Help with controlling the Avatar Timer.

[SenMithrarin85]

I'm on my first campaign on commander and its rising faster than I can deal with it. I started the game by researching comms and expanding to other regions etc, and held off on other stuff like the proving grounds. I also avoided attacking any alien facilities until the bar maxed out to avoid that notch reduction being wasted. I'm getting mission after mission classed as "very difficult" and my sqaud (though still alive) is getting decimated. I have the engineer healing bonus on the awc which I also built early, but its still not enough. Enemies can take too much damage and there's too many of them. Now I'm seeing the "dodge: grazed" mechanic coming up on nearly every enemy class when before it was just Vipers.

I began on commader because I believe its this game's equivelent of "classic" (which I always played Enemy Within on) but either I'm out of my tactical depth or this game is much harder than the 1st.

What can I do/prioritise to keep the timer under control? I am willing to start again, because I thought I was doing things right (gts, radio, then awc) but maybe the pg should have been built much earlier?

[Pawnman]

tbh, your build seems alright!! Perhaps maybe a little too much prioritization too early on the radio (if by "radio" you mean the Resistance comms building anyway). I find that the Research on "resistance communications" that yields 3 free contacts is enough to get me through the early game. The build order I use is First construct the gts (so that's good), followed by awc (the awc perks that you can potentially get can be a game changer). then once I get the power I grab the pg & my first Resistance comms (Rc). For me when I'm grabbing pg & Rc it tends to happen simultaneously.

As for the Avatar counter, if I may ask when did you do the Blacksite mission?? As soon as you made contact or did you wait til the Doom clock started ticking?? tbh, it's actually ok to let the doom clock tick a little bit IMO, especially with the blacksite mission. When it comes to the avatar counter the only tips I can really give here are;
- Never do a story / Facilty mission unless the Doom clock has started it's countdown.
- Facility Leads can save a campaign for you, having a good hacking specialist is the key to reliably getting these
- If you have a shot at a Facility lead hack, Always take it & make sure you have at least 1 in inventory at all times
I'm not too familiar with how fast the Avatar counter ticks on Commander, but on Legend it is pretty insane. There are a couple of lucky moments I've had where I was able to get a facility lead hack on a 45% (so a 55% chance I lose the campaign, hate these). In my last playthrough on Legend, I had to use a facility lead 3 times to save the campaign!! So sadly it comes down to luck sometimes. But eventually your specialist can get 100% hacks on these cause there usually an objective or security tower.

You mentioned that you're struggling in the tactical game a little bit, from what I can gather from;

Originally posted by SenMithrarin85:

Enemies can take too much damage and there's too many of them. Now I'm seeing the "dodge: grazed" mechanic coming up on nearly every enemy class when before it was just Vipers.

My guess would be that Archons are giving you the most trouble?? A couple neat little tricks to deal with them early on when you first meet them. Archons tend to be the leader of pods at this point in the game. Tbh honest, it's almost better to sometimes leave them alone completely for the first turn you encounter them (now I know this seems counter intuitive, but bare with me). Prioritize their escorts first and if you can't reliably take down the archon in the same turn, which is probably the case! Don't shoot him! If you shoot him and he lives his "battle frenzy" will proc & the archon will gain a mobility boost. He will almost always use this to flank or charge and melee one of your guys. But if you don't proc "battle frenzy" (by not shooting him) As long as he's not incredibly close, archons will almost always use there blazing pinions ability which doesn't hit you right away and is easy to dodge.
Couple other good tactics versus Archons:
- Always lead off with holo targetting.
- Venom/poison status ailment from either the gas grenade or venom rounds works wonders combined with a flashbang. (-40 on there aim)
- Venom rounds on a high level (At least captain) gunslinger wreck Archons. Make sure that aim is high with the aim pcs/holo and 3 shots (Lightning hands + Quickdraw + regular pistol) can almost kill an archon.

Originally posted by SenMithrarin85:

I began on commader because I believe its this game's equivelent of "classic" (which I always played Enemy Within on) but either I'm out of my tactical depth or this game is much harder than the 1st.

And this is the general consensus that most people agree on. I didn't win my first Ironman Legend playthrough either. And on my second try, I won with 5 missions failed & 4 soldier casualties. So even if you're losing a few here and there it's possible to come back.

Hope some of this helps.

[SenMithrarin85]

Originally posted by Pawnman:

tbh, your build seems alright!! Perhaps maybe a little too much prioritization too early on the radio (if by "radio" you mean the Resistance comms building anyway). I find that the Research on "resistance communications" that yields 3 free contacts is enough to get me through the early game. The build order I use is First construct the gts (so that's good), followed by awc (the awc perks that you can potentially get can be a game changer). then once I get the power I grab the pg & my first Resistance comms (Rc). For me when I'm grabbing pg & Rc it tends to happen simultaneously.

As for the Avatar counter, if I may ask when did you do the Blacksite mission?? As soon as you made contact or did you wait til the Doom clock started ticking?? tbh, it's actually ok to let the doom clock tick a little bit IMO, especially with the blacksite mission. When it comes to the avatar counter the only tips I can really give here are;
- Never do a story / Facilty mission unless the Doom clock has started it's countdown.
- Facility Leads can save a campaign for you, having a good hacking specialist is the key to reliably getting these
- If you have a shot at a Facility lead hack, Always take it & make sure you have at least 1 in inventory at all times
I'm not too familiar with how fast the Avatar counter ticks on Commander, but on Legend it is pretty insane. There are a couple of lucky moments I've had where I was able to get a facility lead hack on a 45% (so a 55% chance I lose the campaign, hate these). In my last playthrough on Legend, I had to use a facility lead 3 times to save the campaign!! So sadly it comes down to luck sometimes. But eventually your specialist can get 100% hacks on these cause there usually an objective or security tower.

