dies, the greater the chance it will spawn the next level opponent in the sequence. Killed with only one or two HP remaining is not so likely to spawn a protector, but get up to where the kill shot takes 10 HP and you are almost guaranteed to spawn a protector.

After thinking about it, these are situations which make one of you believe the psionics is always the first move because you always have multiple units within the effect radius and the other thinking the codecs dont spawn a clone with one HP as that is the least likely chance to create a spawn point. Speculating, but that does make sense.

I do not like Legendary difficulty as the balance is wrong so I am playing on Commander and using mods to diversify and create more difficulty. I am a total war player and a RTS player so I have no idea why this game has caught my fancy. Chimera Squad sucks, but XCOM 2 is something else. I tried playing XCOM, but it needs a keyboard to play and I only have a consistently working right hand. I am also a disabled veteran and need to kill blocks of time and XCOM 2 can do that in about 20 to 30 minute blocks. To me, it is like a simplified version of Spellforce 3. Just explaining why my perspective is different...

If you want to be flooded with Codecs and Avatars, try the "Not So Fast" mod. There is a version for Legacy XCOM 2 and XCOM 2 WOTC. Just be warned, 60 units on the board PLUS 8 Codecs which become 8 Avatars is not a walk in the park! It doesnt happen that way often, but late game it does happen. Add in a single King and I am sometimes lucky to escape with one unit remaining and completing the objectives. You wont ever be able to remove that mod once you adjust though as Codecs an Avatars become laughable when there are only 2 Codecs at a time or a single Avatar at a time. BUT you will learn their behavior to be able to survive.

[mosspit]

Some comments

• when you are comparing and discussing game mechanics, the idea is to establish a common ground for discussion. Mods will likely change the game mechanics and therefore there is no point to discuss further. I was referring to WotC vanilla game and would like to keep it as that.
  
• my understanding of the condition of the Codex not splitting if it is left with 1 HP after suffering dmg is accurate. But as mentioned by one of the previous poster, you can also stop the split by disorientating the Codex. If Alien Hunters dlc is activated, freezing via Frost Grenades is also another way to stop Codex cloning.

[HazardHawk]

Originally posted by mosspit:

Some comments

• when you are comparing and discussing game mechanics, the idea is to establish a common ground for discussion. Mods will likely change the game mechanics and therefore there is no point to discuss further. I was referring to WotC vanilla game and would like to keep it as that.
  
• my understanding of the condition of the Codex not splitting if it is left with 1 HP after suffering dmg is accurate. But as mentioned by one of the previous poster, you can also stop the split by disorientating the Codex. If Alien Hunters dlc is activated, freezing via Frost Grenades is also another way to stop Codex cloning.

The mod I mention only adds triggers to spawn. No other changes. Start with a captain and two codecs on a map. Another captain arrives via pod. With both captains killed that brings base total to four Codecs. Codecs get injured but still alive they spawn a clone. There is no minimum in the code short of death. Injured without outright killing which is difficult to do and they all clone, now there is a total of 8 Codecs. The Codecs are still vanilla Codecs. The only change is the death of a captain to trigger is no longer limited to being skulljacked, but any death. Nothing in there changes behavior or method of behavior with the codecs, only that now death of a captain or general causes a spawning of a vanilla Codec the same as if they were skulljacked. Name of the mod is listed above so feel free to download it and take it apart to see for yourself. The only difference is there are more which means more opportunity to see behavior.

By the way, I did not know a frost grenade could stop spawning. I dont use them. I dont use any grenade except for the Frag.