You mentioned that you're struggling in the tactical game a little bit, from what I can gather from;

Originally posted by SenMithrarin85:

Enemies can take too much damage and there's too many of them. Now I'm seeing the "dodge: grazed" mechanic coming up on nearly every enemy class when before it was just Vipers.

My guess would be that Archons are giving you the most trouble?? A couple neat little tricks to deal with them early on when you first meet them. Archons tend to be the leader of pods at this point in the game. Tbh honest, it's almost better to sometimes leave them alone completely for the first turn you encounter them (now I know this seems counter intuitive, but bare with me). Prioritize their escorts first and if you can't reliably take down the archon in the same turn, which is probably the case! Don't shoot him! If you shoot him and he lives his "battle frenzy" will proc & the archon will gain a mobility boost. He will almost always use this to flank or charge and melee one of your guys. But if you don't proc "battle frenzy" (by not shooting him) As long as he's not incredibly close, archons will almost always use there blazing pinions ability which doesn't hit you right away and is easy to dodge.
Couple other good tactics versus Archons:
- Always lead off with holo targetting.
- Venom/poison status ailment from either the gas grenade or venom rounds works wonders combined with a flashbang. (-40 on there aim)
- Venom rounds on a high level (At least captain) gunslinger wreck Archons. Make sure that aim is high with the aim pcs/holo and 3 shots (Lightning hands + Quickdraw + regular pistol) can almost kill an archon.

Originally posted by SenMithrarin85:

I began on commader because I believe its this game's equivelent of "classic" (which I always played Enemy Within on) but either I'm out of my tactical depth or this game is much harder than the 1st.

And this is the general consensus that most people agree on. I didn't win my first Ironman Legend playthrough either. And on my second try, I won with 5 missions failed & 4 soldier casualties. So even if you're losing a few here and there it's possible to come back.

Hope some of this helps.

That was very informative. Much appreciated!

I didn't attack the blacksite until the doom timer started. Which stopped the clock and got it down one notch. At that point, the PG was only about 10 days old, and all the projects were in the pipeline (plasma grenades, skulljack etc). Not long after, the avatar bar maxed again, and the clock started, forcing me to attack an alien facility.

Do these Red missions only reduce the bar by one segment? It seems a bit harsh considering I had about 3 alien facilities built around the world, and only the means to reach 2 of them. The time to make contact with the others would have exceeded the time left on the doom clock.

I've seen several sites say that the doom timer gives you 20 days or so, but for commander at least its always started at 14 days for me.

Is it better to make contact across different continents or to grab the other segments on your starting one first?

[merccobb]

Avatar pips come in two flavors.

The first kind you get build up on the "Statue" in the middle of the Pacific, and are reduced by completing certain main story-line objectives (which I won't spoil for you here, but they are similar to the Blacksite in that they will either be a special mission or else an objective listed in a mission).

The second flavor are the alien facilities, which always start with one pip and will add pips over time. When you sabotage a facility, it removes exactly as many pips as it had accumulated.

Both types of pips are identical for purposes of filling the bar. On Commander, I think you get between 12-20 days randomly for your first countdown once the bar is filled. For subsequent fillings, the clock either starts where it left off the last time or resets to 7 days (whichever is greater.)

It is therefore imperative that you always have an option to knock the bar down within about 7 days. Prioritize expansion of your contacts towards regions where facilities pop up, or where missions prompted by the Shadow Chamber research projects pop up. Never do one of these missions until the avatar bar is full, and the counter is nearly done (give yourself about a day or so to travel to and complete the mission.)

Once again, I don't want to spoil anything for you but I think some general guidance on the story-line can be good here:

-Use the Blacksite as your first bar reduction
-Get the Proving Ground up fast enough (I either build it second or immediately after the first power expansion) and the Skulljack researched, it will give you an objective which can be completed in nearly any mission that will result in the bar being reduced. Again, if possible, delay using this until the bar fills again.
-Following from the Blacksite and the results of the Skulljacking, using the Shadow Chamber to advance through the story objectives will open up two more missions and one more Jacking objective that will help you reduce the bar.
-Use Facility missions only if one of these story objectives is not available to you. By letting Facilities build up several pips, you can actually buy yourself several months of reprieve by knocking off one 3-4 pip facility. Also, only use a Facility Lead if you do not already have a facility you can reach through normal means, as these can really save you in tight spots. Just make sure you have enough intel to research the lead!

On Commander and Legend, the first few months trying to keep the bar from progressing are the hardest, as you sometimes need to dedicate resources and technology to things that will delay your tactical goals. But once you reach the midgame and have magnetics and plate researched, you should have plenty of options to keep the bar under control and you will start to snowball from there.

Final tip: there is no shame in playing through a campaign on Veteran (or even Rookie!) to get a handle on some of the more non-intuitive mechanics, it can really help in formualating a strategy for the harder difficulties if you know how things work!